Muirfield Votes to Allow Female Members, Back on Open Rota

[Lihu]

They only increased the yeah vote by 16.2 percent from 64 to 80.2  Really? Only 16.2 percent more people cared more about the prestige of being an Open course club over being discriminatory towards women?

Why would anybody argue for freedom to discriminate against women being members? Having the right to exclude or persecute people of different types is not the same thing as wanting to exercise your personal freedom.

Rory said it quite well for such a young person.

I really don't much like the 36 percent who voted no the first time, and at least have hope for the 16.2 percent who changed their minds albeit potentially for mainly a prestige or profit motive?

[iacas]

46 minutes ago, Lihu said:

I really don't much like the 36 percent who voted no the first time, and at least have hope for the 16.2 percent who changed their minds albeit potentially for mainly a prestige or profit motive?

@Lihu, you have no idea why they voted the way they did.

Maybe adding women's locker rooms and restrooms and so on will be a tremendous expense. And maybe 16.2% of the members realized that with the money they might make from a British Open, they could pay for most of that expense.

You don't know why the 36% or whatever voted the one way, or the 20% still voted that way. So don't assume.

[Lihu]

29 minutes ago, iacas said:

@Lihu, you have no idea why they voted the way they did.

Maybe adding women's locker rooms and restrooms and so on will be a tremendous expense. And maybe 16.2% of the members realized that with the money they might make from a British Open, they could pay for most of that expense.

You don't know why the 36% or whatever voted the one way, or the 20% still voted that way. So don't assume.

This is true. Although, I would have thought that they might already have lockers and showers for ladies who are invited by the male members? Maybe not?

The other possibility is that the 16.2% just needed a slight nudge or reasonable excuse to change their votes?

[freshmanUTA]

3 hours ago, hcopenhagenh said:

This is where you are wrong.  The world is changing.  They are eliminating the political correct BS.  That is why Donald Trump is President and will end up going down as one of the best President's the US has ever seen.  Socialism, as in Europe, will be a failure to their society as they know it.  Thank Goodness the course of our country is changing.

Dude, all Rory said and meant was that he doesn't approve of their rules not allowing women as members. It's pretty clear that a majority wanted the change to occur, the first time they voted something like 63% voted to let women be members. Who said anything about socialism? Allowing women to be equal members isn't socialism.

[David in FL]

On March 17, 2017 at 2:01 PM, hcopenhagenh said:

This is where you are wrong.  The world is changing.  They are eliminating the political correct BS.  That is why Donald Trump is President and will end up going down as one of the best President's the US has ever seen.  Socialism, as in Europe, will be a failure to their society as they know it.  Thank Goodness the course of our country is changing.

Ugh.  I don't know any gentler way to say this except that you're wrong.

I'm a proud conservative, an ardent supporter of our President, and an advocate for Muirfield, and any other private organization to admit or exclude whomever they want.  I even admit that I'm just a little disappointed that the Muirfield membership caved in this situation.    But what we're seeing here is about as far from socialism as you can get.  In fact, it's the very definition of the free market at work.  

[Lihu]

13 minutes ago, David in FL said:

Ugh.  I don't know any gentler way to say this except that you're wrong.

I'm a proud conservative, an ardent supporter of our President, and an advocate for Muirfield, and any other private organization to admit or exclude whomever they want.  I even admit that I'm just a little disappointed that the Muirfield membership caved in this situation.    But what we're seeing here is about as far from socialism as you can get.  In fact, it's the very definition of the free market at work.  

I'm a run of the mill moderate and am also a supporter of our current President as well. 

However, I don't feel like Muirfield caved in to the R&A, but rather the 80% decided that hosting the Open was more important to their traditions than discriminating against women.

Also, allowing people to discriminate against others is not really a free market, but a free market will eventually force people to charge their views towards others.

[David in FL]

1 minute ago, Lihu said:

I'm a run of the mill moderate and am also a supporter of our current President as well. 

However, I don't feel like Muirfield caved in to the R&A, but rather the 80% decided that hosting the Open was more important to their traditions than discriminating against women.

Also, allowing people to discriminate against others is not really a free market, but a free market will eventually force people to charge their views towards others.

Moderate?!  

The free market to which I referred was that Muirfield, having the absolute right to manage their private organization as they see fit, was faced with a consequence for doing so.  They weighed the consequence against their decision, and opted to change their mind.

A perfect example of an organization reacting to external variables in the market.  A beautiful thing.

[Lihu]

Just now, David in FL said:

Moderate?!  

I go by the "gauge". I'm accused of being a liberal in Orange County, while at the same time a fascist up in LA. So, I must be in the exact middle somewhere!

Just now, David in FL said:

The free market to which I referred was that Muirfield, having the absolute right to manage their private organization as they see fit, was faced with a consequence for doing so.  They weighed the consequence against their decision, and opted to change their mind.

A perfect example of an organization reacting to external variables in the market.  A beautiful thing.

100% agree!

[David in FL]

18 minutes ago, Lihu said:

I go by the "gauge". I'm accused of being a liberal in Orange County, while at the same time a fascist up in LA. So, I must be in the exact middle somewhere!

Ha!  As soon as I posted that, I realized that to be fair, I really should have taken into consideration where you are!  

 

 

[boogielicious]

Please do not bring in politics to this thread. 

[David in FL]

1 hour ago, boogielicious said:

Please do not bring in politics to this thread. 

That wasn't politics.  It was pure business!  

[nevets88]

Kasumigaseki Country Club follows Muirfield.

http://www.golf.com/tour-news/2017/03/21/host-2020-olympic-golf-competition-votes-allow-women-members

[Wally Fairway]

On ‎3‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 10:47 AM, nevets88 said:

Kasumigaseki Country Club follows Muirfield.

http://www.golf.com/tour-news/2017/03/21/host-2020-olympic-golf-competition-votes-allow-women-members

I just saw this story - and was going to post it here (waiting for the discussion and distain for "forcing" another club to change policy.

And if you don't want to read the article, you might not recognize the Kasumigaseki CC by name, but you will know it as the 2020 Olympics host course for golf competition; and there was pressure on the Olympics to move to another course if KCC maintained their male only policy for membership. Except in this one the Executive Board of the club made the decision after discussions with member (although the headlines say vote, in reading the article I believe it was only a vote by the board).

[DaveP043]

1 hour ago, Wally Fairway said:

Except in this one the Executive Board of the club made the decision after discussions with member (although the headlines say vote, in reading the article I believe it was only a vote by the board).

Obviously by-laws vary from club to club, some might require a membership vote, some leave the responsibility to a board.  In my experience, a board of directors usually has a much more detailed understanding of the financial issues within a club, so is much better equipped to evaluate the potential repercussions of decisions like this than the membership as a whole.