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Is Phil Mickelson Going Nuts?: Hitting a moving ball at US Open


gregsandiego
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Meh.  I still think he just let frustration get the better of him and I’m willing move on from it.  I am a big Phil fan.  One on course blemish like this isn’t enough for me to put him on a shit list.  For those that do... he probably wont shed a tear or lose any sleep, he already has plenty of haters.

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What a fool.  I'm not as bitter at him as @iacas (I'd probably still root for him to win under certain circumstances), but this was ridiculous.

Is anybody talking about what he did on the next hole?  Faced with an uphill putt, he intentionally putted past the hole and tried to "back it in" down the slope on the other side.  I actually found that an amusing (if childish) way to "protest" against the pin positions...positions that dozens of other golfers, even in the afternoon group, dealt with like grown adults.

- John

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14 minutes ago, Missouri Swede said:

 

If it is right there how come the people IN CHARGE OF THE RULES OF THE GAME did not see it that way?

Firstly, Phil did not stop his ball from entering a hazard. Secondly, the rule states the officials should take into consideration all aspects of the incident. Seems like they felt applying the 2 stroke penalty was good enough.

2 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

What a fool.  I'm not as bitter at him as @iacas (I'd probably still root for him to win under certain circumstances), but this was ridiculous.

Is anybody talking about what he did on the next hole?  Faced with an uphill putt, he intentionally putted past the hole and tried to "back it in" down the slope on the other side.  I actually found that an amusing (if childish) way to "protest" against the pin positions...positions that dozens of other golfers, even in the afternoon group, dealt with like grown adults.

You post this as if there has never been a putt where the optimal path to the hole is a break greater than 90 degrees.

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9 minutes ago, FlappyGilmore said:

You post this as if there has never been a putt where the optimal path to the hole is a break greater than 90 degrees.

No, I post this as if I actually watched it (did you?)  😉  There's no way that was the optimal line to hit that putt.

 

Edited by Hardspoon

- John

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I don’t understand how people can be saying what he did was so god awful are the SAME PEOPLE saying he should have called it unplayable when his putt would have rolled off the green.... into the FAIRWAY.  But THAT is ok?  Delcaring your ball unplayable when it lies in the fairway so you can reputt?

also, I’ve seen plenty of players attempt all kinds of shots using slopes and backstops and calling what he did with his putt “childish” is absurd.  

2 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

No, I post this as if I actually watched it (did you?)  😉  There's no way that was the optimal line to hit that putt.

 

And we’re talking about Phil here... when has this guy ever played the “optimal line” in his entire. CAREER.  C’mon dude

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Best Score 2017:  82 (Traditions at the Glen, Par 70)

Favorite Course - Conklin Players Club (Par 72) - Best Score 86

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10 minutes ago, FlappyGilmore said:

If it is right there how come the people IN CHARGE OF THE RULES OF THE GAME did not see it that way?

Former USGA Executive Director David Fay says he would have lobbied for DQ.

10 minutes ago, FlappyGilmore said:

Firstly, Phil did not stop his ball from entering a hazard.

David Fay was asked this specifically (keeping ball from rolling into hazard vs what Phil did).  He said, "it is the same."

Craig
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1 minute ago, Missouri Swede said:

Former USGA Executive Director David Fay says he would have lobbied for DQ.

David Fay was asked this specifically (keeping ball from rolling into hazard vs what Phil did).  He said, "it is the same."

Sure he can have an opinion on the matter, he is no longer part of the USGA so all he has in an opinion.

But, the USGA as a organization decided it was just a penalty. He even said he would have probably lost his lobbying point.

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2 minutes ago, Chris223 said:

I don’t understand how people can be saying what he did was so god awful are the SAME PEOPLE saying he should have called it unplayable when his putt would have rolled off the green.... into the FAIRWAY.  But THAT is ok?  Delcaring your ball unplayable when it lies in the fairway so you can reputt?

From what I see, it would have been completely within the rules. He had been putting for bogey 5; if he used this option, he would have then been putting 7.  If he makes it, he's got a triple.  If not, hopefully taps in for a quad 8.

Just now, FlappyGilmore said:

Sure he can have an opinion on the matter, he is no longer part of the USGA so all he has in an opinion.

But, the USGA as a organization decided it was just a penalty. He even said he would have probably lost his lobbying point.

I see your point.  

For my thinking, Phil's explanation in the post-round interview changed my view of it: he said he did it deliberately to keep the ball from rolling off the green.

But I can see how others might not view it that way.

