20 Handicapper - What Can I Play To in a Year?

[iacas]

4 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I'm a fan of setting bold goals. 

The "A" in "SMART" is "achievable."

[Nail]

I'll go against the grain here. I take it you're Irish so with 3 scorecards you do get an official handicap which you say is 20, so you probably shot between 90-95 on those 3 rounds. You say you played 'shit" so you know you can be better, i have no problem believing the length of your drives, especially if you played hurling or anything growing up. 

I think you will get to 10-14 within the year maybe even lower if you get out to play every week in competitions, you sound like you have a bit of natural ability so you will drop fast IMO. 

[boogielicious]

9 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I write this in the most loving way possible... You know, there are plenty of decaffeinated brands on the market now that taste every bit as good as the real thing. 

I’m glad I wasn’t sipping my coffee when I read this!😀

To the OP, time, dedication and practicing the correct way can help lower your scores. I would aim for 10-15, but make your goals more specific. Do you hit a lot of fat shots? Do you make good contact but direction is the issue? Do you get close to the green in regulation but chunk your chips and pitches? Do you 3 putt often?

Determine what your weaknesses really are and work on them. Post your swing in the member swings section and we can help.

Also, get a copy of Lowest Score Wins. This book will help you determine what the most important parts of your game to practice are.

[Bonvivant]

11 hours ago, Mr22putt said:

I didn't want to say so in my 1st post and wanted to wait.....well it didn't take long for someone to post.

I've played golf for 52 years and have yet to meet a 20 capper who can AVERAGE 260....never mind getting their drives often into trouble.

As above I've played as a 6-8 cap for over 4 decades.

In a typical rd using a driver 14 times...I rarely hit a FW off the tee because I'm confident with my driver.

I usually hit 2-4 drives I'm really happy with...4 lousy drives and the other 6-8 drives are ok and keep me in play.

A good drive carries 227-230....a poor drive 210-218...so my avg carry is likely 218-223.

I find most golfers say their best drives as their avg drives....I see those results when I play golf with them.

I know that this is anecdotal, but I'll give you an experience that I had. One of my teammates from my pool team asked me to golf last year, and I said yes. This was my first round back in 3-4 years and I ended up hitting 4 iron off every tee for about 180 yards. Going into it, he said that he hit the ball really far, but I had heard that before and knew he was likely averaging under 250 yards.

To my surprise, he didn't hit a single drive under 270 yards, and all of them were in play. His pitching wedge was his 150 yard club, and his longest drive of the day was on an uphill par 4 that was playing at 370 yards. He was in the rough right next to the fringe. As the crow flew, this was a 330 yard drive (8-10 yards uphill) as there is a bit of the dogleg on the hole. I was absolutely flabbergasted.

I believe that he shot an 85*, and that asterisk denotes that he was rolling everything and taking anything 3 ft and in on the green.

TLDR: Just because you haven't seen it in all your years playing golf, doesn't mean that there aren't people out there that can do it. For reference, I am normally of the belief that people most of the time DO and WILL overstate their distance, but there are some people out there that don't. My pool friend didn't even claim an average to me, just said that he hit it really far. He wasn't kidding, although he definitely was bragging, but he could back it up.

Like others are saying, it is really hard to tell someone's potential with just the text they give here. A video is a much better measure.

[Mr22putt]

1 hour ago, Bonvivant said:

To my surprise, he didn't hit a single drive under 270 yards, and all of them were in play.

My pool friend didn't even claim an average to me, just said that he hit it really far. 

 

If he was hitting all his drives over 270 and in play...... he likely had a great day off the tee and/or a 'skilled' player and not a 20 cap.....maybe a single digit cap.

It takes a lot of golf skill to hammer drives over 270 with consistency and in play.....unless you were playing a goat track with NO trouble off the tee.

He didn't tell you his cap...but just by his driving prowess and ability to keep in it play.....he's a fairly skilled play....IMO...11 cap or lower with maybe a short game than doesn't measure up to his driving ability.

