What do you say when you need someone to shank it?

[TitleistLefty]

How's it going? I'm a collegiate golfer "but more importantly, a student" specifically a psychology/ behavioral analysis student. Everyone has those matches when they need their opponent to choke and hit a bad shot. I have a variety of ways I do it when I'm behind in a money match, and am curious how you all do it. I'm talking about little comments that make your opponent think about their game in a way they shouldn't. Here are a few of the ones I use the most. 1: The classic 'Do you inhale or exhale in your back swing?' 2: If my opponent has great tempo, I'll ask him how he keeps such great tempo and what happens if he swings too fast/slow. 3: I have a buddy that usually hits a cut. When a hole comes up that will give him trouble with a cut, I'll say, "You've been hitting a draw all day. It's a good thing cause that wind is blowing off the left." Those are just a few of my favorites. What are your sure fire shank comments?

[Shindig]

I'm not sure I want to win a match that requires me to say something to unnerve my opponent.   I guess the closest to gamesmanship I'd really consider is that if he has a medium-length putt to put me away, I might say "OK, knock it close."

Also, the comment about the draw and the wind... wouldn't that cost you the hole (2 shots in medal play), as you're trying to affect the shot played by someone?

[Shorty]

Can't say I've ever been in a position where making an arsehole of myself was more important than winning a match.

I prefer to play as well as I can. If that's not good enough, I can cope with a loss.  Very easily, in fact.

I would hate to win a match using your psychological "tactics". I prefer my opponents not to think they're playing with a jerk.

[Tomboys]

We all have to look at ourselves in the mirror.  I'd rather be proud of the person looking back at me than ashamed.  Don't get me wrong, gamesmanship is often an integral part of competition, so I'm not passing judgement on those that use it.  Rather, I know that for me to really enjoy any accomplishment, I have to play it straight up.

For instance, I helped a friend (as best I could given my limited knowledge) refine his swing when he was new to golf.  Fast forward a few years later and he started beating me on a regular basis.  However, part of the reason he was able to do this was because I allowed it to happen.  We'll play a round where loser buys dinner and many times, I'll be leading in the match.  But, I'll notice that his swing may be off or his putting stroke looks jerky, so I let him know what I see and offer to help him find a correction.  I would become so concerned about his game, that I would often lose focus of my own and end up losing the match.  I know, I know, you're not supposed to offer any advice to competitors during a round.  Sue me.

While it didn't exactly feel good to lose so much, I was (somewhat) ok with it because I felt the tradeoff was worth helping a friend.  That is until one day where I flubbed a drive and I motioned like I was going to throw my driver (I wasn't actually going to do it).  Unfortunately, it half-slipped out of my hand and I tried desperately to regain my grip on it.  As a result, I guess I looked awkward because my friend started laughing.  I was already frustrated, and his laughter grated on me pretty bad.  However, when he made the comment, "Not only was your drive sh*tty, you can't even throw your club right.  You looked like a sissy."  Oh baby, right there, that was it.  From that day forward, I told myself, "During a competitive round, when (not if) you get this guy down, you don't let up.  You stand on his throat and press harder and harder and you don't let up until the round is over."  And, that's exactly the mindset that I adopted.

Next thing you know, I end up beating him for 5 straight rounds.  During some of the rounds, he would miss a shot and ask me what he did wrong.  I resisted my normal inclination to help him and would simply reply, "I don't know."  Each time he would miss a shot or a putt, he'd try to elicit my help or support.  I wouldn't give it.  I wasn't being a jerk or anything.  Rather, I just gave him "canned" responses like, "I don't know" or "Yah, that's golf for ya."  Never once did I resort to gamesmanship.  If he hit a good shot, I congratulated him on it.  If he hit a bad shot, I kept my mouth shut.  Whether his shots were good or bad, I didn't care.  As soon as he was done hitting his shot, I tuned him out completely and turned my full attention to the shot that I was about to play.

I guess the gist of my story is that if you want to resort to gamesmanship to win, then do so.  However, for me, I'd rather figure out a way to improve my game so that my successes are based on skill, not mind games.  During the interim, if I lose a few that I could've won because I chose not to employ gamesmanship tactics, then so be it.

Lastly, I guess in a way, I should thank my friend.  It helped me develop a better "killer instinct" when I play in competitive rounds..

[TitleistLefty]

Originally Posted by Shorty

Can't say I've ever been in a position where making an arsehole of myself was more important than winning a match.

I prefer to play as well as I can. If that's not good enough, I can cope with a loss.  Very easily, in fact.

I would hate to win a match using your psychological "tactics". I prefer my opponents not to think they're playing with a jerk.

First off, I think it's important for you to understand I'm not talking about doing this to people at the National Tournament. I'm talking about when I'm out playing with friends. It goes back and forth. It doesn't have to be malicious, it's in good fun. I guess if I'm playing with a peevish twit that thinks he's better than he is then he may get upset, but I've never had anyone get the slightest bit mad. I actually find it fun when people do it to me. I think it makes my mental game better when I have to block out the thought of a bad shot. If you still think this makes me an 'arsehole', I think it says more about you than me.

[abraxas]

this is the funny thing about golf

in any other sport, trash talking is part of the game

oh wait...golfs not a sport

[TitleistLefty]

Originally Posted by Tomboys

We all have to look at ourselves in the mirror.  I'd rather be proud of the person looking back at me than ashamed.  Don't get me wrong, gamesmanship is often an integral part of competition, so I'm not passing judgment on those that use it.  Rather, I know that for me to really enjoy any accomplishment, I have to play it straight up.

