Can a ball move both ways? (draw followed by fade)

[iacas]

@Lihu, the ball's pretty much just spinning and stops doing whatever impact causes not long at all after impact.

[Lihu]

13 minutes ago, iacas said:

@Lihu, the ball's pretty much just spinning and stops doing whatever impact causes not long at all after impact.

I can see that the designs are probably converging on something that dampens any vibrations quickly. Makes sense to me.

Off hand I just had to ask at the very minimum from an engineers perspective "What is the thickness of the boundary layer surrounding the ball?", "What is the oscillation magnitude after a few seconds?", "What are the shapes of those oscillations?". The dimples are relatively shallow and "What is the effect of any residual deformation upon the aerodynamics of the dimples?". "What is dampening the oscillations?", etc. and many more come to mind that have to do with the direction(s) of the primary oscillation etc.

It's not all that simple to me at least, but I'm sure people in the golf industry have more information and a better understanding of golf ball dynamics. So, if the simple answer is that within a few hundred milliseconds the vibrations are nearly nullified, then that makes sense to me. If I were to design a golf ball that's certainly what I would attempt as well. . .

[iacas]

11 minutes ago, Lihu said:

It's not all that simple to me at least, but I'm sure people in the golf industry have more information and a better understanding of golf ball dynamics. So, if the simple answer is that within a few hundred milliseconds the vibrations are nearly nullified, then that makes sense to me. If I were to design a golf ball that's certainly what I would attempt as well. . .

It's within a very, very short span of time, yes.

The bold, seriously, goes without saying… Yes, the Titleist golf ball engineers know more about it than a Roomba engineer.

[Lihu]

5 minutes ago, iacas said:

It's within a very, very short span of time, yes.

The bold, seriously, goes without saying… Yes, the Titleist golf ball engineers know more about it than a Roomba engineer.

All I can say is it's really amazing how far ball technology has come.

[iacas]

4 minutes ago, Lihu said:

All I can say is it's really amazing how far ball technology has come.

How long do you think a gutta percha oscillated internally after being struck? Or a featherie?

Back on topic now, please…

As I understand it, an undamaged golf ball cannot, of its own, draw and fade (or vice versa).

[dkolo]

2 hours ago, Golfingdad said:

But you clearly have enough of an understanding of it. :)  Once the ball is hit, no forces are acting on it besides the air and gravity.

Don't forget Murphy's Law.

[vangator]

On a range. I often find balls that are damaged that will do multiple moves during flight.  On the course, I believe a damaged ball can do funny things.  Much like a baseball pitcher can do with a scuffed baseball.

Also, years ago I found a Polara golf ball.  The dimples on the equator are deeper than the dimples on the poles.  On the tee, line up the ball with the deeper dimples down range and the ball will self correct itself.  Can't remember how the flight was affected from the turf since the ball could have any alignment.

Also, if the ball weren't completely symmetrical on the inside, you could have movement.  Much like a gyro scope.  Or maybe more like a bowling ball.  I've been a bowler for many years and have seen the evolution of weight blocks within bowling balls.  That's why bowling balls hook.

[Dave325]

I might have thought that this behavior was due to a malformed golf ball, but reading the opening statement by the OP, it sounds like this did not happen just once or twice. This almost has the appearance of a knuckleball in baseball (shrug). Someone gave me a square ball as a gag gift awhile ago that had a strange action and sounded like a rocket taking off as it cut through the air. Very impressive, but lacked distance.

20 hours ago, ZappyAd said:

Every so often when I hit my G30 driver I seem to get a shot that starts off shaping left, reaches its apex and then starts moving to the right as it comes down.   It isn't a big move either way (each movement looks like it would be 5 yards or so if it was consistent for the whole shot). I thought maybe it was an optical illusion from the way I was leaning or something but it doesn't happen all the time.  However it does happen reasonably often (maybe once in 20 practice shots on the range).

I was thinking it might be possible to explain it because I am randomly getting some kind of rotation of the spin axis, like draw + topspin where the topspin eventually reverses the side spin. It isn't particularly a problem just wondering if it could actually be real or if I am just not seeing it right.

On this topic, to the OP... Are you able to reproduce this swing that makes this action? Maybe make a video of the swing? Does this only happen at the range? Have you seen this action with your own ball on the course? Just thinking.

[vangator]

1 hour ago, Dave325 said:

I might have thought that this behavior was due to a malformed golf ball, but reading the opening statement by the OP, it sounds like this did not happen just once or twice. This almost has the appearance of a knuckleball in baseball (shrug). Someone gave me a square ball as a gag gift awhile ago that had a strange action and sounded like a rocket taking off as it cut through the air. Very impressive, but lacked distance.

On this topic, to the OP... Are you able to reproduce this swing that makes this action? Maybe make a video of the swing? Does this only happen at the range? Have you seen this action with your own ball on the course? Just thinking.

How does that square ball putt?

Also, I doubt I've ever had a bucket of range balls where there isn't at least one ball that won't behave funny.  I typically hit the nasty balls first when I'm still stiff because I know their flight might be nasty too.

[Dave325]

1 hour ago, vangator said:

How does that square ball putt?

Interestingly enough, I never found it after hitting it off the tee.... It went every which way but straight. It would not be good on the green. For sure. ?

[ZappyAd]

On 12/01/2016 at 0:47 PM, Dave325 said:

On this topic, to the OP... Are you able to reproduce this swing that makes this action? Maybe make a video of the swing? Does this only happen at the range? Have you seen this action with your own ball on the course? Just thinking.

I am not sure what I am doing to make it happen but I will try to look out for it more.  (I am normally concentrating on something else when I'm hitting so its always a bit of surprise when it happens).  And I think it is only happening on the range but again I'll try and keep more of a look out on the course.