New to golf - should I learn with Forged irons?

[Gordon McTavish]

To address the question of "forged vs cavity", why not expand the options and have a look at cavity-backs that are forged (if you are that interested in the forged construction)?

[Stretch]

Just a quick response. The method of production of an iron has nothing much to do with its overall playing characteristics. You can find investment cast blades out there and you can find forged game-improvement cavity backs. Honestly, if you want to make sure that your initial equipment is not going to hold you back as you take up the game seriously and if money is not a major issue, go and get yourself fitted by a good custom clubmaker. They will give you a spectrum of broadly suitable iron head designs to choose from and you can then pick whichever floats your boat. But far more importantly, the assembled clubs will have the appropriate length, lie, overall weight, shaft design, shaft flex and grip size for you -- based on your physical characteristics, strength, athleticism, initial swing tendencies etc. This will do far more for you right off the bat than just focusing on, say, Callaway vs. Ping or cast vs. forged.

Then ask the clubmaker to recommend a good teaching pro in your area. Because you'll need one of those too if you want to improve as fast as you can. Good luck!

[ajschn06]

Originally Posted by Vacant

I will for sure put in a good amount of time at the driving range, and will only begin seriously playing once I feel confident in my ball striking and shortgame. In regards to the "that guy" thing. That's silly bullshit and the only people that think that way are negative douchebags who don't have their egos in check or people that care too much about what dummies think. I'm lucky enough to be surrounded by really cool and positive people, who want to have the best possible time with everything we do. None of us think a certain way because Jim Rome told us we should.

Love it....

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by Stretch

Just a quick response. The method of production of an iron has nothing much to do with its overall playing characteristics. You can find investment cast blades out there and you can find forged game-improvement cavity backs. Honestly, if you want to make sure that your initial equipment is not going to hold you back as you take up the game seriously and if money is not a major issue, go and get yourself fitted by a good custom clubmaker. They will give you a spectrum of broadly suitable iron head designs to choose from and you can then pick whichever floats your boat. But far more importantly, the assembled clubs will have the appropriate length, lie, overall weight, shaft design, shaft flex and grip size for you -- based on your physical characteristics, strength, athleticism, initial swing tendencies etc. This will do far more for you right off the bat than just focusing on, say, Callaway vs. Ping or cast vs. forged.

Then ask the clubmaker to recommend a good teaching pro in your area. Because you'll need one of those too if you want to improve as fast as you can. Good luck!

PS: Didn't know you were in MA until seeing your thread about courses there. Can actually recommend a couple of fitters in the general area, as I used to live there.

Frank Viola at Ace Of Clubs in Saugus. http://www.aceofclubstp.com/

Tom Spargo at Spargo Golf in Cranston, RI. http://www.spargogolf.com

[limoric]

If you're goal is to get as good as possible as opposed to just getting out to hack the ball around with buddies, buy something that will provide a lot of feedback, something in the line of a forged blade. I tried a bunch of game improvement irons over the past 9 years and always gravitate back towards a blade-like iron. I say blade-like because most of today's so-called blades are either muscle back or have some perimeter weighting. My first set of blade like irons was the Cleveland CG2's; loved them, they provided great feedback. Now I play the Callaway X-forged, they are the best Iron I've ever played (amazing!!!)

I personally don't get the whole game improvement iron category. They all really felt dead to me, even when I hit good shots. When I hit bad shot's, the feeling was much the same, only the result was of course worse. Very clunky feeling clubs. Maybe today's forged versions are better, but you're never going to learn to work the ball with significant offset.

If I were you, I'd pick up 2 almost new or discounted sets for the price you'll pay for 1. e.g., X-forged and X-22's and switch back and fourth. If you have a competitive nature, you will get very frustrated with the blades. When you see Pros switching back and fourth...it tells you something. You cannot compensate with blades, you either hit them right or suffer...

[Suge206]

The guy gave you solid advice, no one attacked you,  it seems you are the one acting out and seem 'broken'.  If you want to drop 2k on all matching current season gear go ahead with your bad self.

[zeg]

Originally Posted by Suge206

The guy gave you solid advice, no one attacked you,  it seems you are the one acting out and seem 'broken'.  If you want to drop 2k on all matching current season gear go ahead with your bad self.

Yeah, I didn't see any attacks, just some advice.  If you ask for advice, you may not like all of it.

And I think it was generally good advice.  If you are looking to spend $2k with what seems to be minimal exposure to the game or familiarity with equipment, you are throwing money away needlessly.  If you have been intelligent enough with your money as you claim, then you should understand why this is more likely than not a foolish approach.  Get playing with a cheaper set of equipment, or at least get set up with a coach who can help you make sensible choices.  You'll improve a lot faster with good lessons and a $150 used set from play it again sports than you will with $2k of the finest forged clubs.

