First Annual Pittsburgh/Erie/Cleveland Get-Together (August 3)

[Slice of Life]

Originally Posted by Spyder

It looks like Erik was considering the group as a whole, rather than individual ability. I have the distance and handicap to justify playing the tips as well, but it will probably benefit the group that I am in to play up. I see what you're saying though as in there may be occasions here he doesn't feel like he is able to contribute or shouldn't even tee off. Not to say this will happen or that he should feel like that, but my father would also tell me I'm crazy if I asked him to play the tips at Fox, regardless of the format.

I'm very very interested to see what I'll shoot there. This is about 800 yards longer than the typical courses I play, and way harder based on the course/slope ratings. Even though we can pick up at +2, if possible, I will not be as long as I'm not holding anyone up (Though the goal is no doubles or worse ) . I don't think the distance will change my score too much, it's mostly gonna be based on the trouble surrounding the hole and my ability to make the smart choice.

[Jeremie Boop]

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

I'm very very interested to see what I'll shoot there. This is about 800 yards longer than the typical courses I play, and way harder based on the course/slope ratings. Even though we can pick up at +2, if possible, I will not be as long as I'm not holding anyone up (Though the goal is no doubles or worse ). I don't think the distance will change my score too much, it's mostly gonna be based on the trouble surrounding the hole and my ability to make the smart choice.

Pretty much the same for me, I don't think the extra distance will make much difference for me as I usually have a low iron or wedge on 2nd shots I'll still have a low/mid iron.

[saevel25]

Well i am not sure if we are playing shamble format, were we take 1 tee ball and play in, or if everyone plays the hole. I think Erik said three best ball, reverse stableford right?

I understand slope and rating, matching up. But when a handicap is based on playing a certain range, and now par 4's play as par 5's. I think USGA handicap doesn't cover that well.

[Slice of Life]

Originally Posted by saevel25

Well i am not sure if we are playing shamble format, were we take 1 tee ball and play in, or if everyone plays the hole. I think Erik said three best ball, reverse stableford right?

I understand slope and rating, matching up. But when a handicap is based on playing a certain range, and now par 4's play as par 5's. I think USGA handicap doesn't cover that well.

I hope we're all playing our own ball...

[Jeremie Boop]

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

I hope we're all playing our own ball...

We are all playing our own shots, but the worst score per hole is dropped from the total for stableford scoring purposes.

[Slice of Life]

Originally Posted by Jeremie Boop

We are all playing our own shots, but the worst score per hole is dropped from the total for stableford scoring purposes.

That's what I thought.

[vasaribm]

From earlier ....

Originally Posted by iacas

Here's the deal.

Handicaps will be calculated for the proper tees:

HI * Slope / 113 * 0.8 = Handicap (rounded up or down)

All scores net:

Bogey = 1 point

Par = 2 points

Birdie = 3 points

Eagle = 5 points

Albatross = 8 points

Best 3 of 4 scores for the group.

In other words, if you net par every hole (i.e. shoot your handicap, though at 80% that's difficult), you get 36 (18*2). Birdies and bogeys offset each other. 80% is done because groups are discarding the worst point earner for each hole (best 3 of 4).

It's a very easy scoring system and it lets you pick up if you're at double or worse.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by Jeremie Boop

We are all playing our own shots, but the worst score per hole is dropped from the total for stableford scoring purposes.

And as a general goal for everybody ... in both of the last two outings we did with this format the winning score was around 110.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

There gonna be any "longest drive" or "closest to the pin" holes?

Play it in your own group if you want, but no.

Originally Posted by saevel25

Just to make a slight point, but knowing my dad's game, if he's playing the tips, he wont be able to reach 4 out of the 10 par 4's in two. Some of the other par 4's, he will be hitting 3-wood or 7-woods. Since i think the discussion on playing the right tee's for the player comes up a lot here, wouldn't it be prudent to move those who hit it shorter up to shorter tees. They have there own slope and rating as well, so handicaps should match. Cause if not, then i could easily say my dad's handicap jumps 5-7 strokes from this tee set. He usually plays 5900-6300 yard courses.

Just a heads up, cause i know picking the correct yardage for ability and overall player ability to hit distance is important to enjoyability and fairness.

For his game, looking at the score card, he can handle the 6500. I am just saying that giving him a shot to actually play a par 4 as a par 4 instead of a par 5. If he played the 6500 yard tees, he would only lack distance for par 4 on one of the par 4's.

Handicap is supposed to be the handicap. I set the tees up per group so that the groups could play together and not jump around on different tees. If your dad is truly that short, then he must be pretty darn accurate to play to a 17.0. But it's your guest so I know at least one person in the group is fine moving up (and thus two), so here you go:

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

And as a general goal for everybody ... in both of the last two outings we did with this format the winning score was around 110.

