Throwback question 1980s and early 90s

[onthehunt526]

Hi TST Universe,

I've been watching some mid-to-late 1980s and early 1990s golf coverage on YouTube and being doing some light research...

So for you more experienced members of the site, here's the setup. 

I was watching a few tournaments from yesteryear, and noticed something very interesting. More than a few golfers did this and I have examples... Why did several pros choose to play a wooden-headed driver, and metal fairways.

Curtis Strange not withstanding as he played all metal woods, I have at least five examples of this.

Davis Love III, had a persimmon driver and a metal "2-wood" when he was a rookie in 1986.

Fred Couples had a persimmon driver and metal 3-wood when he won the 1992 Masters.

Nick Faldo did the same when he won his first three majors... (he had a metal driver at the 1990 Open Championship)

Greg Norman in the late 80s had that Bridgestone 3-wood for like 17 years, but had a wood driver until the early 90s.

Mike Donald at the 1990 U.S. Open, had a wooden driver and a Taylor Made Tour Brassie that he used well...

I could keep going with the amount of metal fairways in combination with wooden drivers, but that could take all days...

Did any of you do this? Do you guys/gals maybe know why tour pros would do this? Rumor has it, Tiger even had a similar set-up prior to winning the Junior Amateur in 1991.

[Patch]

My guess is either they were comfortable with the wood/metal mix, or perhaps it was a manufacturer's endorsement thing. 

I have a complete set of Ping Eye 2 woods that I like to play sometimes just for the heck of it. They still play well after all these years.

[saevel25]

My best guess, stuck in their ways. Metal wood technology was just starting back then. It's easy to put a 3-wood in the bag you might not use as much as a driver. Also back then, a metal 3-wood was probably the same size as a wood persimmon driver. Not sure how heavy and chunky a driver was. I know the first time I saw a 460 cc driver I thought it was absurdly large. Now I am use to it. 

It's probably more of a comfort and does it fit in their game. I wonder if a few guys were a wait and see situation. Maybe see how other players performed using a metal fairway wood. 

 

[onthehunt526]

1 minute ago, Patch said:

 

It could have been a feel thing for the driver and needing to get the ball up in the air with the fairway(s).

[ppine]

I played with persimmon woods for decades before changing over to metal.  There is something unmistakable and satisfying about hitting one well. The sound and the feel are totally different.  They look nice. They can be unforgiving so people eventually gave up on them. Young people who have never hit one should find one and try it.

The greatest shot I ever hit was a persimmon 4 wood on the par 5 first hole at Congressional in a match to 8 feet. People used to carry 1,2, 3 and 4 woods.  A nine iron was like today's gap wedge.

 

Edited February 28, 2016 by ppine

[Patch]

I still think that a Ping Eye 2, two wood is one the best clubs every made for a beginner. That is you can even find one these days. 

[SavvySwede]

I just didn't matter. The original steel heads were no better performance wise until the Big Bertha came out in 91'. DLIII was still able to lead the PGA Tour in driving distance with a persimmon in 94'

[iacas]

Plus, bigger driver heads in metal were heavy, so they were fine for smaller woods.

[Fourputt]

7 hours ago, saevel25 said:

My best guess, stuck in their ways. Metal wood technology was just starting back then. It's easy to put a 3-wood in the bag you might not use as much as a driver. Also back then, a metal 3-wood was probably the same size as a wood persimmon driver. Not sure how heavy and chunky a driver was. I know the first time I saw a 460 cc driver I thought it was absurdly large. Now I am use to it. 

It's probably more of a comfort and does it fit in their game. I wonder if a few guys were a wait and see situation. Maybe see how other players performed using a metal fairway wood. 

 

Actually the early metal 3 woods had tiny heads, smaller than their wooden counterparts.  The early wooden drivers were small too.

3 hours ago, SavvySwede said:

I just didn't matter. The original steel heads were no better performance wise until the Big Bertha came out in 91'. DLIII was still able to lead the PGA Tour in driving distance with a persimmon in 94'

While that as probably true for the pros, it was not so for us amateurs.  Even the early TM metal drivers were more forgiving, and thus longer on average than the wooden ones.  This was true even though most still had steel shafts.  Graphite technology was still in its infancy.  I had 2 TM drivers back in the late 80's, a 9.5° Burner, and an 8.5° Tour Driver (I kept this one until 2012 and still used it occasionally for fun), and both were tiny, both had True Temper Gold steel shafts.  I don't have a photo to compare the wooden heads, but here is my Tour Driver compared to an R7.

[Dan42nepa]

Same here.. I remember I had turf devil metal fairway woods but used my comfortable persimmon driver for years.

[SavvySwede]

27 minutes ago, Fourputt said:

Actually the early metal 3 woods had tiny heads, smaller than their wooden counterparts.  The early wooden drivers were small too.

