One Handed Swing Faster?

[ryunin]

This puzzles me. I decided to try a gripped shaft to practice natural, "swinging"  swing with the correct hip rotation, nice lag, weight shift etc. It seems everything is more natural, easier with the one handed swing with a shaft. I have almost no problem to clear my hips naturally and shift weight naturally. I can see this when I compare a video of my one handed swing with a shaft and two handed swing with a club, The longer the club, the more difficult it is and my confidence is gradually lost. But the question is - even with the gripped shaft, once I   hold it with both hands, the speed of the swing is lost and I feel something is braking my swing. Either it is absolutely impossible to swing the shaft with both hands at the same speed as with one hand, or I am doing something very wrong once I hold it two handed. But at least to make the swing as swift as possible, I have to make sure I rotate my shoulder freely forward, I clear the hips and release, still it is impossible to reach the free, quick swing speed unless I use just one hand, right or left.

[Abu3baid]

  ryunin said:

This puzzles me. I decided to try a gripped shaft to practice natural, "swinging"  swing with the correct hip rotation, nice lag, weight shift etc. It seems everything is more natural, easier with the one handed swing with a shaft. I have almost no problem to clear my hips naturally and shift weight naturally. I can see this when I compare a video of my one handed swing with a shaft and two handed swing with a club, The longer the club, the more difficult it is and my confidence is gradually lost. But the question is - even with the gripped shaft, once I   hold it with both hands, the speed of the swing is lost and I feel something is braking my swing. Either it is absolutely impossible to swing the shaft with both hands at the same speed as with one hand, or I am doing something very wrong once I hold it two handed. But at least to make the swing as swift as possible, I have to make sure I rotate my shoulder freely forward, I clear the hips and release, still it is impossible to reach the free, quick swing speed unless I use just one hand, right or left.

I haven't done any scientific studies, but it feels to me that I am able to swing faster with one hand than with two.

The bigger point is going to be, even if that is the case I doubt that "most" people would be able to hit the ball consistently with 1 hand the way they do with two.. Also, this probably only applies to the driver or 3W maybe, but once you get to irons good luck swinging with 1 hand with any consistency compared to two.

Maybe someone has some scientific knowledge to enlighten us.

[ryunin]

  Abu3baid said:

I haven't done any scientific studies, but it feels to me that I am able to swing faster with one hand than with two.

The bigger point is going to be, even if that is the case I doubt that "most" people would be able to hit the ball consistently with 1 hand the way they do with two.. Also, this probably only applies to the driver or 3W maybe, but once you get to irons good luck swinging with 1 hand with any consistency compared to two.

Maybe someone has some scientific knowledge to enlighten us.

Thank you for your reaction. I have no doubt that with two hands one is more precise, I would just like to know if it makes sense that one is faster with one hand or does a really good - say scratch golfer - swing as fast with one hand as they swing with two hands, in other words, does the necessity of two hands slow down the swing: Maybe with a real club it is possible and fairly easy to find the same speed, but impossible with a light shaft as there is no weight at the end, in other words, as the swingweight is basically zero, there is nothing that would help the two hands find the same tempo and speed. My hypothesis. For example with a driver I feel absolutely no brake just because I use both hands, on the contrary I feel the two hands help me swing faster. But if the gripped shaft which has basically no swingweight reveals a very slow swing with two hands, it may show a huge flaw in the body movements, rotation etc. Does this make sense?

[ryunin]

Anyway if I can ask the kind members to grab any kind of stick, and compare the swing one handed and two handed. If anyone is able to swing the stick two handed with the same speed as one handed, I'd like to know how they do it.  And if they can do it, their swing with two hands and a club may be bettter than the swing of those who swing a stick or shaft faster with one hand.

[Abu3baid]

  ryunin said:

Anyway if I can ask the kind members to grab any kind of stick, and compare the swing one handed and two handed. If anyone is able to swing the stick two handed with the same speed as one handed, I'd like to know how they do it.  And if they can do it, their swing with two hands and a club may be bettter than the swing of those who swing a stick or shaft faster with one hand.

Well, we do have a couple of members working with SuperSpeedGolf to increase their swing speed.  They have monitors with them, so they can do this test rather easily if you really want to know the answer.  Although, I think without the restriction of my other hand I can probably just get a much bigger turn and I can swing out of my socks a lot easier.  I think @boogielicious is involved in the below mentioned testing right?

[iacas]

I'm highly doubtful that one hand is ever really going to be faster than two for a golf swing.

