Article: Human nasal bacteria might be superbug killer

[boogielicious]

http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/28/health/nasal-bacteria-superbug-killer/index.html

I'm really not sure what do say. But here goes.

"Fifty Bucks says Smails kid picks his nose and protects himself against harmful pathogens."

[natureboy]

What an appropriate post given your user name - just substitute 'er' for the 'ie'. 

Despite our modern 'gross out' at nose picking. You'd have to think that evolution would have eliminated this habit if it wasn't somehow adaptive / beneficial (provided your hands are clean).

[boogielicious]

34 minutes ago, natureboy said:

What an appropriate post given your user name - just substitute 'er' for the 'ie'. 

Despite our modern 'gross out' at nose picking. You'd have to think that evolution would have eliminated this habit if it wasn't somehow adaptive / beneficial (provided your hands are clean).

[Patch]

Some doctors think that swallowing the mucus of a runny nose strengthens the immune system. Swallowing buggers probably does the same thing if true. We do add the flu virus to our bodies to keep from catching the full blown version of it.  Luckily I am too old to start that type of booger health regime.  I do get flu shots however. Then there's all those kids shots we all got when growing up. I wunder what viruses/bacteria were in them. 

[natureboy]

49 minutes ago, Patch said:

Some doctors think that swallowing the mucus of a runny nose strengthens the immune system. Swallowing buggers probably does the same thing if true. We do add the flu virus to our bodies to keep from catching the full blown version of it.  Luckily I am too old to start that type of booger health regime.  I do get flu shots however. Then there's all those kids shots we all got when growing up. I wunder what viruses/bacteria were in them. 

I wouldn't be surprised. A mini bacteriology / virology sampling and sequencing lab. The gut apparently is a big player in the immune system.

? I could see a pathway like this: potential pathogens / allergens get trapped in mucous and 'foreign' / unfamiliar material is attacked by macrophages that weaken somehow 'tag' potential threats. The whole mess is further rendered un-threatening by stomach acid and bile that breaks open the protective cell wall / capsid then sequences the 'threat' DNA / rNA into chunks that get 'processed' by the immune system cells and nerves in the gut. A high volume of 'threat' kicks the immune response into gear while low volume threats get added to the antibody library. ?

I had an interesting experience of the brain/gut interaction with peanuts in college. I grew up with a mild allergy to peanuts that enabled me to tolerate a small amount with jelly if hungry. One time I had such a sandwich made with 'natural' peanut butter that wasn't too well mixed and had a high ratio of peanut oil. After eating, beyond a merely scratchy throat, I could feel a mild state of shock overtake me and feel the waves of peristalsis going down my swollen esophagus when I sipped some water. I stayed where I was and did some deep breathing (in through nose out through mouth) for about a half an hour until I felt back to normal. From that day forward peanuts never bothered me again (even 'natural' stuff with lots of oil).

I think my conscious reaction helped 'reeducate' the gut that the peanut was a mis-perceived threat. My understanding that there was nothing inherently dangerous to humans from a peanut other than the allergic reaction itself helped me stick it out. May have been unwise, but if the symptoms had worsened I would have gone to the infirmary.

Edited July 28, 2016 by natureboy

[GolfLug]

48 minutes ago, natureboy said:

I wouldn't be surprised. A mini bacteriology / virology sampling and sequencing lab. The gut apparently is a big player in the immune system.

? I could see a pathway like this: potential pathogens / allergens get trapped in mucous and 'foreign' / unfamiliar material is attacked by macrophages that weaken somehow 'tag' potential threats. The whole mess is further rendered un-threatening by stomach acid and bile that breaks open the protective cell wall / capsid then sequences the 'threat' DNA / rNA into chunks that get 'processed' by the immune system cells and nerves in the gut. A high volume of 'threat' kicks the immune response into gear while low volume threats get added to the antibody library. ?

I had an interesting experience of the brain/gut interaction with peanuts in college. I grew up with a mild allergy to peanuts that enabled me to tolerate a small amount with jelly if hungry. One time I had such a sandwich made with 'natural' peanut butter that wasn't too well mixed and had a high ratio of peanut oil. After eating, beyond a merely scratchy throat, I could feel a mild state of shock overtake me and feel the waves of peristalsis going down my swollen esophagus when I sipped some water. I stayed where I was and did some deep breathing (in through nose out through mouth) for about a half an hour until I felt back to normal. From that day forward peanuts never bothered me again (even 'natural' stuff with lots of oil).

I think my conscious reaction helped 'reeducate' the gut that the peanut was a mis-perceived threat. My understanding that there was nothing inherently dangerous to humans from a peanut other than the allergic reaction itself helped me stick it out. May have been unwise, but if the symptoms had worsened I would have gone to the infirmary.

That is interesting. My first reaction is conscious teaching of level involuntary threat perception can be done only if it involves one or more of the 5 senses. Teaching an autonomous system like immune system sounds like a bit of a stretch, IMHO, but I will give you that in this realm what we (medical science) don't know is much more than what is known so I am not discounting it completely considering you wiped it off your allergen list permanently

But, wow, I am genuinely impressed with your attempt.  

