At what hcp did you make the jump from the white to the blue tees ?

[BuckeyeNut]

Originally Posted by David in FL

Color means nothing..... What's the yardage?

Exactly!

[Pablo68]

Originally Posted by Beachcomber

As you become a more proficient ball striker... And the course becomes shorter and shorter... Then move back to a longer tee box.

Well put.

Golf is about scoring; PERIOD. If you can't consistently break 80 from the back tees, you probably need to move up to the next tees. Everyone complains about the pace of play and this is one way to help it; play the appropriate tees. The slope and course rating will adjust your handicap accordingly.

I just played in Oklahoma City and while I usually play the blues, the Blues (6800) there was too much with wind being at least 15-20 mph. I put my ego in check and played the whites at 6150. It was shorter than I'm used to (about 6500) but the wind made up for it. I ended up shooting 74 the first day and 75 the next. Lower than I'm used to but they were the appropriate tees to play under those conditions.

[sean_miller]

Golf is a hobby. It's about having fun and while not being a nuisance to the people around you. If you're in over your head from the tips (or whatever distance we're talking about here) then the group following you and your playing partners will already be aware of it before you even ask. When you're ready the course will seem too short. If it doesn't, then you're not.

[BuckeyeNut]

Just to add 2 cents from a different perspective.......poor club selection from the tee is as much of a problem as improper tee selection.   I see it ALL THE TIME....watching golfers playing short forward tees and then butchering short easy holes because they blindly hit driver on every hole when the shot does not call for a driver. (because of the forward tees).    Then they're losing balls all over the place.......Sheesh

Every golf hole offers a widest most inviting landing area by design, but these players are blindly blasting driver beyond into the abyss where there is no margin for error.  Had they played from further back, their drivers would be finding the wider areas and been playable.  Instead...I'm wasting time helping them find lost golf balls.

LOL....just playing devils advocate here!!

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Dave2512

Nothing to add other than like other's I make the choice based on length and I move around accordingly. It's a moving target. We have courses here that are just 6400 yds from the back and others that are a monstrous 7600+ yds from the back. Though at a few of the longer courses you need permission from the head pro to play championship tees. I stood on the box of a 696 yd par 5 just to see what the view was, crazy long. There are 3 sets of men's tees there and more than a 100 yd difference on some holes from the tips to the most forward men's tee.

Dave, I don't know if you have ever played Riverdale Dunes (Dye course), but when the course first opened, one of the par 5 holes was 230 yards from the back tees to the forward tees, before you ever saw any fairway.  I think it was changed or they just abandoned that back tee at some point, because it doesn't show that on the current scorecard.  My buddy and I played from the the next to the back tee whenever we played there, and sometimes it was another 50 or 60 yards to the black tees.

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Golf is a hobby. It's about having fun and while not being a nuisance to the people around you. If you're in over your head from the tips (or whatever distance we're talking about here) then the group following you and your playing partners will already be aware of it before you even ask. When you're ready the course will seem too short. If it doesn't, then you're not.

This.  I'm not ashamed to play an unfamiliar course from fairly short range at times if it has a lot of trouble.  I'm there to have fun, not lose balls and beat my head against the wall.  I'd rather be hitting the right part of the fairway with an iron or hybrid than constantly digging in the bag for another ball because I can't let go of the driver.

[slodsm]

I agree, I don't even pull my driver out of the bag unless it's a par 5. I am not long by any stretch (I can be but I completely lack control when I throw the coal to the driver) so I play my 3w on my tees because I'm about 200-210 with it and dead straight with just a nice controlled swing.

That said, I play whatever tees give me around 6000 yards. The tips at one club I belong to are only 6100 so I'll play them now and then but usually the I play the middle tees. At the club I'm about to join the tips are insane and include a 680 yard par5 14th hole. I play the golds (one step up from the most fwd tees) and they play to 6400 and are still a serious challenge for me. The 14th hole is still 600 yards from them.

[Dave2512]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Dave, I don't know if you have ever played Riverdale Dunes (Dye course), but when the course first opened, one of the par 5 holes was 230 yards from the back tees to the forward tees, before you ever saw any fairway.  I think it was changed or they just abandoned that back tee at some point, because it doesn't show that on the current scorecard.  My buddy and I played from the the next to the back tee whenever we played there, and sometimes it was another 50 or 60 yards to the black tees.

I've been there a few times this summer, though I've only played the front 9 on the Dunes. I didn't see any abandoned boxes on the front but honestly I wasn't looking. The course is so amazing it's easy to be distracted taking it all in. Actually played the Knolls yesterday and bought my Mom a $100 Riverdale gift cert. for her bday so I'll be back soon.  Anyway that's one of the courses I was referring to that requires permission to play the back tees. I'm sure you've been to the other long course I mentioned, CO National formerly Vista Ridge. I don't recall if you need permission to play back tees there but it is long at 7600+. Wouldn't matter anyway because the course is poorly managed. That's where I took in the view from the 696y par 5. That course is long playing any of the mens tee's.