[delav]

Originally Posted by Vacant

I'm going to begin playing golf, with the intention of becoming as good as possible, once the weather lightens up here. I plan on playing 18 holes every single day. Now, would I be better off learning with forged / blade irons; or should I opt for the more forgiving cavity backed irons? Also, I have $2,000+ to spend. I plan on purchasing:

Callaway Razr Hawk Tour - 9.5* Driver

Callaway Razr Hawk - 3 and 5 wood

Callaway Razr x cavity or forged - 3-PW

Callaway Jaws Wedges - 56* and 60*

Odyssey White Ice #1

Any good advice would be helpful.

I think the opinions of others should be taken with a grain of salt, rather than dismissed when people suggest alternate ideas.

If you are brand new to the game and serious about learning, I'd set aside an equal amount of money for lessons as you spend on any equipment.  It will shorten your path toward strong golf, and reduce years of struggling.

As far as equipment, there is nothing wrong with going all-new, all-callaway or whatever you choose.  There are only a few clubs in my bag that I bought brand new, and I seem to get the ball around the course just fine.  Yesterdays best is still great.  Fit is key for irons.

If you want to spend $2k, go to the golf store and hit everything.  It's a great position to be in, and you'll end up with the best sticks for your game if you keep your mind open and try products from several companies.

For what it's worth, we've all seen the all-callaway, all-TM, all-anything Joe Schmos/fan boys at the range with a $2k bag and a swing that has likely never seen lessons.  You wont make anyone mad, but you'll give them something to chuckle over as they hit their balls.

[max power]

I was trying to be helpful in my first reply, but this guy clearly doesn't want to hear anything other than "yeah-do what you were gonna do."  In summation, I hope the OP takes up another sport.

[Texian]

I like your choice of equipment, even though I play with Mizuno irons, an Odyssey putter, and Wilson 3-wood and hybrids. I do have a Calloway driver, just switched from Titleist, and I like it fine.

You've gotten some good advice here and some undue criticism, so don't mind that.

My advice is in general.

Get good equipment and learn to use it, rather than get someone to fit equipment to your faults. Fitting is good to a certain extent, but is overdone these days because it sells more equipment.

Work hard to get better at the game. I know a lot of people at my club who started playing the white tees, even though the blues and even golds are rather short, because they liked to tell their wives and friends what great scores they shoot. Now when they play interclub, they wonder why they don't win. No mystery to me.

Two small points. Putt everything out. It doesn't have to slow the game, but if you depend on conceded putts to shoot a good score, you're not being realistic, and when you're in competition and there are no conceded putts, it will upset your game.

Also, never improve your lie when practicing. You're not allowed to do so in competition. That way you'll get so used to the occasional bad lie that bad lies won't upset you when it counts.

Enjoy the process of the game more than the results, because it truly is special.

[WUTiger]

Quote: Vacant said...

I plan on playing 18 holes every single day. Now, would I be better off learning with forged / blade irons; or should I opt for the more forgiving cavity backed irons?

First, take some lessons. Very few self-taught golfers do very well in the sport. Everybody has a swing inside, it just comes out faster if you have a good teacher. Sometimes, you can find a teaching pro who will suggest types of clubs to you.

Second, be aware that "forged" describes a manufacturing process, not a guarantee that the clubs will be blades.

• Nike VR.Pro Combo is forged, but contains a mix of blade and cavityback clubs in the same set.
• Callaway Diablo Forged Irons are cavityback.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedFox999

yea, well you dont have to buy them at the store. Just talk with them and look and hit. Then find a place online to buy them. ...

Not very good advice. As a beginner, staffers at a good store/proshop can give you a static fitting. This basic fitting makes sure the clubs are the proper shaft length and lie angle for you.

Plus, hitting them at the store and buying them elsewhere is unethical. And, not a good way to build relationships with people who could help you get started.

[anotherday]

Originally Posted by Vacant

I don't have a job in the sense that I'm a guy who gets up at 6:00 AM and slaves away until 6:00 PM. I've been fortunate enough to have enough foresight to allow me to make money a bit more intelligently. Why?

Ah, a drug dealer! Excellent. Kidding kidding.. Welcome to playing golf. Just a warning.. usually the only people that frequent online golf forums are those that are either looking for answers, or those that think they have all of the answers. Take all advice with a grain of salt..

My advice, don't be too eager to buy a club. Find a place that will let you demo clubs. Just like they say measure twice and cut once... swing many clubs, and buy the one set that produces the results that YOU want (no one else). Nothing worse than swinging a club you hate - thats when you find how much of a mental game golf really is.

[RedFox999]

Originally Posted by WUTiger

Quote: Vacant said...

