Jump to content
IGNORED

Tips for squaring the club face


Note: This thread is 1318 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

Hi all

i have recently come back to playing golf after a break and just wondered if anyone could give me a few tips on a couple of problems that I have.

i am right handed, I have always had a tendency to push the ball out right and sometimes slice with woods, I say sometimes because I can hit a perfectly straight shot with woods but more often than not it goes right and if I try and accommodate the push it seems to accentuate the problem, I can hit my irons fine, I have a set of Callaway Razr X Tour irons which don’t have much offset and I’m really happy with them, my go to club is a 4 iron if I’m struggling to get off the tee. I have checked my stance and I have had others check my aim and stance and I’m pretty good, I’m not aiming left, so I’m thinking it’s either swing plane or squaring the club face at impact, I just wondered if anyone has any tips or drills for either that would help.

thanks in advance.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Welcome to TST @Chipster

There are several causes which lead to the push/slice.
While members can suggest ideas and discuss the causes, the real issue would be to start at the root of the cause.
I would suggest you start a "My Swing" thread and post several videos of your swing.
Best to show a couple of swings with mid/long irons and woods or driver.

Without seeing the ball flight and impact positions, it's difficult to make any suggestions which pinpoint your situation. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

1 hour ago, Club Rat said:

Welcome to TST @Chipster

There are several causes which lead to the push/slice.
While members can suggest ideas and discuss the causes, the real issue would be to start at the root of the cause.
I would suggest you start a "My Swing" thread and post several videos of your swing.
Best to show a couple of swings with mid/long irons and woods or driver.

Without seeing the ball flight and impact positions, it's difficult to make any suggestions which pinpoint your situation. 

Thanks @Club Rat, appreciate the advice and the welcome

52 minutes ago, dennyjones said:

Welcome to TST.   @Club Rat has given you some great advice.   Read, ask question and post often.   You'll find there isn't a better place to talk golf.  

check out this thread

TST Instructional content

Thanks @dennyjones, some great information on that link 

Link to post
Share on other sites

This is a good excuse to make sure I understand the ball fight laws (every time I think of them, I get a headache). I usually have to think in terms of ping pong to sort things out.

The initial direction of the ball is associated with the angle of the paddle/club face.

A push-slice starts out to the right (assuming a right handed golfer) so the club face is angled open at impact.

When a ball is spins clockwise, it curves to the right. To achieve this in ping pong, you hit the ball with a right to left motion, which imparts a clockwise spin.

So, our friend with the push slice is (1) has an open club face at the time of impact, and (2) his club head is traveling in an right to left direction at the time of impact.

But...he also complains about a push-straight shot. 

To hit a ping pong ball straight to the right, you angle the paddle to the right, but you don't use a sideways motion when hitting the ball. The paddle approaches directly from behind the ball.

So, our friends push-strait shot means he (1) has an open club face at impact and (2) the club is traveling in the exact same path as the ball flight at impact. 

The push-slice scenario would seem to indicate he has an outside-in swing path (to produce the right to left motion that imparts a counter clockwise rotation).

The push-straight scenario would seem to indicate he has an inside out swing path (which matches the face angle to produce zero sideways spin).

And right about now is when I usually get a headache.

How can he alternatively have an outside-in then an inside-out swing path? I can't see how he could be that inconsistent. Is there someway he could have an inside-out swing path and still impart a clockwise spin on the ball?

 

  • Informative 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

All golf swings are an arc that goes around the player, not a straight line.

Is it possible the OP is catching the ball just at the time on the swing arc is club transitioning from an inside out trajectory to a straight down the line trajectory?

If the club is still on the early part of the arc at the time of impact (the still slightly inside-out path that matches the club face angle), it would produce the push-straight shot.

If the club is a little further along on the arc and has reached the point where it is traveling straight in line with the target, with an open club face, this would produce a clockwise rotation, and thus a push-slice.

If his impact point is right about the transition point on the arc between these two, it would account for the two different ball flights (straight or slice) yet would also produce a fairly consistent  initial ball flight (push).

(I think I have a headache.)

If this analysis is right, he is impacting the ball too late in his swing arc. If he impacted the ball earlier in his swing he would still have the push, but he would also put a counter-clockwise spin on the ball causing it to curve to the left, giving him a push-draw. 

(I  definitely I have a headache.)

 

Edited by Lime Shark
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Administrator
58 minutes ago, Lime Shark said:

This is a good excuse to make sure I understand the ball fight laws (every time I think of them, I get a headache). I usually have to think in terms of ping pong to sort things out.

