T400 Lofts?

[ChetlovesMer]

The whole "Some irons are too strong lofted" argument to me seems weird.

Why does anyone care what number is written on the bottom of the club?

If the green is 150 yards away, you need a club to get it there. Why should anyone care what number is written on the bottom of the club to do so????

As long as you know which club to pull out of your bag, your all good. 

  On 3/13/2020 at 2:17 PM, billchao said:

 Obviously I’m not going to mistake a 4i for a 9i, 

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I can tell you that I prefer clubs that draw a line under the 6 and the 9. I have on more than one occasion pulled the 6 instead of the 9 or visa versa. When I got fit for new irons you can bet I made a line drawn under the 6 or the 9 part of my decision set. 

If I had one length clubs.... I'm sure I'd have to have them spell out "NINE" and "SIX" on the bottom of the clubs just to keep me from F-ing that up. 

[Double Mocha Man]

  On 3/13/2020 at 6:20 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

The whole "Some irons are too strong lofted" argument to me seems weird.

Why does anyone care what number is written on the bottom of the club?

 

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It comes down to the whole ego thing on the par 3's:  "Hey Carl, what did you hit there?"  Carl with a smirk, "My 180 yard 8 iron."  (Even though it's lofted like a 3 wood)

[ChetlovesMer]

  On 3/13/2020 at 6:24 PM, Double Mocha Man said:

It comes down to the whole ego thing on the par 3's:  "Hey Carl, what did you hit there?"  Carl with a smirk, "My 180 yard 8 iron."  (Even though it's lofted like a 3 wood)

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That's fine with me because he may be hitting an 8 iron into a 180 yard par 3, but he'll only be hitting his driver 200, I can giggle every time I stripe my driver 50-75 yards past him. 

Besides the only number that REALLY matters is the one you write on the scorecard.

[Double Mocha Man]

  On 3/13/2020 at 6:33 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

That's fine with me because he may be hitting an 8 iron into a 180 yard par 3, but he'll only be hitting his driver 200, I can giggle every time I stripe my driver 50-75 yards past him. 

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That's true.  You run out of strong loft cheats when you get to the driver.

[Bonvivant]

  On 3/13/2020 at 6:20 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

The whole "Some irons are too strong lofted" argument to me seems weird.

Why does anyone care what number is written on the bottom of the club?

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I explained what I think about it, and it seems not many agree, but some do. 

 

  On 3/13/2020 at 6:24 PM, Double Mocha Man said:

It comes down to the whole ego thing on the par 3's:  "Hey Carl, what did you hit there?"  Carl with a smirk, "My 180 yard 8 iron."  (Even though it's lofted like a 3 wood)

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This is a good sized part of it for me. It's an annoying brag that I hear far too often. 

  On 3/13/2020 at 6:33 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

That's fine with me because he may be hitting an 8 iron into a 180 yard par 3, but he'll only be hitting his driver 200, I can giggle every time I stripe my driver 50-75 yards past him. 

Besides the only number that REALLY matters is the one you write on the scorecard.

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I've found that the people that brag about this stuff are also people that don't follow the rules of golf very well. The people that have the strong lofted clubs that don't mention it are far better. 

[iacas]

  On 3/13/2020 at 7:29 PM, Bonvivant said:

It's an annoying brag that I hear far too often. 

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Why do you care?

Of all the things to care about, someone else’s clubs aren’t in my top thousand or more.

Name your irons after the names of the Brady Bunch characters or something. Then at least you can yell “Marsha Marsha Marsha!” when you fat your 7-iron.

[HoganApexFan]

Have to agree with excellent posts that what a mfgr stamps on the bottom of their clubs shouldn't matter to anyone except prospective buyers and fitters.  OTOH, I can't believe I'm the only one who produced a Tim Allen/Scooby Doo confused grunt when looking at the wide range of lofts for a single company's 7 iron...Their 712 lineup had only 4 models: MB/CB/AP2/AP1 and the 7i lofts ranged from 35-33 deg.  With the latest addition to their 2020 lineup they now have 7 models with 7i lofts ranging from 35-26 deg.  There's obviously a market for the various models (tour, players, players distance, GI, SGI, etc.) and they can stamp whatever they want on their clubs, but couldn't somebody in R&D or Quality Control at least make the suggestion that an elite company's 7 iron should only have a 4 to 5 degree range of lofts between models?  (Kinda sorta thought that's why they have lower numbers...)

[iacas]

What if the T400 7-iron launches at about the same angle as the T100? Or the CB?

[snapfade]

I think a point of concern when buying a new set would be what the loft on the PW is, so it will not leave a big gap between that and your wedges if you are not replacing those. If you are replacing the whole set top to bottom then no problem. As far as the numbers go, I think its just a way for the individual to identify what club to wrongly select. Various lofts across a companies line of clubs is probably based on the type of player that will be using them. I think when it originally started there could have been some clever dudes down in R and D who said, if we strengthen the lofts then we can claim its longer than your old ones. Now it seems like a way to fine tune clubs to the individuals level of play. Just my two cents.

[HoganApexFan]

Excellent question!  That might actually make a lot more sense to stamp based on launch angle than the traditional static loft classification, esp if they are using an iron-byron type club testing machine to compare launch angles and make the determination...  

[Double Mocha Man]

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:00 PM, HoganApexFan said:

Have to agree with excellent posts that what a mfgr stamps on the bottom of their clubs shouldn't matter to anyone except prospective buyers and fitters.  OTOH, I can't believe I'm the only one who produced a Tim Allen/Scooby Doo confused grunt when looking at the wide range of lofts for a single company's 7 iron...Their 712 lineup had only 4 models: MB/CB/AP2/AP1 and the 7i lofts ranged from 35-33 deg.  With the latest addition to their 2020 lineup they now have 7 models with 7i lofts ranging from 35-26 deg.  There's obviously a market for the various models (tour, players, players distance, GI, SGI, etc.) and they can stamp whatever they want on their clubs, but couldn't somebody in R&D or Quality Control at least make the suggestion that an elite company's 7 iron should only have a 4 to 5 degree range of lofts between models?  (Kinda sorta thought that's why they have lower numbers...)

