Rule changes for 2012

[Ignorant]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Odd that it is a rule about listening music and broadcast and not about wearing headphones or listening to a recording that are not music. So it seems that you could wear noise-canceling headphones or ear buds and just cut all outside noise. Or is that using an artificial devise? Did they also mean to leave room for listening to recorded voices?

Those kids who have been listening to music, will they switch to silence? Will earplugs be banned as an artificial devise? What about recordings of their coaches repeating a mantra or affirmations as long as it is not advise, sung, or broadcast? "You're consistent enough. You're long enough. You're good enough. And by golly, people like you."

The entire language of "broadcast" seems so dated and the rule is not even in effect yet. Is a podcast a broadcast? Is a recording from your iCloud account a broadcast? Does it move from a broadcast to a recording if the content is streamed to your cache before you hear it -- sort of a recording of a broadcast that happened a few seconds ago?

As carefully and slowly and the rules change, this seems an odd one to me. But, I'm 52 years old. Was this a problem somewhere or with younger players?

This Dec cannot be that difficult to absorb as some seem to think. The idea is that an artificial decive cannot be used for the player's benefit. Neither can ear plugs or other such devices blocking external nuisances out be used.

What's the problem??

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Odd that it is a rule about listening music and broadcast and not about wearing headphones or listening to a recording that are not music. So it seems that you could wear noise-canceling headphones or ear buds and just cut all outside noise. Or is that using an artificial devise? Did they also mean to leave room for listening to recorded voices?

Those kids who have been listening to music, will they switch to silence? Will earplugs be banned as an artificial devise? What about recordings of their coaches repeating a mantra or affirmations as long as it is not advise, sung, or broadcast? "You're consistent enough. You're long enough. You're good enough. And by golly, people like you."

The entire language of "broadcast" seems so dated and the rule is not even in effect yet. Is a podcast a broadcast? Is a recording from your iCloud account a broadcast? Does it move from a broadcast to a recording if the content is streamed to your cache before you hear it -- sort of a recording of a broadcast that happened a few seconds ago?

As carefully and slowly and the rules change, this seems an odd one to me. But, I'm 52 years old. Was this a problem somewhere or with younger players?

The prohibition against listening to any coaching etc. has been in the rules for a long time, but up until now, music was still allowed.

If you follow a couple of golf forums, you will soon see someone post the question "What do you listen to when you play?".  I've seen it several times in the 5 or 6 years that I've been cruising the forums.  It appears to be common for the younger generation to tune out the world when they play, just like some of them seem to do with life in general.  (I'm just a month shy of 65 myself)  I've never understood that approach - I like my music in the car going to and from the course, not while I'm playing golf.  Also, I don't mind using lightweight headphones, but I can't stand having ear buds stuck in my ears.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by Ignorant

This Dec cannot be that difficult to absorb as some seem to think. The idea is that an artificial decive cannot be used for the player's benefit. Neither can ear plugs or other such devices blocking external nuisances out be used.

What's the problem??

I guess I do not see such a clear line until the rules gurus draw that line. Earplugs are not OK you say (and you may be right) but ear muffs are still OK. Sunglasses are OK and are a great benefit for many players. I used to have a pair that claimed to make reading greens easier. But noise canceling headphones are not OK you say because they can be used to a player's benefit? A hat, clearly an artificial device, and clearly a benefit beyond fashion, has been OK forever. So, the specific mention of music and broadcast seems to want to eliminate those things.

[tristanhilton85]

Are these changes effective right away or not until 2012?

[rustyredcab]

January 1, 2012

[Ignorant]

Originally Posted by Ignorant

This Dec cannot be that difficult to absorb as some seem to think. The idea is that an artificial decive cannot be used for the player's benefit. Neither can ear plugs or other such devices blocking external nuisances out be used.

What's the problem??

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

I guess I do not see such a clear line until the rules gurus draw that line. Earplugs are not OK you say (and you may be right) but ear muffs are still OK. Sunglasses are OK and are a great benefit for many players. I used to have a pair that claimed to make reading greens easier. But noise canceling headphones are not OK you say because they can be used to a player's benefit? A hat, clearly an artificial device, and clearly a benefit beyond fashion, has been OK forever. So, the specific mention of music and broadcast seems to want to eliminate those things.

I can understand your confusion and you are right, it is not black & white. However, one needs to understand that golf requires concentration and blocking disturbances out with mental strength is one of key elements to success. Now, if anybody may block himself out from the real world with artificial devices in order to be able to concentrate better has not understood the essence of Golf. Protecting oneself from the natural elements such as sun and rain is only natural but blocking out all the sounds from the environment is not what golf is about.

