LIV Golf (Saudi PIF), "Mergers," and More

[Shindig]

38 minutes ago, iacas said:

 

Does the OWGR have some rule about platform manipulation?  

Also this sort of defeats their plans of spending more time with their families.  Maybe this proposal was put forth by Ian Poulter's family.

[DeadMan]

So I’d bet that Cam is going to LIV. 

 

[Double Mocha Man]

25 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

So I’d bet that Cam is going to LIV. 

 

I'm thinking the Open victory just upped his offer from LIV.

[JetFan1983]

Much as I hate to admit it, the LIV events do deserve some OWGR points just based on the world ranks of several of their members. They had 36 guys in the top 200 for Pumpkin Ridge, 21 in the top 100 and that deserves whatever that deserves based on their formula. 54 holes, several guys ranked outside the top 1000, etc. it's hard for me to say just how much a LIV event should be worth based on all the factors.

Of course, the OWGR has a lot of PGA Tour, R&A, and USGA guys on their board so who knows if they'll be fair here or if they'll low ball them with the points. The only comparable event I can think of is the Hero World Challenge. I don't think a LIV Event is as strong a field as that, but a LIV event seems more competitive than say a Japan Tour event. Maybe the awarded points should land somewhere between those two points and probably closer to what a Japan Tour event gets.

The Asian Tour idea these guys have I think would be fair game for them to do. I doubt the majors will outright ban these guys, but they certainly won't make it easy for them to qualify. As their world ranks continues to drop, the only other ways in are through open qualifying or invitation, the latter of which is all but never happening. I doubt any of the four majors would create a spot for the top money winner on the LIV tour let alone LIV's top five, but then again, this is all developing very strangely as it is, so it's hard for me to project what the next 1-5 years will look like.

Edited July 17, 2022 by JetFan1983
fixed faulty sentence

[JetFan1983]

Sorry for the double post, but I will add that if the OWGR decide LIV events get zero points, I can understand that position based on LIV's invitation based criteria for qualification. That probably presents a fundamental issue for deciding how to weigh the strength of these fields, especially over time.

[JetFan1983]

43 minutes ago, JetFan1983 said:

Sorry for the double post, but I will add that if the OWGR decide LIV events get zero points, I can understand that position based on LIV's invitation based criteria for qualification. That probably presents a fundamental issue for deciding how to weigh the strength of these fields, especially over time.

Okay, the very very rare triple post from me. Sorry, mods. And sorry again if this string of commentary isn't as cogent as it all sounded in my head when thinking this up.

Just wanted to add I know the Masters is invitation only, but LIV without any clout whatsoever besides their players' records hardly has a leg to stand on here in this regard. Without the checks and balances of earning/losing tour cards through feeder tours and what not, LIV's competitiveness over time could become too subjective to properly gauge.

[RFKFREAK]

1 hour ago, DeadMan said:

So I’d bet that Cam is going to LIV. 

 

I'd prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt and say that he really prefers to deal with LIV questions on the biggest day of his professional career.

[DeadMan]

16 minutes ago, RFKFREAK said:

I'd prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt and say that he really prefers to deal with LIV questions on the biggest day of his professional career.

I sort of see that, but I ultimately disagree.

• It's very easy to say no if that's the truth.
• Journalists are supposed to ask "hard" questions (that said, refer to the previous bullet).
• When is the next time Cam is going to have a press conference? His next PGA Tour event will probably be the first playoff event in a month if he doesn't go to LIV. They'd better ask now.

[RFKFREAK]

36 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

I sort of see that, but I ultimately disagree.

• It's very easy to say no if that's the truth.
• Journalists are supposed to ask "hard" questions (that said, refer to the previous bullet).
• When is the next time Cam is going to have a press conference? His next PGA Tour event will probably be the first playoff event in a month if he doesn't go to LIV. They'd better ask now.

Yeah, the video really shows how bad the exchange was, especially considering every question he got was a softball except for that one and then uses the excuse of "his team" deals with it, as though he has no say I'm the matter or isn't the guy who has ultimate veto power.