[ryunin]

I think I found out what slowed my swing with two hands. I compared the two again yesterday and while my right arm solo makes a good lag, my left arm solo produced almost none. Then with two arms the left arm prevents the right one to make that nice lag, hence the slowing of the swing. Maybe most people thought that my OP was irrelevant or silly but I think I found a big mistake in my swing through this problem.

[Torres9]

I did not think your post was silly at all. This is very interesting to me. Help me understand. So if you only swing with your left arm you have those qualities, but I'm confused over your discovery with the right?

[ryunin]

  Torres9 said:

I did not think your post was silly at all. This is very interesting to me. Help me understand. So if you only swing with your left arm you have those qualities, but I'm confused over your discovery with the right?

When I swung with my right arm, I kind of naturally developed a lot of lag, without realizing it. I just felt I was swinging very naturally and quickly without much effort. It was the lag. This lag means more speed of course, and the higher swish sound. With the left arm, I didn't try it much or didn't notice much, but when I engaged both hands I felt immediate brake. Then I tried just left arm and noticed it was really slower. Then I discovered that with my left arm I don't make much lag, almost none. THen I tried both arms and saw the left arm prevented the right arm to develop the lag so the swing was slower. Now when I swing with both hands I focus on left arm making lag and the feeling is very different. I think with this superlight gripped shaft this is very apparent, but with a normal club the mistake is hidden as the heavier club means that the lack of lag in the left arm is less apparent. The heaviness of the club makes us believe both arms are connected and working together, even if in fact the left arm may slow down the swing without us noticing.  I believe if anyone has a much slower swing with a light stick when using both arms as opposed to quick swing with one arm, it shows a big mistake somewhere, and maybe in the lack of lag of the left arm.

[Lihu]

  ryunin said:

When I swung with my right arm, I kind of naturally developed a lot of lag, without realizing it. I just felt I was swinging very naturally and quickly without much effort. It was the lag. This lag means more speed of course, and the higher swish sound. With the left arm, I didn't try it much or didn't notice much, but when I engaged both hands I felt immediate brake. Then I tried just left arm and noticed it was really slower. Then I discovered that with my left arm I don't make much lag, almost none. THen I tried both arms and saw the left arm prevented the right arm to develop the lag so the swing was slower. Now when I swing with both hands I focus on left arm making lag and the feeling is very different. I think with this superlight gripped shaft this is very apparent, but with a normal club the mistake is hidden as the heavier club means that the lack of lag in the left arm is less apparent. The heaviness of the club makes us believe both arms are connected and working together, even if in fact the left arm may slow down the swing without us noticing.  I believe if anyone has a much slower swing with a light stick when using both arms as opposed to quick swing with one arm, it shows a big mistake somewhere, and maybe in the lack of lag of the left arm.

What are you telling us?

[ryunin]

  Lihu said:

What are you telling us?

Maybe, not sure, but maybe that one is not aware that they don't make lag with one arm, whereas the other is willing to make lag. So if we discover that one arm is preventing the lag, we can start working on lag with that one lazy arm and make it part of the swing. If it is possible to transfer the new habit from a gripped shaft to a real club, then this may be a good thing to know for people with little lag in one of their arms which consequently becomes little lag in both arms.

[iacas]

  ryunin said:

Maybe, not sure, but maybe that one is not aware that they don't make lag with one arm, whereas the other is willing to make lag. So if we discover that one arm is preventing the lag, we can start working on lag with that one lazy arm and make it part of the swing. If it is possible to transfer the new habit from a gripped shaft to a real club, then this may be a good thing to know for people with little lag in one of their arms which consequently becomes little lag in both arms.

I don't think you "make lag." I think you have a somewhat fundamental misunderstanding. Lag is a result of good sequencing and some other things, but you don't really "make" it.

"Lag happens."

[ryunin]

  iacas said:

I don't think you "make lag." I think you have a somewhat fundamental misunderstanding. Lag is a result of good sequencing and some other things, but you don't really "make" it.

"Lag happens."

It's always a matter of discussion what happens based on one's will and what happens based on the movements of the body in the golf swing. I get that. But I can definitely decide if I have or don't have a lag in my swing. Even if I leave something passive , it is my will to leave it passive, it is not somebody elses will. That's why there are drills to improve lag. But of course, these drills train to let something go, to leave something to the sequencing or whatever, but there must be one's decision to do something about it. It doesn't happen without one's will to change something. So now Ican decide swinging with my left arm, to :make lag, or have lag, or give it lag, or whatever you call it, but I can decide, nobody else can decide that for me. BUt if you have no idea how to improve a part of swing, then of course, one is helpless, and needs some instructions.