There are some Decisions regarding these issues, specifically of protecting a player from the elements or shielding a line of play/putt. Reading these Decisions gives a fair guideline how to deal with earplugs or radios etc. as it is all about Equity.

Btw, why the hell one would need to listen to music while playing in the first place??? Golf is a social game and a glorious trip into the nature. Why would someone wish to destroy these elements of a roung of golf? I find that disgusting...

[zeg]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

I guess I do not see such a clear line until the rules gurus draw that line. Earplugs are not OK you say (and you may be right) but ear muffs are still OK. Sunglasses are OK and are a great benefit for many players. I used to have a pair that claimed to make reading greens easier. But noise canceling headphones are not OK you say because they can be used to a player's benefit? A hat, clearly an artificial device, and clearly a benefit beyond fashion, has been OK forever. So, the specific mention of music and broadcast seems to want to eliminate those things.

I think the thing you have to remember is that golf, like most sports (and more than many), is understood to be played in a certain way as a matter of tradition.  Although the game and technology evolve, there is a tension between the desire to achieve better scores and the desire to maintain the traditional methods.  Many rules have been added to enforce aspects of this (e.g., the various rules defining what a club is or isn't, or the very famous introduction of the rule against croquet-style putting).  In other cases, there are no explicit rules, but words like "customary" appear to provide some guidance.

This is one of those cases, and, e.g., hats are allowed for just the reason you point out: they have been ok forever.  Electronic devices have not and like it or not, right or wrong, it's going to take a while to shake out what is and isn't going to be part of golfing tradition in a few decades.  At the end of the day some things will seem arbitrary just because a decision has to be made one way or the other.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by Ignorant

...

Btw, why the hell one would need to listen to music while playing in the first place??? Golf is a social game and a glorious trip into the nature. Why would someone wish to destroy these elements of a roung of golf? I find that disgusting...

To be clear, I do not listen to music when playing. I have done so on the range when it is noisy or when I am trying to learn a song (my other hobby is singing). I have listened while playing a practice round, alone, on a slow course, when I have a bunch to learn. But I hit two balls and break all kinds of rules in those practice rounds so again, the new rule does not effect me.

I just find it an odd place for the R&A; and USGA to spend energy changing/clarifying a rule. If blocking out sound gives an advantage, then headbands that cover the ears or muffs give that advantage. I play with guys who have hearing aids and they turn them off while playing (I think because of wind noise and other issues with being outside and not in an effort to avoid distractions). They become deaf as a post and nothing bothers them unless they see it -- an "advantage" I would not wish on anyone. Clearly you can't make someone keep their hearing aid on. Why would anyone need to listen to music while playing? A few years ago my company had six programers working with the rest of us "normal" people. Five of six had headphones on all day. It was how they worked. I'll bet if they golfed and were not playing social golf, they'd like to wear headphones then too. Kind of like those times when you do not want to chat on a plane so you pull out a book and your iPod.

I understand the rule. It makes little difference to me. I don't understand why the committees would waste time on it. Is this a big problem somewhere? And when they addressed it, IMHO, they used language that shows how behind they are regarding technology by restricting "broadcast." Why not update the rule prohibiting fixing of spike marks on the green? Or iPhones having a compass buried deep in the code?

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

To be clear, I do not listen to music when playing. I have done so on the range when it is noisy or when I am trying to learn a song (my other hobby is singing). I have listened while playing a practice round, alone, on a slow course, when I have a bunch to learn. But I hit two balls and break all kinds of rules in those practice rounds so again, the new rule does not effect me.

I just find it an odd place for the R&A; and USGA to spend energy changing/clarifying a rule. If blocking out sound gives an advantage, then headbands that cover the ears or muffs give that advantage. I play with guys who have hearing aids and they turn them off while playing (I think because of wind noise and other issues with being outside and not in an effort to avoid distractions). They become deaf as a post and nothing bothers them unless they see it -- an "advantage" I would not wish on anyone. Clearly you can't make someone keep their hearing aid on. Why would anyone need to listen to music while playing? A few years ago my company had six programers working with the rest of us "normal" people. Five of six had headphones on all day. It was how they worked. I'll bet if they golfed and were not playing social golf, they'd like to wear headphones then too. Kind of like those times when you do not want to chat on a plane so you pull out a book and your iPod.

I understand the rule. It makes little difference to me. I don't understand why the committees would waste time on it. Is this a big problem somewhere? And when they addressed it, IMHO, they used language that shows how behind they are regarding technology by restricting "broadcast." Why not update the rule prohibiting fixing of spike marks on the green? Or iPhones having a compass buried deep in the code?

The hearing aid issue is a medical condition, and as such is covered and permitted under the rules.  Using an iPod is not a medical issue, although it's been proven that extended use can ultimately lead to hearing loss.

