Skeptical of reported distances

[RichF]

because of the examples like

Exactly...it's the same on tennis forums with guys saying they can serve 120mph 1st serves.

And furthermore, isn't it funny how no-one posts any videos of their 175 yard 8-irons or 230 yard 4-irons!

[TheNatural]

230 4 i?

well ill post my 220 5i!

You see the problem is... I cant hit a 4i!!!

[bsettle]

yeah, i dont know why some people think so poorly of higher lofted drivers. i read somewhere that the ideal driver loft for the typical amateur should be around 12º. i am not one to judge anyone when it comes to what loft driver they are using. but like you said, ive seen many people make comments about that

I think you may be mistaken about the optimal driver loft. The optimal driver LAUNCH ANGLE is 12 degrees, not loft. if you are hitting a 12 degree driver (which is fine, hit what makes you better), unless you are making poor contact or have the ball way too far back in your stance, you are probably launching the ball closer to 16-18 degrees. Which is much higher than optimal, which only means your are probably losing distance and roll, but I know guys that just like to hit the ball high so they have always carried 10.5 drivers.

[timwalsh300]

MOST people cant hit it that far, but THINK they do. the guys who can hit a 300 yard drive ON AVERAGE are few and far between (like you said, you are in that low percentile that can). but on the internet forums they are everywhere.

Exactly...it's the same on tennis forums with guys saying they can serve 120mph 1st serves.

I actually I don't think is so hard to believe. If you are going to spend time on an internet forum for golf or tennis or any other sport, chances are that you take your sport more seriously than the average weekend-warrior. It makes sense that we don't have a good random sampling of the total golf population here at The Sand Trap; we are

bound to have a lot more low handicappers and long hitters than you'll see on the average golf course. This is simply a phenomenon of selection bias. That said, I think people have a different definition of "average distance." My "average distance" with my driver when I hit it pure might be 260 carry, 280 with bounce/roll. That sounds great, but I might only hit it pure 1/2 of the time. The rest are 150-yard hooks or slices out of bounds which would greatly skew the average. Skewed results would make my real average a pretty useless statistic. I still have to play as if I'm going to hit the ball 280. So if you ask me how far I hit it, that's what I will tell you. Tim

[TN94z]

I think you may be mistaken about the optimal driver loft. The optimal driver LAUNCH ANGLE is 12 degrees, not loft. if you are hitting a 12 degree driver (which is fine, hit what makes you better), unless you are making poor contact or have the ball way too far back in your stance, you are probably launching the ball closer to 16-18 degrees. Which is much higher than optimal, which only means your are probably losing distance and roll, but I know guys that just like to hit the ball high so they have always carried 10.5 drivers.

I read last year where Justin Leonard switched to a 10.5* driver because he hit it much better....and he is a Pro.

[Leftygolfer]

260 carry is easy for me.but i fall into a low percentage of golfers that can bomb a ball,why does everyone on this forum call b.s when someone claims tour-like distance?

This the longest guy on the other tour? What is this proving.

And there are alot of long players who play 10.5. Not the norm, but not rare. I don't doubt that some can carry it 260. I can not. I can hit it 260 with a normal swing but I can only carry it 240, 250 max. I am not a short nor long hitter. I am a lot longer than the average hack but I am shorter than the average scratch player.

[iWALK18]

I actually I don't think is so hard to believe. If you are going to spend time on an internet forum for golf or tennis or any other sport, chances are that you take your sport more seriously than the average weekend-warrior. It makes sense that we don't have a good random sampling of the total golf population here at The Sand Trap; we are

This is a really good point. It kindof reminds me of standing on the tee box and seeing guys 270 yards down the fairway. I have to wait for them, because I hit my driver that far. But that doesn't mean I'm going to hit a good shot and reach them... in fact I generally wont.

[TN94z]

260 carry is easy for me.but i fall into a low percentage of golfers that can bomb a ball,why does everyone on this forum call b.s when someone claims tour-like distance?