I'm not saying that there aren't 20 caps who can't tag long consistent drives...it's just rare....and if you ask @iacas who has been around the game and around many players....he'd likely say that a 20 capper with a really strong, consistent  and long driver is an exception vs. the rule.

[ChetlovesMer]

13 hours ago, iacas said:

The "A" in "SMART" is "achievable."

Sure. True enough 

There was no where near enough information in the OP's original post for me to know what's achievable. My first instinct was to respond in a very snarky manner. So, I decided to go the other way and respond with excessive optimism. There's no way for me to know whats achievable for this young man. So, I decided to give him the encouragement to reach for the stars. 

Edited March 1, 2020 by ChetlovesMer

[Bonvivant]

3 hours ago, Mr22putt said:

If he was hitting all his drives over 270 and in play...... he likely had a great day off the tee and/or a 'skilled' player and not a 20 cap.....maybe a single digit cap.

It takes a lot of golf skill to hammer drives over 270 with consistency and in play.....unless you were playing a goat track with NO trouble off the tee.

He didn't tell you his cap...but just by his driving prowess and ability to keep in it play.....he's a fairly skilled play....IMO...11 cap or lower with maybe a short game than doesn't measure up to his driving ability.

I'm not saying that there aren't 20 caps who can't tag long consistent drives...it's just rare....and if you ask @iacas who has been around the game and around many players....he'd likely say that a 20 capper with a really strong, consistent  and long driver is an exception vs. the rule.

I know that it's rare, but with the score he carded plus his disregard for the rules I would guess he would have been in the mid to low 90s that day alone. I played with him a handful of times after that and all rounds yielded similar results. To me, that means he would most likely be in the high teens as far as handicap goes, but he doesn't keep one. Like I said, I have a hard time believing these claims, especially on a forum such as this, but it is entirely within the realm of possibility, just not the average.

Attacking someone like this when they get to a forum isn't a problem if they are the liar that hits it 220 on average but say that they hit it 260 average. Attacking someone like this when they are the outlier that is a high handicapper that does hit it far is a problem though. You are probably right to do it 9 times out of 10 (at least, maybe even 49 times out of 50), but when you are wrong you are pushing someone away, and calling them a liar even when they aren't.

I'm just trying to be civil about it. Most of the liars either get exposed with time, or vanish into thin air, so it really isn't a problem. All of the people that you call a liar when they aren't will disappear immediately and have no thoughts of coming back.

[Mr22putt]

1 hour ago, Bonvivant said:

1) I know that it's rare, but with the score he carded plus his disregard for the rules I would guess he would have been in the mid to low 90s that day alone.

2) ..... but when you are wrong you are pushing someone away, and calling them a liar even when they aren't.

 

1) I overlooked the 85*....never saw that the guy was 'fluffing' his lies and raking back short putts.

2) I never called the OP a liar....can a 20 capper AVERAGE 260 off the tee...yes.....but it's very rare......all I stated was that in my decades of playing golf I've yet to see a 20 capper AVERAGE 260.

The OP has acknowledge his 'embellishment'  in his original post and removed the "260 yard average" comment and explained his edit as...."Stupid fat hands"😁

Edited March 1, 2020 by Mr22putt

[seanf999]

15 minutes ago, Mr22putt said:

1) I overlooked the 85*....never saw that the guy was 'fluffing' his lies and raking back short putts.

2) I never called the OP a liar....can a 20 capper AVERAGE 260 off the tee...yes.....but it's very rare......all I stated was that in my decades of playing golf I've yet to see a 20 capper AVERAGE 260.

The OP has acknowledge his 'embellishment'  in his original post and removed the "260 yard average" comment and explained his edit as...."Stupid fat hands"😁

I didn't remove it, the stupid fat hands comment was referring to putting '2 handicap' instead of '20 handicap', then the title was changed, not by me.

I've spent years whacking balls down the field behind my house, we bought bags of water balls on ebay just so I could hit them.