[FLOG4]

Richard Zokol the Canadian was the most famous golfer that utilized headphones for music.  My take on this isn't the restriction of music, it's the restriction of potential advise.  The technology today could allow contestants to hear dialogue from the analysts as to how a putt breaks or how fast or slow a putt is.  Who's to know what anyone is listening to with a headset on!!! Maybe it's a tape from your coach giving instructions to how to play each shot on each hole, remember to place your shot on the rear left quadrant of the green for best line to that tricky pin....Just eliminate the potential for illegal advise.  That would be my take on listening devises being disallowed.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by FLOG4

Richard Zokol the Canadian was the most famous golfer that utilized headphones for music.  My take on this isn't the restriction of music, it's the restriction of potential advise.  The technology today could allow contestants to hear dialogue from the analysts as to how a putt breaks or how fast or slow a putt is.  Who's to know what anyone is listening to with a headset on!!! Maybe it's a tape from your coach giving instructions to how to play each shot on each hole, remember to place your shot on the rear left quadrant of the green for best line to that tricky pin....Just eliminate the potential for illegal advise.  That would be my take on listening devises being disallowed.

Except that music can be an aid keeping a consistent tempo, and tempo is a crucial part of a good golf swing.  No different from using a metronome to establish a rhythm to your swing.  Any such aid would be in breach of rule 14.

[turtleback]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Except that music can be an aid keeping a consistent tempo, and tempo is a crucial part of a good golf swing.  No different from using a metronome to establish a rhythm to your swing.  Any such aid would be in breach of rule 14.

Similarly listening to the soundtrack of something like Tour Tempo could give a golfer an unfair advantage.  It is fine as a training device but not during play.

[rustyredcab]

All this talk of banning the music reminds my of Footloose (the original as I have no idea what the remake is about). I can see the R&A; guys sitting around saying, "All this rock and roll music will lead to an advantage on the golf course and in the bedroom. We must protect the game and our women."

[FLOG4]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Except that music can be an aid keeping a consistent tempo, and tempo is a crucial part of a good golf swing.  No different from using a metronome to establish a rhythm to your swing.  Any such aid would be in breach of rule 14.

Seeing as the PGA tour and R&A; have allowed music thru headphones for the past 30 years......My take is they banned headphones at this point due to the ability to listen to

other things at this point.  Why would they wait till now to ban these devices? PGA pros utilize every possible advantage they can to play their best/make the best living they

can. They use the newest best equipment, they manipulate that equipment the best they can, the best ball, caddies that match their needs.....So Why didn't any of these guys

utilize headphones if they are so advantageous???

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by FLOG4

Seeing as the PGA tour and R&A; have allowed music thru headphones for the past 30 years......My take is they banned headphones at this point due to the ability to listen to

other things at this point.  Why would they wait till now to ban these devices? PGA pros utilize every possible advantage they can to play their best/make the best living they

can. They use the newest best equipment, they manipulate that equipment the best they can, the best ball, caddies that match their needs.....So Why didn't any of these guys

utilize headphones if they are so advantageous???

Do you somehow think that it was not possible to listen to an instructional tape 30 years ago?  Ever hear of the Sony Walkman?  The difference is that now with the ubiquitousness of the iPod, there is more of a potential for any of a number of prohibited uses, so apparently they decided that the time had come to clearly define their thought on the subject.

[FLOG4]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Do you somehow think that it was not possible to listen to an instructional tape 30 years ago?  Ever hear of the Sony Walkman?  The difference is that now with the ubiquitousness of the iPod, there is more of a potential for any of a number of prohibited uses, so apparently they decided that the time had come to clearly define their thought on the subject.

Fourputt- By the way great name.  The simple question is.  If the utilization of these various devices was so advantageous for the past 30 years.......Why didn't anyone use them?

So we now have much greater ability to draw unfathomable input into hearing devices and they are banned. Why? My point was and continues to be that because these new devices can pick up any potential input that they are now banned.  They weren't banned previously because music listening and or any other input wasn't viewed as "To a players advantage"  Contrary to your position that music aided players in your past posts. The USGA and R&A; didn't hold your view.  But then again you seem to have changed your position. And if you have, good for you.  Now we dub you THREEPUTT.

[deasy55]

I bet you are the life and soul of parties if you find something silly like listening to music on a golf course "disgusting"

(I don't listen to music while golfing by the way, I just found the use of that word to describe your feelings about it both amusing and strange)

Originally Posted by Ignorant

I find that disgusting...

[luu5]

Originally Posted by deasy55

I bet you are the life and soul of parties if you find something silly like listening to music on a golf course "disgusting"

What golf and parties have to do with each other?