[Ausgolfer]

I am fortunate enough to play my golf on Melbournes sand belt. Interestingly as a weekend golfer we have no choice as to what tees we play, Sundays are of the front tees with Saturdays of the backs, once a month on a Saturday we play as far back as the course will allow! I think that this has been good for my golf as the difference in club selection not only keeps me interested but has made me a more rounded player. My recommendation is play as much golf as possible of whatever tees you can regardless of handicap you will be a better golfer because of it!

[LovinItAll]

What are the whites you're playing now? What are the blues? How far do you carry your 5 iron?

I know it's now popular to use a multiplier of one's 5i distance to determine what tees to play, but I want to point out one thing: - In 1975, Medinah played about 7,000 yards for the U.S. Open (Lou Graham won with +3). - In 1980, the average driving distance for PGA tour pros was only ~260 yards. The leader in driving for that year, Dan Pohl, averaged ~ 275. Average drives were certainly shorter in '75. - Jack's 'average' 5i in those days was about 170. He could hit it further, of course, but that was his preferred distance for 5i. The point is that if a golfer can AVERAGE 250 off the tee, he's qualified to play any tee box. The USGA used to state that a scratch golfer drove the ball about 240 on average (I'm sure that's higher now, but I can't find the stat). I only mention this because a guy that drives it 250 and hits 5i 170 shouldn't be playing the forward tees even though 170*36-6120, which is pretty average for white (forward) tee boxes. Note that I'm an advocate of teeing it forward for many golfers, especially if it helps them enjoy the game more. I don't believe that the set of tee boxes from which a player plays is the primary factor in pace of play. I've noted before that I've played with golfers that can't break a hundred, but have no problem keeping up, while others who shoot in the 70's can be painfully slow. I also choose to hit 5i between 170-180. On a course with a slope of ~135, I'm going to be in the 70's the majority of the time, and I've posted many rounds of even par on similar courses. Just a thought on '5i should determine which tees to play'............

[David in FL]

I know it's now popular to use a multiplier of one's 5i distance to determine what tees to play, but I want to point out one thing: - In 1975, Medinah played about 7,000 yards for the U.S. Open (Lou Graham won with +3). - In 1980, the average driving distance for PGA tour pros was only ~260 yards. The leader in driving for that year, Dan Pohl, averaged ~ 275. Average drives were certainly shorter in '75. - Jack's 'average' 5i in those days was about 170. He could hit it further, of course, but that was his preferred distance for 5i. The point is that if a golfer can AVERAGE 250 off the tee, he's qualified to play any tee box. The USGA used to state that a scratch golfer drove the ball about 240 on average (I'm sure that's higher now, but I can't find the stat). I only mention this because a guy that drives it 250 and hits 5i 170 shouldn't be playing the forward tees even though 170*36-6120, which is pretty average for white (forward) tee boxes. Note that I'm an advocate of teeing it forward for many golfers, especially if it helps them enjoy the game more. I don't believe that the set of tee boxes from which a player plays is the primary factor in pace of play. I've noted before that I've played with golfers that can't break a hundred, but have no problem keeping up, while others who shoot in the 70's can be painfully slow. I also choose to hit 5i between 170-180. On a course with a slope of ~135, I'm going to be in the 70's the majority of the time, and I've posted many rounds of even par on similar courses. Just a thought on '5i should determine which tees to play'............

I tend to agree with you. I think the whole 5 iron times 36 thing tends to be a pretty conservative for better golfers. I do think that most golfers vastly overrate their average driver distance though, and tend not to consider driver carry, but rather remember those times they caught a sprinkler head and "busted one" 285. Nor do they consider average length in the fairway. Long and wrong is no help at all.

[Pablo68]

Originally Posted by LovinItAll

I know it's now popular to use a multiplier of one's 5i distance to determine what tees to play, but I want to point out one thing:

- In 1975, Medinah played about 7,000 yards for the U.S. Open (Lou Graham won with +3).

- In 1980, the average driving distance for PGA tour pros was only ~260 yards. The leader in driving for that year, Dan Pohl, averaged ~ 275. Average drives were certainly shorter in '75.

- Jack's 'average' 5i in those days was about 170. He could hit it further, of course, but that was his preferred distance for 5i.

The point is that if a golfer can AVERAGE 250 off the tee, he's qualified to play any tee box. The USGA used to state that a scratch golfer drove the ball about 240 on average (I'm sure that's higher now, but I can't find the stat).

I only mention this because a guy that drives it 250 and hits 5i 170 shouldn't be playing the forward tees even though 170*36-6120, which is pretty average for white (forward) tee boxes.