I averaged past the 250 sign on the range with range balls, but that's doesn't roll of the tongue as well as 260 average.

I'm not a 20 handicap, I played 3 games 3 days in a row and put in 3 cards, could be higher, could be lower, we'll find out when I'm playing consistent golf.

22 hours ago, Mr22putt said:

OP

If you showed us a video of your swing we'd have a better Idea on your natural talent.

Considering you're going to college and working...I think you likely won't have the time to truly dedicate enough time to get to a single cap within a year...with work I think 13-14 cap is a realistic year end goal.

I think the goal of scratch is more realistic if and when you become a 3-4 cap......very few people have the natural talent to become scratch.

I've played golf for 52 years....41 years as a 6-8 cap...I knew in my early 20's I didn't have the natural talent to be scratch and wasn't willing to put the time in to get to scratch neither.

Let us know of your progression through the year.

I'm heading to the range tomorrow so I'll post up a video! It'll probably be down the line but I'll try and get a face on angle too!

If I was aiming for what I want I'd be aiming for scratch, but I'm well aware of just how difficult that is.
So I'll aim for 10, and be happy with 15.

I've known a few good golfers (they usually were giving my father lessons!), they've all said I've a lovely swing and that my dad should be dragging me out onto the course with him.

 

11 hours ago, Nail said:

I'll go against the grain here. I take it you're Irish so with 3 scorecards you do get an official handicap which you say is 20, so you probably shot between 90-95 on those 3 rounds. You say you played 'shit" so you know you can be better, i have no problem believing the length of your drives, especially if you played hurling or anything growing up. 

I think you will get to 10-14 within the year maybe even lower if you get out to play every week in competitions, you sound like you have a bit of natural ability so you will drop fast IMO. 

Thank you, 
I've played hurling, football and rugby throughout the years, always been fairly strong for my size.

I'm certainly not the most consistent, I distinctly remember losing my drive 40 yards to the right on the 2nd hole..

I'm a decent striker of the ball but that also means when I miss it's not duffed along the ground or topped, it's a push slice into the bog lands.

 

I'll post on the thread when I upload a video of my swing tomorrow.

[leftybutnotPM]

30 minutes ago, seanf999 said:

If I was aiming for what I want I'd be aiming for scratch, but I'm well aware of just how difficult that is.
So I'll aim for 10, and be happy with 15.

 

I want to why your plan is better than mine:

I plan to find an instructor who can help me develop some achievable goals and who can give me some drills and lessons to help me maintain my focus to achieve these goals?

What is the reason for aiming for 10? I can be pretty certain you won't be a 10 in 7 months.

 

[Carl3]

23 hours ago, leftybutnotPM said:

Oh Gawd - here we go again.

260 yards. Where? When? What fairways? What tailwinds? What altitude? What cartpath bounces?

What is  the real "average"? Do the 300s wipe out the 220s? 

Is 260 really 180. You don't know and neither do I.

You are suggesting that someone without a handicap can get to 10 in 7 months because he SAYS he "averages 260". Wow.

There are many many golfers who can occasionally hit it 260. Scratch is possible eventually for a tiny percentage of those people, and most of them are in their early teens.

LOL, thinking a 260 yd average is super human. I do like giving people the benefit of the doubt. We are talking a 100 mph swing speed for a 260 yd drive with roll out.  For a young man with decent athletic ability this is not a problem.

[leftybutnotPM]

1 minute ago, Carl3 said:

LOL, thinking a 260 yd average is super human. I do like giving people the benefit of the doubt. We are talking a 100 mph swing speed for a 260 yd drive with roll out.  For a young man with decent athletic ability this is not a problem.

? The query/emphasis is on the word AVERAGE, not the number 260.

[Carl3]

10 minutes ago, leftybutnotPM said:

? The query/emphasis is on the word AVERAGE, not the number 260.