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Truth in Advertising...

The ruling bodies could pass an edict that says each iron number has to be associated with a given range of clubface degree loft.  Of course, then Carl would be back to hitting a 4 iron where he used to hit an "8" iron.  And that's too much like rolling the distance of golf balls back.

Edited March 13, 2020 by Double Mocha Man

[Matt Maxey]

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:07 PM, iacas said:

What if the T400 7-iron launches at about the same angle as the T100? Or the CB?

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If I were getting fit and looking at this particular model I would think that with the 7i at 26° is a degree stronger then my current 6i so that is the club I'd compare it to so basically I'd view it as a high launching replacement for my 6i. 

[billchao]

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:00 PM, HoganApexFan said:

Have to agree with excellent posts that what a mfgr stamps on the bottom of their clubs shouldn't matter to anyone except prospective buyers and fitters.  OTOH, I can't believe I'm the only one who produced a Tim Allen/Scooby Doo confused grunt when looking at the wide range of lofts for a single company's 7 iron...Their 712 lineup had only 4 models: MB/CB/AP2/AP1 and the 7i lofts ranged from 35-33 deg.  With the latest addition to their 2020 lineup they now have 7 models with 7i lofts ranging from 35-26 deg.  There's obviously a market for the various models (tour, players, players distance, GI, SGI, etc.) and they can stamp whatever they want on their clubs, but couldn't somebody in R&D or Quality Control at least make the suggestion that an elite company's 7 iron should only have a 4 to 5 degree range of lofts between models?  (Kinda sorta thought that's why they have lower numbers...)

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They’re diversifying their market, tapping into a segment they historically weren’t involved in. I don’t see anything wrong with that.

Maybe someone in R&D suggested they produce SGI clubs because they will sell well based on the company’s elite reputation?

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:07 PM, iacas said:

What if the T400 7-iron launches at about the same angle as the T100? Or the CB?

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I bring up this point once in a while. As I understand it, this is exactly how equipment manufacturers determine what number to designate a club.

[HoganApexFan]

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:34 PM, billchao said:

They’re diversifying their market, tapping into a segment they historically weren’t involved in. I don’t see anything wrong with that.

Maybe someone in R&D suggested they produce SGI clubs because they will sell well based on the company’s elite reputation?

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Absolutely no issues with any company diversifying, and they do introduce new models in the US based on overseas success.  Concur with the SGI idea as well, and was not trying to insinuate an elite company should not be making SGI clubs.  My WTH? had to do with the range of lofts for their 7 irons.  Not really understanding how labeling a 26 deg SGI iron with a #6 would negatively impact their brand.

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:34 PM, billchao said:

  On 3/13/2020 at 8:07 PM, iacas said:

What if the T400 7-iron launches at about the same angle as the T100? Or the CB?

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I bring up this point once in a while. As I understand it, this is exactly how equipment manufacturers determine what number to designate a club.

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Would love to hear more about this, as the most recent articles I have read indicate that iron number designation is primarily determined by loft.  That is why iacas' comment regarding launch angle actually caught me completely off guard.  I was aware that the technology in SGI clubs was designed to help with launch angle, stability, etc., but hadn't heard the correlation between that and number designation. 

[ChetlovesMer]

  On 3/13/2020 at 7:29 PM, Bonvivant said:

I explained what I think about it, and it seems not many agree, but some do. 

This is a good sized part of it for me. It's an annoying brag that I hear far too often. 

I've found that the people that brag about this stuff are also people that don't follow the rules of golf very well. The people that have the strong lofted clubs that don't mention it are far better. 

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@Bonvivant You are absolutely entitled to think however you like on this subject. If it annoys you, it annoys you. 

I guess I just don't play with people who ask me what club I just hit. I also don't ask anyone else which club they hit.  --- With 2 possible exceptions. I might say something like I hit my 155 club and it came up way short, so I think you may want to take an extra club here. The other exception is I play with a guy who happens to use the same irons I do. He sometimes asks me what I hit... but not very often. Usually it only comes up if I fly one way over, or if I leave one way short. 

My thought is this if Carl hits his "8-iron" to the center of the green, I'll say "Nice shot". If I hit my 6 iron to center of the same green, I'll expect Carl to say "Nice shot". I'm not sure I've ever bragged about how far I've hit an iron. 

Now, the driver... that's a different story. For example I may have once said something like: "Hey my tee shot just pooped on your ball as flew over it." Or words to that effect. 😇

[Double Mocha Man]

  On 3/13/2020 at 9:01 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

For example I may have once said something like: "Hey my tee shot just pooped on your ball as it flew over it." Or words to that effect. 😇

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Is that line copyrighted or can I use it?

[ChetlovesMer]

  On 3/13/2020 at 9:05 PM, Double Mocha Man said:

Is that line copyrighted or can I use it?

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It's all yours, brother. All yours. 

Be careful with it. Sometimes it comes back to haunt you later, if your driver should go off the rails.... Not that would ever happen to me, I'm just speculating. 

[bweiss711]

Would there still be all this fuss if instead of making a 7 iron that has the same loft of a "standard" 6 iron but launches as high and lands as steep as a standard lofted 7 iron, companies made a 7 iron that has the loft of a "standard" 7 iron, but launched and landed like an 8 iron?