That's odd. Table tennis is a bad example because, depending on the composition of your paddle, the rubbers, the foam backing, etc. you can actually pull the ball with the path quite a bit - more so than the face. Table tennis is thus a really bad example.

The ball flight laws are pretty damn simple, really:

The ball starts generally in the direction the face is pointing, and curves away from the path.

Face at 0°, path 5° left, ball starts barely left of the target and then curves right (away from the path that is left).

Simple.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

6 minutes ago, iacas said:

 

Face at 0°, path 5° left, ball starts barely left of the target and then curves right (away from the path that is left).

Simple.

So this ball curves to the right, because it has a clockwise spin?

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Administrator
12 minutes ago, Lime Shark said:

So this ball curves to the right, because it has a clockwise spin?

It’s still mostly backspin. But the axis is tilted slightly to the right, yes.

19 minutes ago, iacas said:

The ball starts generally in the direction the face is pointing, and curves away from the path.

That’s all you need to know.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

30 minutes ago, Lime Shark said:

So this ball curves to the right, because it has a clockwise spin?

It's like a major league curve ball.  The ball curves because of wind resistance.  The spin causes one side of the ball to be going faster than the other side of the ball.  The side that is spinning forward, towards home plate, has more wind resistance than the other side of the ball.  Therefore the air gives it a push to the side.  So it curves.  Clockwise spin- ball curves to the right. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
13 minutes ago, Marty2019 said:

It's like a major league curve ball.  The ball curves because of wind resistance.  The spin causes one side of the ball to be going faster than the other side of the ball.  The side that is spinning forward, towards home plate, has more wind resistance than the other side of the ball.  Therefore the air gives it a push to the side.  So it curves.  Clockwise spin- ball curves to the right. 

It's kinda the opposite, actually. The side which is spinning away from the direction of travel, the "faster" side, provides the lift. The other side doesn't provide the "push."

You can look up Bernoulli and Magnus effects. Little OT for this topic, so, I tried to be brief.

Baseball works the same way. It's about the side that's going faster, like an airplane wing. Not the slower side "pushing" anything (except that it obviously helps slow that side down, so the other side can be going even faster relatively).

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
7 minutes ago, Club Rat said:

@iacas 

going back to the OP, would it be best to correct the swing path via lessons or could he work out the swing on his own IE: drills, fundamentals, suggestions, etc?

Would generally need to see a swing before I have any idea what drill or drills would work for him.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

13 hours ago, iacas said:

It's kinda the opposite, actually. The side which is spinning away from the direction of travel, the "faster" side, provides the lift. The other side doesn't provide the "push."

You can look up Bernoulli and Magnus effects. Little OT for this topic, so, I tried to be brief.

Baseball works the same way. It's about the side that's going faster, like an airplane wing. Not the slower side "pushing" anything (except that it obviously helps slow that side down, so the other side can be going even faster relatively).

It sounds like we're saying the same thing. 

http://www.humankinetics.com/excerpts/excerpts/magnus-effect-

"The Magnus effect operates in the following manner. As a spinning ball moves through the air, it spins a boundary layer of air that clings to its surface as it travels along. On one side of the ball the boundary layer of air collides with air passing by. The collision causes the air to decelerate, creating a high-pressure area. On the opposing side, the boundary layer is moving in the same direction as the air passing by, so there is no collision and the air collectively moves faster. This sets up a low-pressure area. The pressure differential, high on one side and low on the other, creates a lift force (the Magnus force) that causes the ball to move in the direction of the pressure differential (i.e., from high to low)"

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks for all of the advice, I have paid another visit to the driving range and experimented a little, I think I may have been going back without enough shoulder turn so I made a point of turning more and keeping my arms straighter on the start of my backswing to try and give me more width and the results were better, I still have it in me to push one out right, I’ll try and take some decent video footage of my swing and put it up on site at some point.

Link to post
Share on other sites

As I was working on my pull/snap hook, the new Pro came down the range to chat and introduce himself. We chatted a bit about what I was working on and gave me a little drill to work on. Take a normal grip with the right hand, then put your left hand FLAT on the grip in about the normal position with the back of the hand facing the aiming point. Then take some practice swings trying to bring the back of the hand square to the impact. Short swings at first just to get the feel. work your way up as you get comfortable with it.

You can use a video camera to see where the hand is facing at impact. Easier to spot with the palm flat

When you take a proper grip, think about PULLING the left hand through to square from the inside instead of pushing with the right.