Ok so a 105 mph swing speed is not insane for a young, athletic man. Not sure why there are such negative vibes on this site from time to time. 
oh and where I live there are a lot of strong, athletic guys who grew up swinging a bat and can beat the heck out of a golf ball, but can’t score worth sh!t. They play once a month for fun, but if they ever get real interested and motivated they can become a low single digit for shure.

Edited March 2, 2020 by Carl3

[leftybutnotPM]

1 minute ago, Carl3 said:

Ok so a 105 mph swing speed is not insane for a young, athletic man. Not sure why there are such negative vibes on this site from time to time. 

Because it's always the same start and the same finish.

Someone wants to put the cart before the horse.

No one wants to improve or reach their potential or learn to correct their faults.

They all want to get to scratch or turn pro or get to 10 from no handicap in 7 months.

That's all well and good, but the responses are always similar too.

• "KJ Choi did it. Greg Norman did it. You can too."
• "Anything is possible."
• It depends on how much you want it."
• "I'd try for the Champions Tour but I don't have the time."

Someone who has never seen the player and has zero information will always say "I don't see why you can't get down to a 10" or 5 or scratch or whatever.

It gets old.

[Carl3]

3 minutes ago, leftybutnotPM said:

Because it's always the same start and the same finish.

Someone wants to put the cart before the horse.

No one wants to improve or reach their potential or learn to correct their faults.

They all want to get to scratch or turn pro or get to 10 from no handicap in 7 months.

That's all well and good, but the responses are always similar too.

• "KJ Choi did it. Greg Norman did it. You can too."
• "Anything is possible."
• It depends on how much you want it."
• "I'd try for the Champions Tour but I don't have the time."

Someone who has never seen the player and has zero information will always say "I don't see why you can't get down to a 10" or 5 or scratch or whatever.

It gets old.

LOL, you have never seen “the player” either but are so quick and nasty telling him it can’t be done. As far as age, I went from being a bogey golfer to a low single digit in my 50’s and am looking to go lower before my body yields.

[leftybutnotPM]

21 minutes ago, Carl3 said:

LOL, you have never seen “the player” either 

Things these guys always say:

"I drive the ball on average XXX yards."

Things they NEVER say:

• " I kept tabs on my short irons over the last three months. I had 65 9 irons and full wedges and was on the green 43 times. I noticed that most of my misses were left."
• " Sometimes I think my short games is OK, but when I'm short-sided I really struggle to get the ball close. I always chunk it or hit it miles past the hole"
• " I feel like I hit my hybrids pretty solidly, but they balloon like crazy in the wind. I feel like I have really limited options into headwinds because I struggle to keep the ball low."
• "My bunker play is pretty crappy. I don't really feel like I know what I am doing and often leave my first shot in and only get close to the hole when I get lucky and it bounces off the bank"
• "I miss A LOT of putts inside three feet. What I notice is that these putts don't even hit the hole at all and they seem to be pushes. I lose confidence and no longer expect to make them."

I have taken some time to point out WHY these threads are bogus. 

If you got info beyond "I average 2X0 yards" off the tee people might know where to start.

THat's not being "nasty" or saying it can't be done. It is saying that with the current level of information, no -one has a clue, but the  lack of detail implies a lack of knowledge and useful data that can be used to help him.

 

Edited March 2, 2020 by leftybutnotPM

[Mr22putt]

3 hours ago, seanf999 said:

I didn't remove it, the stupid fat hands comment was referring to putting....

 

Sean...so if you didn't remove it then who removed the "260 yard average drive" comment in your original post?.....the working TST elves that iacas hired?😁

53 minutes ago, leftybutnotPM said:

Things these guys always say:

"I drive the ball on average XXX yards."

 

Lefty...so you mean I shouldn't believe all the guys on WRX who can drive the ball 320 yards?....just askin for a friend.

[FlyingAce]

14 minutes ago, Mr22putt said:

Sean...so if you didn't remove it then who removed the "260 yard average drive" comment in your original post?.....the working TST elves that iacas hired?😁

I still see the “I drive it 260 yard on average” on his post...

Edited March 2, 2020 by FlyingAce