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ScotchSpeed

Vijay Singh Hole 5 Friday At The Masters

15 posts in this topic

I haven't been able to watch much golf on TV lately but I did watch some highlights of the masters. There is a highlight of Vijay's 5th hole on Friday at the Masters which caught my attention. Vijay appeared to hit his 3rd shot from the putting surface with the flag in and he made it. Assuming the ball had to have come in contact with the stick before resting in the bottom of the cup, I would have expected a 2 stroke penalty for this. Was the ball off the green? Do I just misunderstand the rule or has it been changed?

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Some of the Masters greens had a very fine fringe area that wasn't very noticeable on camera.  I think they trim it down to almost green height just to be evil!

:w00t:

I noticed this in the final round when one of the contenders did the same thing.  You could barely see the fringe.

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I also had some confusion over the green/fringe during the Masters.

I can't remember who/where/when, but I saw a player marking his ball and I thought, "Hang on, he's not on the green!" I pretty much instantly dismissed it as I was sure no top pro would make that mistake and figured it must just be some issue with how the green was cut.

Funny that when you noticed something similar it was reversed and that the ball appeared on the green but was off.

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I also had some confusion over the green/fringe during the Masters.

I can't remember who/where/when, but I saw a player marking his ball and I thought, "Hang on, he's not on the green!" I pretty much instantly dismissed it as I was sure no top pro would make that mistake and figured it must just be some issue with how the green was cut.

Funny that when you noticed something similar it was reversed and that the ball appeared on the green but was off.

One of the guys you're playing with can ask you to mark your ball if you're on the fringe and your ball interferes with his line. But you can't clean it and can't improve your lie.

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One of the guys you're playing with can ask you to mark your ball if you're on the fringe and your ball interferes with his line. But you can't clean it and can't improve your lie.

For sure, but this was a definite marking it on the green situation. Like I say, I'm sure it was just an issue of how the green was cut making it look like a fringe on TV. There was a second line just outside the ball as well which I'm sure was the actual fringe.

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One of the guys you're playing with can ask you to mark your ball if you're on the fringe and your ball interferes with his line. But you can't clean it and can't improve your lie.

Just a little more information.  Ball doesn't have to just interfere with your line.  As a player you may have a ball lifted for mental interference......it's near where you are making your stroke and it bugs you. Also, you can not lift your ball just because you think it interferes with another player.  Only the player playing the stroke may have another ball lifted for interference.

On the other hand, anyone may have any ball lifted ..... including his, if they think it might ASSIST another player.  Like a ball behind the hole that might serve as a backstop for another player.

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Can the other player refuse to mark his ball? Like if I'm not in my partners line and he just claims that it's "bugging" him can I just tell him "Nope. Not marking it. Deal."?
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Can the other player refuse to mark his ball? Like if I'm not in my partners line and he just claims that it's "bugging" him can I just tell him "Nope. Not marking it. Deal."?

What are we - a bunch of jerks or gentlemen?  Mark and lift the ball!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogolf View Post

What are we - a bunch of jerks or gentlemen?  Mark and lift the ball!

But there has to be a "reasonable possiblity" of assisting or interfering. So the rule can not be abused and each case is unique.

From decision 22/3:

Quote:
Rule 22 is intended to cover situations where there is a reasonable possibility that one ball might assist or interfere with another ball. If the Rule is being abused, as in this case, the Committee would be justified in penalising B for undue delay (Rule 6-7).
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Can the other player refuse to mark his ball? Like if I'm not in my partners line and he just claims that it's "bugging" him can I just tell him "Nope. Not marking it. Deal."?

Generally speaking, Rule 3-4 covers this.   Jerks, as Rogolf so aptly put it, are DQ'd.

3-4 . Refusal to Comply with a Rule

If a competitor refuses to comply with a Rule affecting the rights of another competitor , he is disqualified.

3-4/1

Competitor Not Given Opportunity to Lift Ball Assisting Fellow-Competitor

Q. In stroke play, A's ball lies near the hole in a position to assist B, whose ball lies off the putting green. A states his intention to lift his ball under Rule 22-1 . B mistakenly believes that A does not have the right to lift his ball and plays before A has an opportunity to lift his ball. What is the ruling?

A. B is disqualified under Rule 3-4 as he intentionally denied A's right to lift his ball. It is irrelevant that B did so in ignorance of the Rules.

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Yeah, but who decides? Seriously, if you're playing with someone who is anal about having all other balls on the green marked whilst putting, they could demand that you mark your ball even though you're 30 feet away from his line... Is that right?
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As far abusing R22, this gives some guidance.  It's part of what luu5 posted.  I have yet to run into someone that purposely abuses the rule or is that anal.

22/3

Player Requests Another Player to Lift His Ball in Absence of Reasonable Possibility Ball Might Interfere or Assist

Q. A's ball is on the putting green. B's ball is 100 yards from the green. B requests A to lift his ball under Rule 22-2 as it might interfere with his (B's) play. This happens several times during the round. Is such procedure permissible?

A .Rule 22 is intended to cover situations where there is a reasonable possibility that one ball might assist or interfere with another ball. If the Rule is being abused, as in this case, the Committee would be justified in penalizing B for undue delay (Rule 6-7 ).

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Yeah, that's kind of my point I guess... So much time is wasted by unnecessary marking of balls, but that's more off topic.
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