Note that I'm an advocate of teeing it forward for many golfers, especially if it helps them enjoy the game more. I don't believe that the set of tee boxes from which a player plays is the primary factor in pace of play. I've noted before that I've played with golfers that can't break a hundred, but have no problem keeping up, while others who shoot in the 70's can be painfully slow.

I also choose to hit 5i between 170-180. On a course with a slope of ~135, I'm going to be in the 70's the majority of the time, and I've posted many rounds of even par on similar courses.

Just a thought on '5i should determine which tees to play'............

Good points...........................however, just because someone can hit the 250 yd drive + 170 yd 5 iron doesn't mean he shouldn't play the forward tees. Is that his AVERAGE and can he hit his target repeatedly? Playing the back tees should be based on score. Start getting under 80 regularly from the forward tees, then move back.

[Par Fore]

From a handicap perspective on a typical course:

20 plus capper, whites'

10-20 capper, blues

sub 10 capper, blacks

Granted, there are so many factors, like your distance, yardage of course, accuracy, reasonable pace of play....that can influence this decision.

Another rule of thumb.....on the longest par 4, you should be hitting driver and 3-5 iron/hybrid.....if a good drive and 3 iron won't get you there, you are playing too far back.....if a good drive puts you with a 9 iron into the green, you are playing too far forward or your name is Bubba and you have a green jacket.

[LovinItAll]

From a handicap perspective on a typical course: 20 plus capper, whites' 10-20 capper, blues sub 10 capper, blacks Granted, there are so many factors, like your distance, yardage of course, accuracy, reasonable pace of play....that can influence this decision. Another rule of thumb.....on the longest par 4, you should be hitting driver and 3-5 iron/hybrid.....if a good drive and 3 iron won't get you there, you are playing too far back.....if a good drive puts you with a 9 iron into the green, you are playing too far forward or your name is Bubba and you have a green jacket.

Both of these examples are fine indicators of which tee box a player should hit from. [quote name="Pablo68" url="/t/62203/at-what-hcp-did-you-make-the-jump-from-the-white-to-the-blue-tees/18#post_770504"] Good points...........................however, just because someone can hit the 250 yd drive + 170 yd 5 iron doesn't mean he shouldn't play the forward tees. Is that his AVERAGE and can he hit his target repeatedly? Playing the back tees should be based on score. Start getting under 80 regularly from the forward tees, then move back. [/quote] Yes, I made it a point to write 'average' in my post. As far as score, I don't entirely disagree with your '70's' statement, but if someone can shoot in the 80's from a particular set of tees, no one should be giving them a hard time. We had an older gentleman join us not long ago. We were playing ~7000 yards and he said, 'I usually play the white tees, but I'll play back here with you guys.' Despite us encouraging him to play from his regular tees, he joined us. He was a very short hitter (210-225 driver) and was hitting 5w-7w into many par 4's. Didn't matter too much, as he shot 77 and I think missed 5 greens all day.

[MacDutch]

At my home course there is a summertime clubcompetition divided in two groups. HCP 15 and lower play backtee's (6.750 yards). May this year I had to move to backtee's and it was a nightmare. Now, 4 months later no problem at all anymore. Two things helped: consistently more lenght from the tee and course management.

When you are able to play consistant bogey-golf, it is in my opinion  better not to move back or forward, but to play different tee's. It will bring you in different situations at the same golfcourse, which is a good thing.

[bunkerputt]

Do you mean at what handicap did I make the jump and only shoot the difference in the course rating between the two tees?  I don't consider myself someone who is tied to a tee.  My shots have and have always had a cone regardless of whether they are short or long ones.  If you know what that cone is, what does it matter whether you are hitting a long shot or a short one?  Chips that miss by a foot are just as bad as drives that miss by 30 feet for a 30 foot chip and a 300 yard drive.  You aren't a better golfer because you only missed by a foot in the short case.  Same principle applies for the forward tees, but with less round numbers.

[sean_miller]

My home course has only two sets of tees. Red (forward) and white. If I want a variety of approach shots I use a variety of clubs off the tee. It's not rocket science.

[plum]

i agree on the issue being distance but what about a guy like my father, 74 years old, 200 yard max drives, shoots 75-78 every day of the week at his home course. should he be hitting from the yellow tees (one up from white) white plays around 6100 yards IIRC

[JetFan1983]

If you can hit it 250 off the tee on average, then I'd just go play the tips on your next round if you haven't already. 7000 really isn't that difficult if you're okay hitting 200 yard approach shots on 450 yard par fours. I played from 7000 yards for the first time recently and found it be easier in some ways. I hit more fairways than I ever had before. The obvious downside of course is mishitting my driver and leaving myself a 3-wood into a green. I only did that once during the round though.

Clearly it depends on what kind of course we're talking about here and it helps to know the layout first so you can have an idea of what's possible and what isn't given your current skill level. The courses I play don't have insane forced carries or anything like that when playing from 7000.