Yeah, but we don't have a bunch of lame sandbaggers in our area of the country. We're honest folk here.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by iacas

Yeah, but we don't have a bunch of lame sandbaggers in our area of the country. We're honest folk here.

Ouch. ;)

[iacas]

BTW, if you'd rather send me the $55 via PayPal ($50 you're able to send it without any of the charges), please send it to me at erik@barzeski.com and list your username in the message area. I'll mark your usernames in this thread to show that you've pre-paid.

Otherwise please bring $50 cash. Thanks.

[saevel25]

I'm not trying to hardball ya here, i am just looking at this from the perspective of playing ability. If GIR's are a great indicator of potential for scoring. Then having the limit of his GIR's be 4-7 opportunities less because of distance, i am not sure the USGA handicap covers this well.

I get handicap is suppose to make things equal, but i think its lacking in this regard.

I just had my concerns that's all. Its up to you, your setting up the outing. I'm not even sure if my dad will want to move up if everyone else is playing from the tips. I was just looking out for him a bit here.

[Slice of Life]

Originally Posted by iacas

Play it in your own group if you want, but no.

Fair enough. I played in an outing once and won the long drive hole. Got a $5 plaque. The following year I played another and just missed the fairway on a drive that would have won it again. The person won a brand new Nike Sasquatch driver. I was pissed...lol

Originally Posted by iacas

Yeah, but we don't have a bunch of lame sandbaggers in our area of the country. We're honest folk here.

LOL!!!

[saevel25]

Originally Posted by iacas

Yeah, but we don't have a bunch of lame sandbaggers in our area of the country. We're honest folk here.

Bazinga!

[iacas]

Originally Posted by saevel25

I get handicap is suppose to make things equal, but i think its lacking in this regard.

I already changed it. As soon as you asked, I changed it.

Not to belabor the point, but par is irrelevant (thus GIR is too) if the course is rated properly. After all a scratch player would be expected to shoot not even par, but 69 on a course rated 68.7 and 74 on a course rated 73.5 - six shots higher. That's true even if the first was a par 72 and the latter a par 71 or something. If your dad is that short but still maintains a true 17.0, then he'd likely be chipping for birdie on those "unreachable" (for him) holes - the same holes the scratch golfer might par or bogey instead of birdieing or parring because the course rating is six shots higher.

And again, I already moved him to the gold tees.

---

bkitt is out. Something about how he's totally *****-whipped. So now the new list is:

[Jeremie Boop]

Originally Posted by Slice of Life

Fair enough. I played in an outing once and won the long drive hole. Got a $5 plaque. The following year I played another and just missed the fairway on a drive that would have won it again. The person won a brand new Nike Sasquatch driver. I was pissed...lol

LOL!!!

Several years ago my group was the 2nd to last out on the course for a scramble. 18th hole was par 5 and the longest drive hole. I set the new long drive by about 15 yds. Strangely enough the group behind us, who didn't have anyone hit nearly that long all day, somehow had someone out drive me. Can't remember what they gave away, but I'm pretty sure it was a brand new driver also. Funny thing was the guys in my group told me that would happen, that even though nobody would beat me I still wouldn't end up winning. It's so sad that people lie/cheat to win stuff.

[saevel25]

Originally Posted by iacas

I already changed it. As soon as you asked, I changed it.

Not to belabor the point, but par is irrelevant (thus GIR is too) if the course is rated properly. After all a scratch player would be expected to shoot not even par, but 69 on a course rated 68.7 and 74 on a course rated 73.5 - six shots higher. If your dad is that short but still maintains a true 17.0, then he'd likely be chipping for birdie on those unreachable holes - the same holes the scratch golfer might par or bogey instead of birdieing or parring because the course rating is six shots higher.

And again, I already moved him to the gold tees.

I think i'm making sense of that. I'm probably making a big deal of nothing. Especially since the format is you pick up if you get double bogey or worse. I'm to use to outings were its a scramble or shamble, which throws out course rating.

[Spyder]

Originally Posted by iacas

I already changed it. As soon as you asked, I changed it.

Not to belabor the point, but par is irrelevant (thus GIR is too) if the course is rated properly. After all a scratch player would be expected to shoot not even par, but 69 on a course rated 68.7 and 74 on a course rated 73.5 - six shots higher. That's true even if the first was a par 72 and the latter a par 71 or something. If your dad is that short but still maintains a true 17.0, then he'd likely be chipping for birdie on those "unreachable" (for him) holes - the same holes the scratch golfer might par or bogey instead of birdieing or parring because the course rating is six shots higher.

And again, I already moved him to the gold tees.

bkitt is out. Something about how he's totally *****-whipped.  So now the new list is:

Slice, you know we have to win this now right?