Craig
What's in the :ogio: Silencer bag (on the :clicgear: cart)
Driver: :callaway: Razr Fit 10.5°  
5 Wood: :tmade: Burner  
Hybrid: :cobra: Baffler DWS 20°
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Wedge: :ping: Glide 2.0 54° ES grind 
Putter: :heavyputter:  midweight CX2
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8 minutes ago, Chris223 said:

And we’re talking about Phil here... when has this guy ever played the “optimal line” in his entire. CAREER.  C’mon dude

How about on 99.99% of the putts he has ever hit in his career?

Look, I'm not one of those who's saying he's garbage or I'm going to hate him forever (I even said that it was a much more acceptable way of "protesting"), but you can't convince me he did that because he thought it was his best chance to make the putt.

10 minutes ago, Chris223 said:

I don’t understand how people can be saying what he did was so god awful are the SAME PEOPLE saying he should have called it unplayable when his putt would have rolled off the green.... into the FAIRWAY.  But THAT is ok?  Delcaring your ball unplayable when it lies in the fairway so you can reputt?

I think the difference is that the unplayable lie still falls within the general spirit of the game...in any case, anywhere on the course, you can take a "do-over"...but with a penalty of stroke-and-distance.  It's sort of baked into golf as the most penal option for any monumentally bad shot.  Hitting a moving ball is outside of the general way the game is played, that's all.

- John

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25 minutes ago, Missouri Swede said:

From what I see, it would have been completely within the rules. He had been putting for bogey 5; if he used this option, he would have then been putting 7.  If he makes it, he's got a triple.  If not, hopefully taps in for a quad 8.

I see your point.  

For my thinking, Phil's explanation in the post-round interview changed my view of it: he said he did it deliberately to keep the ball from rolling off the green.

But I can see how others might not view it that way.

I think taking a shot towards the hole is slightly different than deflecting it to gain a better lie.

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8 minutes ago, FlappyGilmore said:

I think taking a shot towards the hole is slightly different than deflecting it to gain a better lie.

Exactly. 

Craig
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58 minutes ago, Chris223 said:

Delcaring your ball unplayable when it lies in the fairway so you can reputt?

Yes, that is okay.

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24 minutes ago, FlappyGilmore said:

I think taking a shot towards the hole is slightly different than deflecting it to gain a better lie.

But that’s exactly what he did. He deflected the ball back up to the hole while it was moving to gain a better lie. He even said himself, ‘I tried to hit the ball back towards the hole so it wouldn’t roll back down behind the bunker leaving me no shot.’

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1 minute ago, iacas said:

Yes, that is okay.

Sure, its ok.  Fine.  Is that any more within the “spirit of the game” that everyone is complaining about that he so massively violated apparently?  I don’t see it, sorry

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Just now, Chris223 said:

Sure, its ok.  Fine.  Is that any more within the “spirit of the game” that everyone is complaining about that he so massively violated apparently?  I don’t see it, sorry

I do.

One is penalizing yourself. The other is being an asshole and breaking the rules. It’s literally Rule 1, even.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
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1 minute ago, Vinsk said:

But that’s exactly what he did. He deflected the ball back up to the hole while it was moving to gain a better lie. He even said himself, ‘I tried to hit the ball back towards the hole so it wouldn’t roll back down behind the bunker leaving me no shot.’

A deflection would be putting his club or some other object in the path of the ball and letting it hit it and go wherever it goes.  He practically took a putting stance and with 2 hands on the grip took a putting stroke.  Come on dude

Just now, iacas said:

I do.

One is penalizing yourself. The other is being an asshole and breaking the rules. It’s literally Rule 1, even.

So he didn’t get penalized for what he did do?  Oh ok.  Sorry I thought he took 2 strokes

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Best Score 2017:  82 (Traditions at the Glen, Par 70)

Favorite Course - Conklin Players Club (Par 72) - Best Score 86

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Just now, Chris223 said:

A deflection would be putting his club or some other object in the path of the ball and letting it hit it and go wherever it goes.  He practically took a putting stance and with 2 hands on the grip took a putting stroke.  Come on dude

Stop with the sanctimonious “come on dude” stuff like it’s obvious.

He deflected the ball by swinging the putter at it.

1 minute ago, Chris223 said:

So he didn’t get penalized for what he did do?  Oh ok.  Sorry I thought he took 2 strokes

Read it again.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
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2 minutes ago, iacas said:

Read it again.

are the 2 situations really that different in terms of intent and application of penalty strokes?

Edited by FlappyGilmore
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