 

[natureboy]

23 minutes ago, GolfLug said:

That is interesting. My first reaction is conscious teaching of level involuntary threat perception can be done only if it involves one or more of the 5 senses. Teaching an autonomous system like immune system sounds like a bit of a stretch, IMHO, but I will give you that in this realm what we (medical science) don't know is much more than what is known so I am not discounting it completely considering you wiped it off your allergen list permanently

But, wow, I am genuinely impressed with your attempt.  

But there's no actual physical threat from the peanut itself absent the allergic reaction, right?

As I understand, there's a lot of nerve, neurotransmitter, and hormonal cross-talk between brain and the gut. I can't imagine it's completely one-sided though likely quite diffuse / indirect in the conscious to autonomic direction. The higher functions of the brain do influence our autonomic stress response and I expect if I had 'panicked' and allowed the stress hormone levels to elevate, the 'autonomic' cascade of symptoms may well have been worse.

I am sure that the relative mildness of the original allergy helped a lot. It was sort of an accidental experiment. Obviously, I wouldn't advise inducing even a 'mild' anaphylactic reaction on purpose. Too much of a dice roll.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enteric_nervous_system

Edited July 28, 2016 by natureboy

[GolfLug]

4 minutes ago, natureboy said:

But there's no actual physical threat from the peanut itself absent the allergic reaction, right?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enteric_nervous_system

No, but there is historical evidence in the library that it or something resembling it is a threat. It didn't come from nothing.

6 minutes ago, natureboy said:

But there's no actual physical threat from the peanut itself absent the allergic reaction, right?

As I understand, there's a lot of nerve, neurotransmitter, and hormonal cross-talk between brain and the gut. I can't imagine it's completely one-sided though likely quite diffuse / indirect in the conscious to autonomic direction. The higher functions of the brain do influence our autonomic stress response and I expect if I had 'panicked' and allowed the stress hormone levels to elevate, the 'autonomic' cascade of symptoms may well have been worse.

I am sure that the relative mildness of the original allergy helped a lot. It was sort of an accidental experiment. Obviously, I wouldn't advise inducing even a 'mild' anaphylactic reaction on purpose. Too much of a dice roll.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enteric_nervous_system

Yes and Yes. It's just that it is only 'officially' knwn to work on perceptions from the 5 senses which are atleast somewhat involuntary. Conscious teaching of gut to ignore threat as you did is kinda stuff that is either brilliant or gets folks killed...

Anyway, glad it worked to your benefit. My daughter is allergic to peanuts (oderate to heavy depending on what) and I guard her like a hawk.

[natureboy]

5 minutes ago, GolfLug said:

No, but there is historical evidence in the library that it or something resembling it is a threat. It didn't come from nothing.

I'd have to say my experience argues for the library record as 'unfamiliar antigen' resembling some coded historic threat. The allergy could also be evidence of a sensitivity to plant produced self-defense toxins that are mild enough to be relatively low-cost (in the short term at least) vs net nutritional benefit.

5 minutes ago, GolfLug said:

My daughter is allergic to peanuts (oderate to heavy depending on what) and I guard her like a hawk.

Good parenting!

[natureboy]

On 7/28/2016 at 4:15 PM, GolfLug said:

Anyway, glad it worked to your benefit. My daughter is allergic to peanuts (oderate to heavy depending on what) and I guard her like a hawk.

Possible alternative here?: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/08/160810104017.htm

[CarlSpackler]

On 7/28/2016 at 11:45 AM, boogielicious said:

"Fifty Bucks says Smails kid picks his nose and protects himself against harmful pathogens."

Double or nothing he eats it.

[David in FL]

4 hours ago, CarlSpackler said:

Double or nothing he eats it.

That kid'll eat anything...!  

[natureboy]

@GolfLug I don't know if you've stopped having little ones, but there's a new science/medicine approved strategy you might consider with the next one to help avoid the allergy your daughter developed.

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/nation-world/nation/article/Peanuts-in-baby-s-diet-can-prevent-allergy-10838693.php

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-sponsored-expert-panel-issues-clinical-guidelines-prevent-peanut-allergy

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2017/01/05/new-nih-guidelines-on-infants-and-peanuts-may-contradict-everything-youve-heard-before/?utm_term=.48529b9a408d

[GolfLug]

1 hour ago, natureboy said:

@GolfLug I don't know if you've stopped having little ones, but there's a new science/medicine approved strategy you might consider with the next one to help avoid the allergy your daughter developed.

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/nation-world/nation/article/Peanuts-in-baby-s-diet-can-prevent-allergy-10838693.php

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-sponsored-expert-panel-issues-clinical-guidelines-prevent-peanut-allergy

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2017/01/05/new-nih-guidelines-on-infants-and-peanuts-may-contradict-everything-youve-heard-before/?utm_term=.48529b9a408d

We have stopped ..  . Certainly interesting articles. Thanks for tagging me on these..