Creating a deep lag...what should one be "feeling"?

[majorchamp]

  senorchipotle said:

i've found that no matter how perfect everything else in your swing is, the only thing that makes you flip is your right wrist. i'd try and sort that out first. what i like to feel is that my right palm is pushing the ball down into the ground in the direction of my target.

I still like my "drive the butt of the club at the ball" idea :) though the right palm definitely gives the same idea.

  alo1984 said:

MC: You sir with all of your threads and your obsessing have inspired me. I've done pretty well with my Daly-esque over swing and my complete reliance on timing my release to make good contact. But, yesterday I played a round and felt as if I was missing with glancing blows or swinging across the ball rather than hitting through the ball. For a few weeks I've been following your crusade for more lag and am convinced that the positions you are seeking are exactly what I need.

haha....come join me on my journey to the worlds most perfect lag :)

At this point..I don't think my hip movement is really an issue. I watch video after video..and regarding my lag, I think its more to do with "when" I begin my downswing and simply 10 years of bad form with my downswing and weak wrists/forearms then anything. The more I work on re-creating lag..even if its short 1/4 swings from the top of my swing to my hip, the more I realize I need to work very very hard on it

  golfro said:

sick lag dude...I love it.

[nevets88]

  golfro said:

i actually have no idea. i've only been to that range once and used grass for irons too. dude behind me seems to like the matts over grass lol

I went to a short game practice area the other day and of the three huge grass hitting areas one guy went to one of three mats and they were the old carpet kind.

[deronsizemore]

  golfro said:

Dude behind me seems to like the matts over grass lol

Don't know how good of a golfer the guy behind you is, but most higher handicap golfers like mats becasue they mask your bad shots. You can hit three inches behind the ball on a mat and still hit it like normal after the club bounces up into the ball.

[golfro]

  deronsizemore said:

Don't know how good of a golfer the guy behind you is, but most higher handicap golfers like mats becasue they mask your bad shots. You can hit three inches behind the ball on a mat and still hit it like normal after the club bounces up into the ball.

Yeah, that place is just about the only grass range around here. And its a 40 min drive from my house.

I golf mainly on matts because thats whats available but a good drill i use for my ball striking... i put a short strip of masking tape right behind the ball (maybe .5" or so behind). If I hit the tape and it rips off the matt, then I hit behind the ball, etc.

[nevets88]

  golfro said:

Yeah, that place is just about the only grass range around here. And its a 40 min drive from my house.

That's a good idea. I think I'll try that. Thanks for mentioning.

[Zeph]

Quick question on PP3: I often have trouble feeling the difference of the club lagging the weight into the pressure point, and the finger moving out (flipping), which also will give a feeling of resistance in the club. At least in the beginning. I have achieved some wonderful feeling shots when working on PP3, but the video shows nothing was different, perhaps except the speed. Any suggestions on how to get the PP1 feeling from lag, rather than casting?

Good video by Lynn Blake. It's the hands that throw the club out, so it makes sense he says lag is all in the hands. Of course a result of a lot of other things too, but you can have lots of stuff right and still flip it.

[$2 Nassau]

  deronsizemore said:

Don't know how good of a golfer the guy behind you is, but most higher handicap golfers like mats becasue they mask your bad shots. You can hit three inches behind the ball on a mat and still hit it like normal after the club bounces up into the ball.

Judging by the Birkenstocks and the set up position I'm guessing he is a novice. But let's stay on topic please! LOL

[deronsizemore]

  $2 Nassau said:

Judging by the Birkenstocks and the set up position I'm guessing he is a novice. But let's stay on topic please! LOL

Well, I didn't want to make any assumptions because I've seen some damn good golfers where some weird things, but yeah...

[soloredd]

  golfro said:

Yeah, that place is just about the only grass range around here. And its a 40 min drive from my house.

I do that as well, I use sport tape. Figured this out one day when I kept trying to dig a little indention in the mat with my iron. I usually will place the strip even with the tee so it's always in the same spot.

I hate mats. I go to a range that has both but if you want to hit off grass full-time you have to shell out $500/year. Otherwise, it's grass probably every other week.

[TopMostOfEm]

  deronsizemore said:

Don't know how good of a golfer the guy behind you is, but most higher handicap golfers like mats becasue they mask your bad shots. You can hit three inches behind the ball on a mat and still hit it like normal after the club bounces up into the ball.

