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inthecup

WOW I finally get lag and release

69 posts in this topic

I am taking lessons and working into a net with video and a launch monitor.  I finally found an instructor that explained and demonstrated it (lag) in a way that I understood.  I have been working on my swing for 3 years and although I got better and better I knew I was flipping but did not know how to stop it.  I also asked the pro a lot of questions.  One that always bothered me is that there should be no tension in a golf swing.  I found it impossible to create lag without tension.  I have hit balls 4-5 sessions trying to groove the new feel and although I need more work the results are very promising.  When you get it right you can feel the shaft load coming into the strike and the ball speed/distance pick up dramatically.  Amazingly my dispersion is also tightening.  Really looking forward to grooving this and getting out on the course.  Based on the weather in MI it looks like I will have plenty of time to practice into a net.

One drill I use is quarter swings holding lag and working on hip rotation.   High frame rate video is also invaluable to see what is actually happening and to compare my swing to a good one.  The lag king appears to be Sergio so I am keying in on his swing for comparison.

Some observations that I believe are correct that took me a long time to make sense of (I am sure Erik will jump in if I spread untruths):

  • Bringing the club down is a drop, right arm tight to the side.
  • As I move the club forward the end of the handle is pointing left of the target.
  • I am actively holding the lag, I don't see a way around it.  Commentators always mention the strength needed to maintain lag, can't apply force without tension

As I said it is a work in progress but the the gains in distance and the tightening of dispersion I feel like I am on to something.

What other drills are helpful to learn lag.

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Sounds like you are at the same place I am.  Two of the things I have found helpful. Is practicing dropping and holding lag with a heavy club. It makes it much harder to throw your right arm out.

the other is using a punisher to get the fell of keeping the hand ahead. If you can pleas post a pic or video of your swing.  A3  if you have one.

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Working hard on this as well this winter.  Looking for same results you speak of:  More speed and distance at impact; tighter dispersion if I can repeat the good ones!

Good luck and keep us posted on your progress.

dave

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I don't think you can hold or release lag by thinking about it or timing it.

In my current evolving thought on this subject, I've found that squeezing the elbows together during the swing and keeping the hands ahead of the clubhead at contact is workable for me.

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Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

I don't think you can hold or release lag by thinking about it or timing it.

In my current evolving thought on this subject, I've found that squeezing the elbows together during the swing and keeping the hands ahead of the clubhead at contact is workable for me.

I agree, this is the only way that I can get even start to get some lag with the club.

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The feeling is very subjective.  For me right arm tight to the side, hip rotation moving the club forward, front leg has to straighten to get the hips out of the way.  Then when it is time to release the right hand aggressively releases.  I think Hogan said I wish I had 2 right hands and now I understand why.

I guess my point is that there is tension and it is a very odd unnatural move but when you get it to all come together it is the biggest ah-ha moment I have had.   Still a work in progress but I really believe (with a teaching Pros agreement that I am heading in the right direction) that I am on the right track.

When I get it closer I'll post some video.  Keep your expectations of my swing low, just trying to improve and share some things I have struggled with.

I came back to golf after years of 2x's a year scramble golf with the swing I developed when I was 10 years old.  It has been a journey, I can get around the course but I knew my swing was incorrect and lag was the thing I knew I could not generate.  My buddies where asking why I just don't perfect the swing I have instead of trying to find a new better swing all the time.  Good or bad I think this is the last element.

I am 48 in decent shape, both of my shoulders are shot but generating lag I can hit a 180 yard comfortable 6 iron.  I could NEVER hit a 6 iron 180 in my life.  I have 5 weeks until league starts at 100 balls a day that's 3,500 opportunities to grove this thing.  I am trying to get a lesson once a week during that time to make sure I don't get off course.

Any good drills you guys have had success with.

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Originally Posted by cipher

I agree, this is the only way that I can get even start to get some lag with the club.

Do you have high frame rate video to verify that it is or is not happening?  I swore I I had my hands in front of the ball at impact but I didn't.  Did I have lag?  Yes.  Were my hands in from of the ball no.  That is my goal even if it is just a little, not Sergio type lag but something.

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Wouldn't a divot in front of your golf ball be a great indicator of your hands being in good position at impact? I think that is good feedback on the practice tee
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Originally Posted by inthecup

Do you have high frame rate video to verify that it is or is not happening?  I swore I I had my hands in front of the ball at impact but I didn't.  Did I have lag?  Yes.  Were my hands in from of the ball no.  That is my goal even if it is just a little, not Sergio type lag but something.

In a word no, not high speed.  By feeling the elbows together, which I am literally just starting to learn, you can see how lag increases.  When the right elbow is stuck behind the wrists unhinge early, you have virtually no shaft lean.  In the photo below you can see my wrist are already unhinging.  I think my hands were about even with the ball when I arrived at impact.  On the right is how the hands and elbows should be.

edit: IMO most golfers probably don't have proper lang and forward shaft lean even though they think they do, until they are around scratch.  This is because when you have it, you will be a good ball striker.  I am certainly not one...yet

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Originally Posted by jclark

Wouldn't a divot in front of your golf ball be a great indicator of your hands being in good position at impact? I think that is good feedback on the practice tee

Yes but not in Michigan right now.  Still hitting indoors off a mat.

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Sounds like you're making real progress!

But never, EVER say out loud that you "get" anything in this silly game or the golf gods will surely punish you!

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Originally Posted by VegasRenegade

I checked out your blog and the video by Herman Williams is right on the money.  The big caveat is that your hips have to get out of the way how many times on TV have you heard they say clear the hips.  Obviously rotation clears the hips and also posting up on the front leg.

An interesting experiment is to get into impact position.  Shaft lean forward, back arm tight to the side, hips opening, rear foot starting to come up.  Do that with your front knee bent and then straighten it.  You will see that straightening the front leg allows the hips to clear more.

I am really looking forward to working on this.  I tweaked a muscle in my back and I am laying low for a while.

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Originally Posted by David in FL

Sounds like you're making real progress!

But never, EVER say out loud that you "get" anything in this silly game or the golf gods will surely punish you!

Amen..I mean viva evolution.  That was a close one, I almost gave myself away as a creationist.

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Yes but not in Michigan right now.  Still hitting indoors off a mat.

I hit off mats on occasion. An awesome drill for impact is to put a piece of masking tape down and set your ball ever so slightly forward of the tape. Take a swing. If the tape is still there you made excellent contact down on the ball. If the tape is gone then you hit behind the ball. Instant feedback!

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Originally Posted by David in FL

Sounds like you're making real progress!

But never, EVER say out loud that you "get" anything in this silly game or the golf gods will surely punish you!

Truer words have never been spoken.

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Originally Posted by cipher

Amen..I mean viva evolution.  That was a close one, I almost gave myself away as a creationist.

Denial?  Uh ohhhh.....now you're in for another big snow storm!

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Originally Posted by David in FL

Denial?  Uh ohhhh.....now you're in for another big snow storm!

Actually it will be sunny with a high of 34 next week,  the "universe" is smiling upon me.  Ah who am I kidding, how is the job market these days in FL?

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Originally Posted by jclark

I hit off mats on occasion. An awesome drill for impact is to put a piece of masking tape down and set your ball ever so slightly forward of the tape. Take a swing. If the tape is still there you made excellent contact down on the ball. If the tape is gone then you hit behind the ball. Instant feedback!

I have definitely done that.  Great tool. masking take is also great impact tape.

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