Quote:

Not very good advice. As a beginner, staffers at a good store/proshop can give you a static fitting. This basic fitting makes sure the clubs are the proper shaft length and lie angle for you.

Plus, hitting them at the store and buying them elsewhere is unethical. And, not a good way to build relationships with people who could help you get started.

yea those are good points, but people hit clubs all the time in stores to try them out, nothing really uneithical about not buying it at the store if you hit them or talked with a salesperson at the store.

[huskylawyer]

I think there is some good advice in this thread.

Like the original poster, I am blessed to have the means to spend up to $2K on new equipment.  Additionally, like the OP, I'm new to the game (well..i played a long time ago, but not enough to rise above a "beginner").    BTW, the only reason I can spend the $$ is because I don't have any other expensive hobbies.  I'm just a middle class dude that needs a hobby! (other than poker lol).

However, I wanted to spend my money wisely.   So as suggested by some here, I did the following:

1) I literally lived at the local golf store (not a big chain, but a reputable golf store that has been around for awhile), to the point where the people working there were like, "you again??!!" LOL.   I basically told them (a) my budget, (b) that I wasn't that good, and (c) how much I plan on playing (driving range 2-3 times a week--during summer, at least 18 holes each week).   This helped them give me some great advice.

2) Go for gear that will be "forgiving" and for high handicappers.   This will narrow down the gear for you.   The local store owner should be able to help, and also lurk on this board to see what people generally classify as "forgiving."

3) Practice with the gear the forum users and local golf store owners recommend.    I learned about the Ping K15 on this forum (some users noted how forgiving it was).  My store had a place to hit, and they hooked up gizmos to the clubs to measure my speed and swing.   This further helped narrow down what I should get.  Additionally, by practicing with different gear, you will gravitate to stuff that simply "feels better".

I ended buying my bag first (Ping Latitude v2), then my irons (which were fitted - Callaway Diablo Edges) on my first visit to the store (which lasted about 2 hours).  After about 8 visits to the local golf store, I also ended up with a Ping K15 driver (noted for being forgiving), Ping G15 hybrid (23*), and a Nike Method putter (I probably should have bought a cheaper one, but it was love at first sight).    I probably spent about $1,500, but I really feel confident that I did my due diligence and I have gear that fits my game at this point.

Just my 2 cents.

[ohiolefty]

Jim Rome told me to tell you to buy used equipment at first, regardless of configuration or brand. THEN spend the rest of your 2k on lessson and memberships at a range and a cheap, easy public course. BOOYA...I AM OUT!

[dbuck]

To summarize the gist of several other good posts in this thread; there is really no difference in quality per se, between forged or cast, as long as you are dealing with a quality club to begin with.  The forgiving qualities of one vs the other really relates to the design of the club itself -no offset blade vs radical offset extreme cavity at opposite ends of the spectrum. I don't think you will find vast differences in durability either.  I have a set of forged blades that are 30+ years old and a set of cast cavity backs that are 18 years old and either would pass for maybe 6 months old if you aren't familiar with the models. I am somewhat meticulous in the care of the equipment, but as long as you have quality stuff, durability will not be a material issue.

The clubs you have selected are probably fine, I am not a serious student of the new Razr line from Callaway, but I think both of the iron models you chose offer some forgiveness.  I would lean toward more loft in the driver, though.  Unless planning to be a serious amateur or tour pro, a lot of us could take the set you've chosen and be fine.  They are not necessarily better than a similar set from Titleist, Adams, Taylor, or others but not any worse either.  That said, buying a top line set of new clubs if you are truly a rank beginner, is not really a great INVESTMENT from the standpoint of getting something you will keep for a long time. It might work out, it might not, but the odds are within a year you will want something different if you become a serious student of the game. A better approach might be to get something like ( I'll use Callaway since you are interested) a lightly used set of X-22's--or even a heavily discounted new set now that the new models are out.  Maybe hold off on the driver for a while, until your swing is better developed.  Get a lesson or 3 to make sure you start with the correct fundamentals. After you play a while and your swing is more developed, then get fit by a qualified fitter for the top line set of your choosing. Obviously by investment I mean getting the value from the playing of the clubs, not that they are worth more or less later--they all depreciate to virtually nothing.

As to which makes you a better player--whew that one is volumes of debate. It is true that a forged blade requires a more precise strike and that misses are easily detectable. So from that standpoint, the blade requires more precision to produce moderately acceptable results. A beginner though, must overcome a high frustration level to get to where the strikes are more consistent. I am not saying it can't be done, but it takes a lot of practice and a lot of patience. A perfect shot with either blade or cavity is still a perfect shot. A better approach might be to start with more forgiving and once consistent performance is achieved, start working with less forgiving irons if that is your desire.