While that as probably true for the pros, it was not so for us amateurs.  Even the early TM metal drivers were more forgiving, and thus longer on average than the wooden ones.  This was true even though most still had steel shafts.  Graphite technology was still in its infancy.  I had 2 TM drivers back in the late 80's, a 9.5° Burner, and an 8.5° Tour Driver (I kept this one until 2012 and still used it occasionally for fun), and both were tiny, both had True Temper Gold steel shafts.  I don't have a photo to compare the wooden heads, but here is my Tour Driver compared to an R7.
 

I'm just going to disagree there. I have one of those old TM drivers almost identical to yours and prefer my PING Eye persimmon driver over it.

[Fourputt]

Just now, SavvySwede said:

I'm just going to disagree there. I have one of those old TM drivers almost identical to yours and prefer my  PING Eye persimmon driver over it. 

You are also a low single digit handicapper.  I was never better than a 10, and for me, the TM was both long and straight (straight meaning that my 10 yard fade was as dependable as any club I ever owned).  

I played a high fade with the 8.5° Tour Driver, and used the 9.5° Burner driver as a fairway wood.  I averaged over 250 yards with my Tour Driver in a day when the pros were only hitting about 270-280 with persimmon.  Persimmon was also more expensive than the new metal drivers, which was a definite consideration for me.  I didn't pay more than $90 for either one.  I looked at a 7° Tour Driver with a graphite shaft, but at $110 it was out of my price range. 

[SavvySwede]

2 minutes ago, Fourputt said:

You are also a low single digit handicapper.  I was never better than a 10, and for me, the TM was both long and straight (straight meaning that my 10 yard fade was as dependable as any club I ever owned).  

I played a high fade with the 8.5° Tour Driver, and used the 9.5° Burner driver as a fairway wood.  I averaged over 250 yards with my Tour Driver in a day when the pros were only hitting about 270-280 with persimmon.  Persimmon was also more expensive than the new metal drivers, which was a definite consideration for me.  I didn't pay more than $90 for either one.  I looked at a 7° Tour Driver with a graphite shaft, but at $110 it was out of my price range. 

I still mishit them plenty enough . And I've played full rounds with both despite neither being from my time period.

[Fourputt]

11 minutes ago, SavvySwede said:

I still mishit them plenty enough . And I've played full rounds with both despite neither being from my time period.

I played mine exclusively for more than a decade.  And I had a wood (not persimmon) driver for more than a decade before I got the first TM.  I didn't start to play what I'd recognize as golf until I got that first metal driver and got my tee shots under some sort of control.

[onthehunt526]

8 hours ago, SavvySwede said:

I just didn't matter. The original steel heads were no better performance wise until the Big Bertha came out in 91'. DLIII was still able to lead the PGA Tour in driving distance with a persimmon in 94'

DLIII was just stupid long, in his 20s and early 30s. Rumor has it, he hit Driver, 7-iron to the then 497-yard, par-5 16th at TPC Sawgrass in the '86 Players, and fatted the 7-iron to 5 feet and made eagle. With a persimmon Driver and when a 7-iron was still a 7-iron... I also heard he hit that same persimmon driver and a 9-iron to the 500-yard, par-5, 15th at Augusta... A wood driver and a Balata ball... The first metal Driver he played I believe was the Titleist 975D when he won the '97 PGA...

[SavvySwede]

7 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

DLIII was just stupid long, in his 20s and early 30s. Rumor has it, he hit Driver, 7-iron to the then 497-yard, par-5 16th at TPC Sawgrass in the '86 Players, and fatted the 7-iron to 5 feet and made eagle. With a persimmon Driver and when a 7-iron was still a 7-iron... I also heard he hit that same persimmon driver and a 9-iron to the 500-yard, par-5, 15th at Augusta... A wood driver and a Balata ball... The first metal Driver he played I believe was the Titleist 975D when he won the '97 PGA...

You make it sound like he had no competition. Fred Couples and Greg Norman were also crazy long and used steel heads, they didn't edge him out because the steel heads weren't bringing more to the table. The was no diffrence in COR or ballspeed until PING came out with the TISI in 1998.

[onthehunt526]

2 hours ago, SavvySwede said:

You make it sound like he had no competition. Fred Couples and Greg Norman were also crazy long and used steel heads, they didn't edge him out because the steel heads weren't bringing more to the table. The was no diffrence in COR or ballspeed until PING came out with the TISI in 1998.

He had competition, but John Daly wasn't even on the Driving Distance list in 1994 (and he won the BellSouth Classic), Fred and Greg Norman were both in the top 5 in '94. I was just pointing out how stupid long DLIII was... Even with him being one of the last persimmon holdouts.

[Fourputt]

1 hour ago, onthehunt526 said:

He had competition, but John Daly wasn't even on the Driving Distance list in 1994 (and he won the BellSouth Classic), Fred and Greg Norman were both in the top 5 in '94. I was just pointing out how stupid long DLIII was... Even with him being one of the last persimmon holdouts.

For a time early in his career Davis didn't even use a driver because he was too long and didn't have fine enough control with it.  His tee play was predominantly 1 iron at that time.