For instance, I helped a friend (as best I could given my limited knowledge) refine his swing when he was new to golf.  Fast forward a few years later and he started beating me on a regular basis.  However, part of the reason he was able to do this was because I allowed it to happen.  We'll play a round where loser buys dinner and many times, I'll be leading in the match.  But, I'll notice that his swing may be off or his putting stroke looks jerky, so I let him know what I see and offer to help him find a correction.  I would become so concerned about his game, that I would often lose focus of my own and end up losing the match.  I know, I know, you're not supposed to offer any advice to competitors during a round.  Sue me.

While it didn't exactly feel good to lose so much, I was (somewhat) ok with it because I felt the tradeoff was worth helping a friend.  That is until one day where I flubbed a drive and I motioned like I was going to throw my driver (I wasn't actually going to do it).  Unfortunately, it half-slipped out of my hand and I tried desperately to regain my grip on it.  As a result, I guess I looked awkward because my friend started laughing.  I was already frustrated, and his laughter grated on me pretty bad.  However, when he made the comment, "Not only was your drive sh*tty, you can't even throw your club right.  You looked like a sissy."  Oh baby, right there, that was it.  From that day forward, I told myself, "During a competitive round, when (not if) you get this guy down, you don't let up.  You stand on his throat and press harder and harder and you don't let up until the round is over."  And, that's exactly the mindset that I adopted.

Next thing you know, I end up beating him for 5 straight rounds.  During some of the rounds, he would miss a shot and ask me what he did wrong.  I resisted my normal inclination to help him and would simply reply, "I don't know."  Each time he would miss a shot or a putt, he'd try to elicit my help or support.  I wouldn't give it.  I wasn't being a jerk or anything.  Rather, I just gave him "canned" responses like, "I don't know" or "Yah, that's golf for ya."  Never once did I resort to gamesmanship.  If he hit a good shot, I congratulated him on it.  If he hit a bad shot, I kept my mouth shut.  Whether his shots were good or bad, I didn't care.  As soon as he was done hitting his shot, I tuned him out completely and turned my full attention to the shot that I was about to play.

I guess the gist of my story is that if you want to resort to gamesmanship to win, then do so.  However, for me, I'd rather figure out a way to improve my game so that my successes are based on skill, not mind games.  During the interim, if I lose a few that I could've won because I chose not to employ gamesmanship tactics, then so be it.

Lastly, I guess in a way, I should thank my friend.  It helped me develop a better "killer instinct" when I play in competitive rounds..

I see what you're saying, and agree. Every year I take a trip with 15 of my friends. We have two teams and play a Ryder Cup format 'Tournament'. We have all kinds of golfers between us. From a touring pro to a 20 handicap that plays 4 times a year. I find myself giving tips and advice to the higher handicaps, yet with the better players I have fun and mess around with them because I know they can handle it. I guess I misworded my post. I don't resort to mind games to win; I rely on my game. I just like to have fun with my buddies by playing around. Believe me, I've lost plenty of close matches in my career that I could have won. So don't get me wrong, I believe that a friendship and sportsmanship is more important than a win.

[benredik]

My friend (11 HCP) and I was playing and on the two first tee shots he blasted the ball with the driver off the tee. His drives where about 260-270 yards.

On the third hole, a par 4, it's a small water hazard just off the tee. He gets ready with his setup, about to blast another perfect drive.. I say "It's 101 to carry" - he gives me a weird look and of course shanks it into the water :-) So that has become our inside joke on hole #3 on our home course. Of course this is all for fun and I would never consider it in a tournament.

[saevel25]

oh trash talking is definetly part of the game, its just in a gentlemen's way..

"Somebody's Closer!" ;b

[SouthernILGolfer]

Usually if i tell a friend to hit it right down the middle, it goes anywhere but there.  Or just make solid contact, it will get there, usually resulting in chunked shot with a massive divot flying in the air.   You dont have to say anything negative to make another player hit a poor shot.

[Ernest Jones]

Nice and easy, niiiiiiicccccccccccceeeeeeeeee and easy!

Works everytime!

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by TitleistLefty

The classic 'Do you inhale or exhale in your back swing?'

That would fuck me up badly

[BrushCaddy]

"Miss it Noonan."

[allin]

I once messed with an opponent who had been telling everyone I was a wuss because I am a short hitter and how bad he was going to cream me.  I kept asking him after every drive he hit, didn't you use to be a lot longer.  Pretty soon he was coming out of his shoes on every swing.  He was three holes down before he caught on.  I won the match 5&4.  I see this as different than jingling coins or moving during someones swing.  I once hit a 5 iron on an uphill shot into the wind when it was really a 6 iron because my opponent was peeking in my bag every time I hit first to club off me.  He was about 5 yards closer and is a club longer than I am.  He took out his 6 and blew it over the green. I guess I don't  have any problem with a little power of suggestion.  If I putt first and hit it a little hard and my opponent is on a similar line and I say boy that was faster than I expected and he hits his to soft then is this a problem?  Of course when I do this there is always some coin on the line, although I never play for large amounts, I see this as part of the competition. Banter actually relaxes me so of course I consider it OK.  I get the impression that at one time pros considered it OK but that times may have changed and it is no longer considered acceptable.

[TitleistLefty]

Allin, I never really thought about it but I'm sure they use to and still do although maybe not as much. I think you might hear some if you went to the par 3 contest at The Masters or a charity event of some kind.

[mdl]

My first reaction to this post was pretty much the same as Shindig's.  Though in a 15 friends yearly tournament trip type of atmosphere I could see this being in good fun (between the guys with similar ability), rather than just being an asshole.  I've never been into those kind of mind games myself though.  I'd rather beat an opponent when both of us are on our game, rather than trying to out-mindf**k him and get him to play further below his level than he can get me to.  Golf's mental enough already and I know me and my good golf buddies all have mentally collapsed all on our own at the end of a tight round.