The biggest problem most people have is when someone says they average say 290 or something. I'm sure there are many guys that can hit the ball 300, I have a friend that does it quite a bit. But when you throw in the word average, then that is a totally different ball game. I actually averaged my drives in my last 9 hole round. I had some 270s, etc...but after I averaged everything, it came out to like 256!! Now I am not a LONG ball hitter as far as this forum is concerned, but I am longer than most of the guys I play with who will tell you they average 270.

[Leftygolfer]

The biggest problem most people have is when someone says they average say 290 or something. I'm sure there are many guys that can hit the ball 300, I have a friend that does it quite a bit. But when you throw in the word average, then that is a totally different ball game.

Averaging that you really are a long player and consistant. That is a great average. I am pretty sure that 9 out 10 players on this forum do not average that. I know I don't.

[iacas]

This thread is still going on?

[TN94z]

Averaging that you really are a long player and consistant. That is a great average. I am pretty sure that 9 out 10 players on this forum do not average that. I know I don't.

I used my skycaddie and marked every tee shot, no matter if it was a driver or 3W, uphill, or downhill, wind or no wind....this thread just got me wondering what my actual "average" is. I was pretty pleased. I had one drive of 273 that really bumped up the average, but it was the only one that I really pushed on and caught really solid. Hopefully, my swing changes will add some more distance to those totals.

[wachesawgolfer]

I agree the ideal driver loft for most golfers is 12 or even 13 degrees because of their swingspeeds and launch angles, but the problem is most drivers in these lofts, off the rack, come with A shafts and are too whippy and soft to help the average golfer.

[RocketSauce]

I think you may be mistaken about the optimal driver loft. The optimal driver LAUNCH ANGLE is 12 degrees, not loft. if you are hitting a 12 degree driver (which is fine, hit what makes you better), unless you are making poor contact or have the ball way too far back in your stance, you are probably launching the ball closer to 16-18 degrees. Which is much higher than optimal, which only means your are probably losing distance and roll, but I know guys that just like to hit the ball high so they have always carried 10.5 drivers.

no, im not mistaken about what ive read. i read that the AVERAGE MALE AMATUER GOLFER has a swing speed of 85-90mph and the OPTIMAL LOFT of the driver for someone who falls into this area is between 12º - 13º.

http://www.golfengineering.net/Driverloft.htm THEY might be mistaken, but im not mistaken about what i read...

[Leftygolfer]

I used my skycaddie and marked every tee shot, no matter if it was a driver or 3W, uphill, or downhill, wind or no wind....this thread just got me wondering what my actual "average" is. I was pretty pleased. I had one drive of 273 that really bumped up the average, but it was the only one that I really pushed on and caught really solid. Hopefully, my swing changes will add some more distance to those totals.

That is an impressive driving day for almost anyone. I wasn't doubting you by any means. I really think that is impressive to average that.

[bunkerputt]

This thread is still going on?

It's a sensitive topic that everyone has some investment in

Regarding driver lofts... After re-reading my post, I see where the confusion came in. I mis-spoke and said "not any", where I meant "not many". My comments about not many long players playing a driver loft > 10 degrees were going based on an assumption that many more players hitting it 300+ yards have drivers less than 10* than those greater than 10. This isn't based on real research, however. I was mainly going based on the 10 or so examples I had in my head: (Tiger woods (8.5), Adam Scott (9.5), Jamie Sadlowski ~7, Jason Zuback ~7, etc.), combined with a general comment I had read regarding lower lofts producing less spin. But you are certainly right that what really matters is launch angle combined with spin rate. If 10.5 degrees gets you into that optimal zone, then go for it. All that really means is that your normal positive attack angle is somewhere around 2 degrees (very good), vs Tiger and Adam at around 4 degrees, to come to a somewhat optimal launch (though regarding distance, most tour players generally launch the driver "suboptimally" i.e. lower for maximum control). Saying anything over 10 degrees is "wussy" is foolishness that betrays an ignorance of golf swing dynamics, and was certainly not my intent. As an example to confirm your case, Nick watney uses a 10.5 and he's 5th on tour in driving distance.