Helped me a bit anyways. no more real bad snap/duck hooks. (unless I really screw up and forget everything)

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, RayG said:

As I was working on my pull/snap hook, the new Pro came down the range to chat and introduce himself. We chatted a bit about what I was working on and gave me a little drill to work on. Take a normal grip with the right hand, then put your left hand FLAT on the grip in about the normal position with the back of the hand facing the aiming point. Then take some practice swings trying to bring the back of the hand square to the impact. Short swings at first just to get the feel. work your way up as you get comfortable with it.

You can use a video camera to see where the hand is facing at impact. Easier to spot with the palm flat

When you take a proper grip, think about PULLING the left hand through to square from the inside instead of pushing with the right.

Helped me a bit anyways. no more real bad snap/duck hooks. (unless I really screw up and forget everything)

 

Thanks Ray, that’s a good tip, I’ll try that next time I’m at the range 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I played today, tried to implement a couple of changes into my swing, particularly with the driver, these were to keep my arms straighter on the backswing to give me more width, turn my shoulders more and try not to flip at the ball,  it gave me more length from the driver off the tee but I’m still pushing out to the right and I don’t seem able to allow for it either. Unfortunately this caused me to lose my rythym with my go to club which is the 4i, which meant I wasn’t striking my low to mid irons very well at all, strangely though I scored quite well today because my pitching was really good although I felt my overall game wasn’t good enough, more practice required I think.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Note: This thread is 1318 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • Support TST Affiliates

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    Whoop
    SuperSpeed
    FlightScope Mevo
    Use the code "iacas" for 10% off Mevo and the code "iacasjun21" for 10% off SuperSpeed.
  • Posts

