Cheaters

[shades9323]

  Radford Wooly said:

There's almost always going to be a cheater in a group. Count their strokes and tell them your count. 9 times out of 10, they'll revise their score.

You need to find some new people to play with if there is almost always a cheater amongst your group.

[Vintage]

  Koth said:

I don't understand why people get so upset with other people when they don't keep an honest score during a friendly round. It's not affecting your game at all, at least it shouldn't be; if you let something like that effect the way you play, you need a stronger mental game. So who cares how they score themselves? I've never counted the strokes my playing partners made during a round - just write down whatever they tell me. If they get a better score than me, whatever. I know how well I played, and that's all that matters to me.

I tend to agree. I have some friends that are pretty serious about golf.... and we usually have a friendly wager on the game, so the scores are kept accurately.

I have other friends, who view golf as something to do as fun with friends, and aren't all that serious about it. If they give themselves a drop, a mulligan, a gimme that isn't exactly a gimme, I really don't care as long as we aren't holding anyone up behind us. They are out there to just have fun, not keep score.

[Tomboys]

  ibigler said:

So i just got off the course and i was playing with one of my good friends. He's basically the only one of my friends that golf. He's getting really into which im excited about. His goal is to beat me, which shouldn't be that difficult.

It really depends on your friend and your friendship. I have two really good friends that I will occasionally play with--we don't get to play too often because we're really busy. I'll call these two friends Neil and Bob =). Whenever I question a player's stroke count on a hole, I recap with them all the shots they took. For instance, I will say, "Drive in rough, approach short of green, chip and two putt, that's a 5, not a 4." Once they realize I'm paying attention to what they're doing, they usually "straighten out" pretty quick. This is what I did to both Neil and Bob.

In Neil's case, he was pretty new at golf when we started playing. As it turned out, once I did the recap technique, I discovered that he never knew the proper way to count penalty strokes. So, it wasn't that he tried to cheat, he just didn't know. Once I explained the rules, his scores became "honest". Now, we normally play for lunch or dinner and we're pretty competitive overall. However, there are days when he's having a rough time and I allow him to "cheat" here and there. Most of the time, I'm the one that initiates it. For instance, yesterday we were all tied after 15 holes. I hit my drive on 16 in the fairway. He snap hooks two drives OB, so I tell him to drop a ball next to mine and play from there--we had a foursome waiting behind us. We both card a bogey on that hole. At the end of the round, I lose to him by one stroke. I don't care and I buy lunch anyway. We laugh about all the bad shots we hit and made plans to play again soon. My other friend, Bob seems more like your friend in that all he wants to do is beat me. When I did the recap technique, he would leave out obvious strokes. When I called BS on it, he would feign that he didn't remember, but if that's what I "thought" then he would take the score. After a few rounds together, he got progressively worse. He started recapping my scores. I remember the last time we played, we both teed off on a par 3. Our shots landed just off the green @ 10 feet from each other. I was a little farther from the green, so I chipped up first. He then chipped up and we both two-putted for bogey. We get back to the cart and he says, "score?". I reply 4, bogey. He says, "Really? I thought you had a 5. Didn't you chip twice?" I'm like, "Uhh no. You were right there next to me tee to green. When did I chip twice?". He says, "Well, I wasn't watching you, so I don't know for sure." I replied, "If you weren't watching me, how do you know that I chipped twice?" Finally, he says, "It doesn't matter. You said 4, so that's what I'll write down." The funny thing is that when Bob and I played, I would get calls from mutual friends. They would say, "Heard you lost to Bob the other day. How many strokes did he shave?". So, apparently, the most consistent aspect of Bob's game is his cheating. Don't get me wrong, both are still my good friends and I hang out with them whenever we have time. However, I will only play golf with Bob when he calls me. Otherwise, forget it. My game gives me enough grief. I don't need more.

[spc lewis]

a friend and i took up golf at about the same time. he didnt like to count penalty strokes or would forget strokes here and there. then at the end of the round would talk trash if he won. now we talk trash a good bit so its acceptable unless you arent counting strokes. So what i started doing is anytime i knew he wasnt giving me an honest score i would just say something like..."well at the end of the day you'll know what your score was." He starting counting penalties and keeing track of his strokes. Now its a joke during casual rounds. on a real bad hole he'll give me some score lower than what he actually scored and say "at the end of the day i'll know my score". So that might be one way to handle it but only if there is something on the line. Bragging rights are always on the line with us.

[CStaley]

If you aren't playing for money, it doesn't really matter.

Set up a round for money, and after the first couple of holes he'll realize you're keeping track.

[double_j]

If he's really your friend, just call him on it. It doesn't have to be mean or anything even if it's a money match.

You: "What'd you get there?"
Him: "5"
You: "I thought you lost one in the hazard and three putt?"
Him: "Yeah, I think so."
You: "That should be a six, you need to add a stroke when dropping out of a hazard. You trying to cheat or something?"

This last line should be delivered with a bit of educational sarcasm. Also, keep in mind that your friend just might not know how to count for lost balls, etc. Oh yeah, and make sure that you know you're right before you say anything or else you'll just look like a jerk.

If you don't know him that well yet and are playing a competitive match, then just offer to keep score for the match. You'll be able to backcheck him on every hole (it's not that hard to figure out what somebody got on a hole, even if you didn't focus on every shot). If you're not playing a match and you don't know him that well, just ignore it. Don't bring it up unless he starts beating you and bragging about it!

[ChipShot]

  2bGood said:

Just call him on it.

I agree calling him out is the only thing that'll get hom to stop.