[brice]

  ryunin said:

It's always a matter of discussion what happens based on one's will and what happens based on the movements of the body in the golf swing. I get that. But I can definitely decide if I have or don't have a lag in my swing. Even if I leave something passive , it is my will to leave it passive, it is not somebody elses will. That's why there are drills to improve lag. But of course, these drills train to let something go, to leave something to the sequencing or whatever, but there must be one's decision to do something about it. It doesn't happen without one's will to change something. So now Ican decide swinging with my left arm, to :make lag, or have lag, or give it lag, or whatever you call it, but I can decide, nobody else can decide that for me. BUt if you have no idea how to improve a part of swing, then of course, one is helpless, and needs some instructions.

where can I get what you're smoking

[iacas]

  ryunin said:

It's always a matter of discussion what happens based on one's will and what happens based on the movements of the body in the golf swing. I get that. But I can definitely decide if I have or don't have a lag in my swing. Even if I leave something passive , it is my will to leave it passive, it is not somebody elses will. That's why there are drills to improve lag. But of course, these drills train to let something go, to leave something to the sequencing or whatever, but there must be one's decision to do something about it. It doesn't happen without one's will to change something. So now Ican decide swinging with my left arm, to :make lag, or have lag, or give it lag, or whatever you call it, but I can decide, nobody else can decide that for me. BUt if you have no idea how to improve a part of swing, then of course, one is helpless, and needs some instructions.

My honest opinion of what you typed there: that's a whole lot of nothing. It's words, but you haven't really said anything that's going to help you with your golf swing. Yes, you can strive to make something "more passive" or whatever, but that's certainly no guarantee you'll actually do it.

Proper "lag" cannot really be manufactured. You cannot really say to yourself "I will create lag on this next swing" and make a better swing. 99% of the world's amateur golfers flip. You've listed "54" as your handicap index so you almost definitely flip. You don't create or sustain lag long enough.

There's a LOT of great information on this site. Stick around, read around, ask questions, participate, learn, post your videos in a "My Swing" thread in the Member Swings forum, etc.

[SavvySwede]

  iacas said:

I'm highly doubtful that one hand is ever really going to be faster than two for a golf swing.

I'm pretty sure he was saying it was a bare shaft with no head. With no weight or resistance I would think the dominant arm could swing faster without the slower arm holding it back. Both arms would certainly be faster if there were any real resistance to overcome.

[Shorty]

  ryunin said:

It's always a matter of discussion what happens based on one's will and what happens based on the movements of the body in the golf swing. I get that. But I can definitely decide if I have or don't have a lag in my swing. Even if I leave something passive , it is my will to leave it passive, it is not somebody elses will. That's why there are drills to improve lag. But of course, these drills train to let something go, to leave something to the sequencing or whatever, but there must be one's decision to do something about it. It doesn't happen without one's will to change something. So now Ican decide swinging with my left arm, to :make lag, or have lag, or give it lag, or whatever you call it, but I can decide, nobody else can decide that for me. BUt if you have no idea how to improve a part of swing, then of course, one is helpless, and needs some instructions.

Dear me. What on earth are you on about?

Will......leaving things passive........making decisions for yourself..........not letting others decide for you..........

Imagine having an instructor who babbled on like this.

[ryunin]

I'll try to express myself clearly and realistically.

Fact Nr One: With a gripped shaft I was swinging much faster with right arm than with both arms.

Fact Nr Two: I was puzzled.

Fact Nr Three: I noticed that swinging with my right arm only, I unhinge later. My Opinion:  This leads to faster swing and sometimes is called lag.

Fact Nr Four: I noticed that swinging with my left arm only, I unhinge very early. My Opinion:  This leads to slower swing and sometimes is called "not enough lag".

Fact Nr Five: I tried to unhinge later with my left arm only, practicing a couple of swings. I could see I can unhinge later if I want to. Opinion: I created lag in my left arm.

Fact Nr Six: When I used both arms and made sure I unhinge later, I could see that at last I can swing with both arms as quickly as with just right arm.

Opinion: If you make sure you unhinge late enough, swinging your gripped shaft, you don't slow down the swing. Opinion: This principle is reflected with a real club. Even with a real club, if one arm unhinges too late and prevents the other arm unhinge in the process, you slow down the swing unnecessarily.