    • At the moment I turn my hips by rotating my pelvis clockwise, but would it be better to rotate your hips by lowering your left knee, causing the right hip to rotate backwords?   Or is this an inferior method to using your pelvis to rotate your hips?   Reason I ask is because when I use my pelvis I often experience reverse pivot of my upper spine at the end of the backswing, because my pelvis isn't rotating straight across when I reach the end of the backswing, I'm shifting it which is putting it out of line, causing the upper spine to go out of line  
    • Wisconsin Trip Composite Course Hole #1 - Sand Valley  This was the best starting hole of the four courses. SV #1 is a drivable par 4 for some, but one were driver can give you an easy pitch or a putt for eagle, but also put you in a really nasty spot. A 3-wood off the tee leaves you with a difficult 2nd short shot to the green due to the green complex. I really like this hole.  Hole #2 - Mammoth Dunes A solid par 4 with a wide landing area off the tee, but a bunker in the fairway to challenge the direct angle to the green. I think LLB #2 is just a bad hole. Sand Valley #2 is just not enjoyable because of how penalizing it is to miss the green anywhere but short.  Hole #3 - Sand Valley I like this par 3, it has a lot of variety in pin positions. If the pin is left, you can challenge it or end up in a very nasty lie left or bail out right. This was close with MD #3, a good par 5 where you can challenge the hole on the left to cut some distance off your 2nd shot.  Hole #4 - Sand Valley An OK par 5, but its really that the other holes were not as strong as this one. They were all par 3's, but non of them were all that interesting.  Hole #5 - Sand Valley This is a really good downhill par 3. It's not a long par 3, and the green his huge, but with a lot of contour. The wind can swirl a bit making the shot selection difficult. I like the view and challenge of this par 3. Hole #6 - Lawsonia  A nice long par 4 with a difficult 2nd down hill, to a green with a false front. I like this hole, a solid straight forward par 4. I think if the tees at Sand Valley allowed you to see the entire fairway to the left, it would take this spot.  Hole #7 - Sand Valley This might be a controversial pick for some, but I liked this par 5. You do have to check the yardages, but you either challenge the hole with a driver, and have a view of the green where you can challenge carrying the long bunker, or you can lay back off the tee and then play out to the right for your 2nd shot. It is a hole that you need to play once to realize how far right you can go.  Hole #8 - Sand Valley  A par 3 up the hill, that is protected left and short. The green has some big contours. It's a nice difficult short par 3.  Hole #9 - Lawsonia  This is a nice par 5, where you actually get to see the hole from the tee box. You have to challenge the hole on the right to have a shot of getting near the green in two, but with it being a dog leg right, there is plenty of landing area off the tee.  Hole #10 - Mammoth Dunes This was a tough decision between MD and SV. I went with MD because I liked the challenge of this short par 4 that has a tricky 2nd shot to the green. You can challenge the green off the tee, but you will be left with a tough short game shot. If you lay back, then the approach shot is also difficult. SV is a good par 5 that is reachable in two, but for me the drive is not interesting. Honestly, this is close to a toss up for me.  Hole #11 - Lawsonia This is just a solid par 5. With a good tee shot, you have a great chance at going at this green in two, which is large, but protected by three bunkers.  Hole #12 - Sand Valley I really like this par 5. It's a split fairway par 5, where the landing area for most will be a wide area. You just have to miss the two trees that split the fairway. The fairway to the left is elevated giving you a great look of the hole. If you have the distance, you can challenge the gap between the two bunkers that constrict the fairway where they meet up. There is a nice bank to the left of the green that funnels shots back to the green.  Hole #13 - Lawsonia I like this par 5 because if you hit a great 2nd shot you can reach the green in two, or come up just short for an easy pitch. If you miss hit the 2nd shot you will hit a big bank and funnel back down into a small valley about 80-120 yards short of the green. Then you will have a tricky 3rd shot. A good challenging longer par 5.  Hole #14 - Mammoth Dunes This is a good short par 4, with a good drive you can challenge the front of the green. The bunker blocks the line to the green and forces a good strike. You can lay up short left which leaves you with a more blind shot to the green, but a flat lie. You can lay up right, have a clear look at the green, but maybe get a more challenging lie for your 2nd shot. The green is large, with a slight backstop to the left to catch errant shots.   Hole #15 - Lawsonia I like this par 4, it requires a good drive to have a short iron into a small green that is tucked back to the right. It is a good mix of hitting a good line off the tee to get a good angle to a smaller green. A nice challenging shorter par 4.  Hole #16 - Sand Valley I really like this par 4. The bunker challenges you off the tee to hit a great shot to have a mid iron into the green. If you clear the bunker, there is a big slope the rewards you with extra yardage. You have a line left of the bunker that is super aggressive. You can lay back right, but have a long iron into the green. The green is pretty large with bail out areas left and slightly long left. A bunker protects the front right. Any shot that ends up short is a very tricky pitch shot. Just a really challenging, and rewarding par 4.  Hole #17 - Mammoth  Mostly, I went with Mammoth because it was a par 4, and it was the better par 4 over Lawsonia. This was probably the weakest collection of holes over the four courses. SV par 3 was interesting at first, but I wish you could see the green. LLB par 3 is just a generic mid range par 3.  Hole #18 - Sand Valley If it wasn't for SV having one of the best finishing holes I've played in a long time, this would be extremely hard to pick. At SV, the finishing hole is a visually stunning par 5 up the hill. You have to navigate bunkers in the middle of the fairway, and bunkers that encroach on the right and left side. You can lay back to a wider landing area, or hit driver to make this a reachable par 5. The 2nd shot is tricky with a boomerang shaped green that lets you funnel a cut off some slopes. Right is a very difficult bunker shot. Just enough risk to make you think about going for it in two. Just a fantastic finishing hole.  Sand Valley - 9, Mammoth - 4, Lawsonia - 5, LLB - 0 Overall, Sand Valley took half of the holes for me. Lawsonia came in 2nd, but because the last 10 golf holes are very strong contenders. LLB didn't get picked, mostly because a lot of their holes were just OK to golf, but their very good holes got out shined by the other courses.   
    • Day 281: Played 18 this morning. Driver, for the most part, was excellent. Made a slight change in my backswing that we worked on in Erie with the head less out at A2. Combined it with the long, slow high feel.   Wedges were coming out low, so I went to the range after to work on that. 
    • Yeah…but that’s what he wants! Lol. He mentions slicing the ball outta the range but somehow thinks that will translate to getting someone to rotate through to get that face square. I didn’t re-watch in slow motion but I’d bet he’s not even doing what the thinks he’s doing.
    • Another 75 today. I've been playing my best golf ever my last 4 rounds I've gone +3, +4, +3, +3. It has been a consistent flow of the rounds though. I get off to a bad first 3-4 holes and wind up a few over par, get super hot make a bunch of birdies and fight back to even par or better, then the last few holes I fall apart. Just need to clean some stuff up, hit more fairways, make a few more par saving putts and I'm right there. One of my goals for the year was to have an under par round I think it's just a matter of time I need to just keep pushing. The putting work I've been doing recently has definitely helped a ton not that long ago my career high was 3 birdies but the last 4 rounds I've had 5 in two, 4 in another, and 2 in the last so that is confidence inspiring. 
  • Today's Birthdays

    1. ercxi
      ercxi
      (33 years old)
    2. Garea51
      Garea51
      (70 years old)
    3. iamwardicus
      iamwardicus
      (37 years old)

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...