[newtogolf]

Are you playing with handicap factored in? I just started getting serious about playing, so I never worried about my score and my friends didnt worry either since they knew it was about having a good time and not competing. It sounds like there's some confusion on both your parts about what the purpose is of playing, bragging rights or just two friends having some fun. If there's money or bragging rights involved, then factor in your handicap so he has a shot. If it's just for fun, then just worry about your score and not his.

[alf174]

My friend that I play the most with is a habitual stroke saver when it comes to shots OB and he prefers to play winter rules/up. I tried to convince him that a OB shot is penalized by stroke & distance but he likes to ignore the distance part of it (taking a drop at the point it goes OB). We only play for a single beer and bragging rights to the tee box so I learned to live with it and let it be. I don't want to force the issue and loose a good partner over it.

[double_j]

  alf174 said:

My friend that I play the most with is a habitual stroke saver when it comes to shots OB and he prefers to play winter rules/up. I tried to convince him that a OB shot is penalized by stroke & distance but he likes to ignore the distance part of it (taking a drop at the point it goes OB). We only play for a single beer and bragging rights to the tee box so I learned to live with it and let it be. I don't want to force the issue and loose a good partner over it.

Next time that he goes OB off the tee, just remind him that he might want to hit a provisional. If he refuses that, then at the very least you can have him hit 4 after the illegal drop (i.e., pretend his 3rd from the tee landed at that spot). While I always try to play a provisional if I think my ball might be lost, I sometimes do this in a casual match if there are people behind me and my ball is unexpectedely lost.

[r23]

I have a buddie that constantly "forgetting" strokes. What I do is when it comes down to marking the score down I always say "what did you get there a 7, or 6,or whatever he happened to get?" I don't even give him a chance to forget, and it lets him know I'm keeping track without actually telling him I'm keeping track.

[jhut03]

I have a buddy like that, he does it all. Rolls his ball over even in the fairway. He marks his ball on the green in front of the ball, then puts the ball about 3-4 inches in front of his marker for every putt. I once watched his ball go way out of bounds, then he walked over to the fence, with a ball in his left hand he reached down with his right and pulled out some grass(acting like he grabbed a ball) then threw the ball with his left hand. He later asked me if he got a free drop from the fence. I said no so he said ok then I got a bogey.

[ChipShot]

  Koth said:

I don't understand why people get so upset with other people when they don't keep an honest score during a friendly round. It's not affecting your game at all, at least it shouldn't be; if you let something like that effect the way you play, you need a stronger mental game. So who cares how they score themselves? I've never counted the strokes my playing partners made during a round - just write down whatever they tell me. If they get a better score than me, whatever. I know how well I played, and that's all that matters to me.

I couldn't care less about what someone gives themselves for a score but whether you want it to be or not golf is a game and games are competitive. That doesn't mean you have to go crazy out on the course and get in yelling matches or fights about each others score but I have a buddy from work who I play with occasionally and he does the same stuff that was described in the beginning of this thread. I know he'll shoot an 8 and all of the sudden he tells me he shot one over. Like I said he can give himself what ever he needs to to make him self feel better but what drives me nuts is that he won't stop talkng about his score and how well he did on said hole. Its like he honestly forgets that he hit two out of bounds and then three putt.......I'm not the greatest golfer in the world by any means but I also don't try and act like I am.

[alf174]

  double_j said:

Next time that he goes OB off the tee, just remind him that he might want to hit a provisional. If he refuses that, then at the very least you can have him hit 4 after the illegal drop (i.e., pretend his 3rd from the tee landed at that spot). While I always try to play a provisional if I think my ball might be lost, I sometimes do this in a casual match if there are people behind me and my ball is unexpectedely lost.

That has worked sometimes. He knows the rules, he just doesn't care & considers our rounds practice. He's retired & plays some skins games throughout the week & follows the rules when playing them. Personally, when I play the course with him I'm not competing with him, I'm competing against the course & my previous scores. I follow the rules to the best of my knowledge and at the end of the round I'm satisfied that I did it right, thats all that matters.

[JerseyThursday]

  Tomboys said:

The funny thing is that when Bob and I played, I would get calls from mutual friends. They would say, "Heard you lost to Bob the other day. How many strokes did he shave?". So, apparently, the most consistent aspect of Bob's game is his cheating.

It’s been said many times that the way a person conduct themselves on a golf course is a clear indication of their true personality. If this person is notorious for cheating, while playing golf, one would wonder how the rest of dealings go.

Hopefully he isn’t your financial advisor or your sister’s husband.

[Valleygolfer]

When I was in high school my friends and I would bowl together on Saturdays. My best friend was a terrible sport and got pissed off and was a complete ass. Well we started busting his balls about it relentlessly. He finally quit acting that way after taking a verbal beating every week.

So what I am saying is bust his balls like you are giving him $h!t until he gets tired of hearing it. He'll either quit or go cheat with someone else.

[golfaddiction]

My friends I play with always cheat. They give themselves a handful of mulligans per round, count short putts that they miss, and rarely take the proper penalties for OB and hazards. Honestly I just feel bad for them. I shoot mid-80s playing by the letter of the law, and many times they can't break 100 even with cheating. It's just sad to go home saying you shot a 110 or 120. And these are my friends that have been playing for 10+ years.

[snowmanmdp]

  snofrog said:

just weekend golfing I play against the course and could care less of my partners score good or bad I just enjoy the commroderie. throw money into the equation and now we have an issue that needs to be dealt with immediately

Money????We going to play for money??? LOL