 

Edited July 17, 2022 by RFKFREAK

[JetFan1983]

3 minutes ago, RFKFREAK said:

Yeah, the video really shows how bad the exchange was, especially considering every question he got was a softball except for that one and then uses the excuse of "his team" deals with it, as though he has no say I'm the matter or isn't the guy who has ultimate veto power.

 

Yea, wow, that looks bad. "I'm here to win golf tournaments." Oh boy.

Considering I don't know anything about Cam Smith outside golf though, I have no idea what he does, but this response does seem to leave the door open to LIV one day.

[RFKFREAK]

2 minutes ago, JetFan1983 said:

Yea, wow, that looks bad. "I'm here to win golf tournaments." Oh boy.

Considering I don't know anything about Cam Smith outside golf though, I have no idea what he does, but this response does seem to leave the door open to LIV one day.

You mean tomorrow?

Edited July 17, 2022 by RFKFREAK

[JetFan1983]

6 minutes ago, RFKFREAK said:

You mean tomorrow?

That would be insane. I would hope he's smart enough to see how the world ranking point situation shakes out before committing to anything. He gets to be the British Open defending champ for a whole year after all.

I'm sure Greg Norman would love nothing more than to poach fellow Aussie Cam Smith while at the same time relishing in Rory's disappointment. I can't stress enough how much I'm rooting against Greg Norman and LIV's success, but this drama is difficult for me to look away from.

Edited July 17, 2022 by JetFan1983
misprint

[DeadMan]

1 hour ago, RFKFREAK said:

 

Wow, that is really bad. He’s definitely going to LIV. Acting indignant at the press is PR 101 when you don’t have a good answer. What a baby. If he jumps this week, I’m going to post a blog titled “f*** Cam Smith.” Sorry if I google bombing all the other Cam Smiths out there. 

[chriskzoo]

I think Cam Smith is as good as gone - Norman has huge Aussie influence and if he can play in the majors the next 5 years, I'm sure he doesn't care about playing the mid-level PGA events.  It will really be on the majors to take control of this situation if they want.

The PGA Tour is going to be forced to embrace Norman's vision, but I just can't get behind LIV as a product.  It has nothing to do with the Saudi money - it's just a terrible format for golf.  

 

[JetFan1983]

It's been foreshadowed for weeks but...

 

[iacas]

1 hour ago, JetFan1983 said:

That would be insane. I would hope he's smart enough to see how the world ranking point situation shakes out before committing to anything. He gets to be the British Open defending champ for a whole year after all.

Why? He gets into all the majors for the next five years at least, and the British until he's 60.

28 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

Wow, that is really bad. He’s definitely going to LIV. Acting indignant at the press is PR 101 when you don’t have a good answer. What a baby. If he jumps this week, I’m going to post a blog titled “f*** Cam Smith.” Sorry if I google bombing all the other Cam Smiths out there. 

Please do.

[Friz]

I always figured the next big exodus would be following the British Open now that all majors for the year are done.  Cam Smith would be the first true blow, first guy that I'd truly be disappointed to see go that direction.  Hopefully it's not true, id probably be annoyed if it was brought up at my Major winning press conference as well, but his response left the door wide open.

I've also heard rumors about Cantlay and Finau...but hard to tell what's real and what is just people spouting names at opportune moments to get attention

[JetFan1983]

7 minutes ago, iacas said:

Why? He gets into all the majors for the next five years at least, and the British until he's 60.

I came so close to quoting myself with this exact response but I couldn’t bring myself to doing it. Good point.

I guess it depends on when we can expect to see the OWGR decide what LIV events are worth. If the decision is imminent or sometime before the end of 2022 it might make sense to have all the information before jumping ship. I’m sure the nine figure offer he has will still be there in early 2023 but maybe he’s better off financially to strike while the iron is white hot. 
 

But yea, he really has no great reason to wait and see unless he doesn’t want to jeopardize his standing in the other three majors outside his five year exemption. From the sound of his press conference response, he’s probably not thinking that far ahead.