Actually, I hate them for that reason. They give me false confidence. Also, with no divot to provide feedback, they even more lead me to believe I hit it right.

I struggle massively as you can imagine, getting any lag at all...being just 3 weeks into the sport. But FWIW when I do have a small divot in front of the ball, and my 7i does go 150ish and fairly straight... To me it feels like my *straight* left arm and wrist are pulling through the ball...and my right hand and arm are along for the ride. Additionally, when I get it right, it did not take much effort-- as opposed to the majority of the time when, despite telling myself to relax and let the club do the work...emotion or subconcious BS take over and I try to kill it with my hands and arms from the top of my swing. Sigh.

[WUTiger]

  Taggsy said:

That's an interesting exercise, but I wouldn't be surprised if it produced the opposite intended effect and you end up casting the club.

If you take away the rubber band and the inflated ball, the movements are similar to ones my pro has me do to get rid of over-the-top.

In one drill, you 1. go from address to club parallel to ground, 2. to top of swing, 3. hand drop (which prevents OTT and helps lag), 4. and return to address position. (Once you get the motion positions down, you need to add accompanying hip turn to get most benefit) NOTE: Hand drop initiates the downswing, with everything else following. Not really a power swing, but it keeps ball in play. I know many of you have a more aggressive swing scheme. In a second drill, you come to the top (ear level or so to prevent overswing and likely OTT), then pull down twice to mimic hand drop. Then, on third pulldown, you go ahead and hit the ball. (Ball is teed up about 1/8" for irons). So far, I can hit fairly decent shots with 5i on up. With longer clubs, it gets pretty wild. When I get to the point where I can do the three-pull and hit a decent driver shot, I will have accomplished a lot. These drills have improved my tempo and largely eliminated OTT, but I still haven't been able to escape a mid-round lapse into a couple of triple bogies.

[MJP]

  iacas said:

I agree it can be confusing. Ben Hogan said "bump and turn" but he moved his hips laterally more than almost anyone, ever.

I tried putting my driver weight 60/40 with a hip bump at address. Almost immediately I noticed how easy it was to get the club "on plane" (taking it back inside, although taking it back too inside would be bad as well. I like "on plane" more. but for people taking it outside the feeling to them would be way inside).

More importantly, it was much easier to deliver the club on plane through the down swing. I then tried putting the weight 40/60 and found I couldn't get the hands deep or on a one plane at the P4 for the life of me. The whoosh from my driver (relevant to the thread, lag) is much louder as well. I used to not understand how to control my weight distribution. I used to lean my whole body forward. Now I just bump the hip (which also gives me a little secondary axis tilt) to replace the weight. I do this right before I start waggling and after I achieve a good posture and push my hips back.

[impactfix]

I did try to read through this thread before replying. And also, having a huge HCP compared to you, and only having played a year, i shouldnt even be posting here. BUT. Allow me to atleast be curious.

You say you flip. So basically, you strive for a Flat left wrist at impact. Right?

Have you tried the aiming point concept?
(6-E-2, 2-J-3, also read 7-23, and 2-K#6(the endless belt effect - could help understand why a straighter delivery path line might help for a deep lag feeling, depending on what type of release you use...) this are reference numbers to the Yellow bible, TGM).

Aiming your #3 Pressure point a few inches ahead of the ball, getting more of a straight line delivery path instead of a very arced one (see the endless belt reference). How far depends if your hands are slow or fast. Also if you use a long or short club.

I use this concept with drag loading, and basically "throwing" my left wrist to a point ahead of the ball, and it works great for me. And my divots have been moving way forward since i applied this. (I know i should say throwing my #3PP but.. being a swinger, i try to not think about throwing my #3pp since that would make my right arm too involved and possibly use right arm muscular thrust to get my #3pp in that position).

Either way - just wondering if you've tried. Or heard of the concept.




If you throw your club from the top, and lose your lag pressure very early, this concept wont really help per se.

Im sorry if this has been discussed or if i missed something. You might already have a solution.

And this isnt me giving advice cause i dont really know if you swing or hit, drag load or drive load or if you have a snap or sweep release, how you pivot, etcetera.... im just curious if you heard of it or tried it.