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Would you Rather Lead or Come from Behind?


mvmac
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  1. 1. Do you prefer to Lead or Come from Behind?

    • Lead
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    • Come From Behind
      6


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A couple weeks ago at Bethpage Black, Nick Watney started the final round two shots behind Sergio Garcia and ended up winning.  This was the 24th come-from-behind winner on the PGA Tour this year.  A third round leader has won only 13 times in 2012.

What would you prefer, to start the final round in the lead or chase the leader?

Is it the same as if you were playing in your local amateur tournament, club championship or betting with your buddies?

Obviously it depends on how big the lead is, so assume for the sake of discussion, the lead is no more than 4 strokes ;-)

Mike McLoughlin

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Everyone should want to be in the lead. Wanting to be in second, wanting other players to have played less shots than you or wishing that your score was higher. Well, that doesn't make sense to me.

As for the psychology of leading that is a matter in itself. If you can't handle being in the lead, the solution is not to hope to be in the chasing pack but rather to work at controlling yourself when front running, to develop a superior strategy etc. And if you are playing the shots to put yourself in the lead in the first place then I don't see that anyone should have any problems.

Of course it is just a fact of golf that being in the lead or being second for that matter doesn't particularly matter as the guy who lies 5th can shoot a 64/5 and usurp those ahead of him who may even card respectable 68/9s etc.

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Originally Posted by Pakoh

there is more pressure on the leader... ask Jim Furyk. and Adam Scott...



Keeping a lead has a lot of pressure. But so does catching up when your behind.

I would rather lead. Coming from behind gets worse as you make bad shots and start to realize that the odds of doing so are getting lower....

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the leader is expected to stay in front. 2nd place is not expected to overtake 1st... but it happens.

if your behind you can just play your game and let the chips fall where they may.

if you mess up, then oh well... you were not expected to win anyway.

if you mess up as the leader,  then the pressure gets worse and worse. (Mcilroy at last years masters)

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Originally Posted by Pakoh

there is more pressure on the leader... ask Jim Furyk. and Adam Scott...

I would be interested to know how many times a player in 2nd finished lower after the final round this year? 24+?

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Originally Posted by brgolf

I would be interested to know how many times a player in 2nd finished lower after the final round this year? 24+?


or how many times did the leader blow it in the final round?

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Originally Posted by mvmac

This was the 24th come-from-behind winner on the PGA Tour this year.  A third round leader has won only 13 times in 2012.

i guess its good to read the entire post :)

so 13 vs 24... seems like the come from behind players are doing better then the leaders eh?

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Originally Posted by Pakoh

i guess its good to read the entire post :)

so 13 vs 24... seems like the come from behind players are doing better then the leaders eh?

Exactly.  Also the leaders didn't necessarily blow it in every case, some guys just got beat.  It would be interesting to see stats from other years, I would assume third round leaders had a pretty good winning percentage.

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Originally Posted by Pakoh

there is more pressure on the leader... ask Jim Furyk. and Adam Scott...

Not as much pressure on people who are having to make birdies or hoping for others to fail.

I would rather control my own destiny.

The question is basicslly asking if you'd rather be a few shots worse than you are. A ludicrous proposition.

In the race of life, always back self-interest. At least you know it's trying.

 

 

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Exactly.  Also the leaders didn't necessarily blow it in every case, some guys just got beat.  It would be interesting to see stats from other years, I would assume third round leaders had a pretty good winning percentage.

I think this is the key. I don't have the numbers, but I'd assume that after the third round, the win percentage goes down as your 54-hole place goes up. For example (making up numbers here), maybe the guy in 1st has a 30% win rate, the guy in 2nd is 25%, the guy in 3rd is 20%, the guy in 4th is 15%, etc. Put this way: at every tournament there are several guys who could conceivable come from behind, but only one guy who could hold the 54-hole lead and win (setting aside ties). So when you add up the win percentage for the guy in 2nd after 54, the guy in 3rd after 54, the guy in 4th after 54, etc., it stands to reason that is would eclipse the win percentage of the guy in 1st after 54.

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Originally Posted by Pakoh

Quote:

Originally Posted by brgolf

I would be interested to know how many times a player in 2nd finished lower after the final round this year? 24+?

or how many times did the leader blow it in the final round?

That actually means nothing.  You logic doesn't take all of the factors into consideration.  How often does a player have just one exceptional round in a 4 day event?  It all comes down to who among the leaders has the best exceptional round.  If I start out slightly behind and have a banner day on the final round then I have a reasonable chance to win..... of course that is only if my banner day is better than anyone else's banner day for that round.  If the leader also has his exceptional round the same day, then he will probably win.

Another factor is who is in the lead - whether or not the 3rd round leader has played in that position before and has learned to deal with the pressure and adrenaline. It's rare for a first time third round leader to pull off the win unless he is either not challenged, or he has a nearly insurmountable lead.

Rick

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Mentally I'd prefer to chase down the leader and come from behind rather than head into the final day in the lead.  Having the lead could cause me to play conservatively.  I'd be so concerned about making a crucial mistake I'd be more tense and more likely to make one.

The day after the tournament I think it would be easier to live with not catching the leader and finishing 2nd versus blowing the lead and finishing 2nd.

Joe Paradiso

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With the swing problems I've had the last couple of years, I'd be happy just to make the cut. Then, next season I'll think about winning.

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Lead. Would be able to play it safe if I wanted to.. instead of HAVING to go for it to catch up to the leader.

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Originally Posted by Pakoh

i guess its good to read the entire post :)

so 13 vs 24... seems like the come from behind players are doing better then the leaders eh?


Yea I kind of figured you had missed that line. Still think you are missing a trick here. If there are 10 people in the pack and 1 shoots a 65 to win then being in the chase was of no advantage to 9 people. That is why I am asking how many people in 2nd stayed there or finished lower?

13:24 is an amazing conversion rate from the lead.

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Note: This thread is 4218 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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