Why is it a GIR if you drive Par 4s or reach Par 5s in two?

[nleary9201]

Why don't  you get 1.5 G.I.R. when you hit a par 4 in one or a par 5 in two?? Why hasn't someone change this stat? Just a thought. Seems to make sense to me.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by nleary9201

Why don't  you get 1.5 G.I.R. when you hit a par 4 in one or a par 5 in two?? Why hasn't someone change this stat? Just a thought. Seems to make sense to me.

Because it's a binary state. You hit the green in regulation or you didn't. You can't hit the green 1.5 times. You can (1) or not (0).

[Bullitt5339]

Agreed......  There's one green per hole, so you can only hit it once.  If regulation is 2 and you drive it, you've still made it in regulation or better.

[turtleback]

But what if you drive a par 4 and then on your first putt you run it past the hole and off the green,  Is it still a GIR?

[iacas]

Originally Posted by turtleback

But what if you drive a par 4 and then on your first putt you run it past the hole and off the green,  Is it still a GIR?

Yep.

Tiger putted into the water on #15 (IIRC) at Augusta one year. Still counted as a GIR.

[deasy55]

What a ridiculous thread

[The_Pharaoh]

Originally Posted by iacas

Yep.

Tiger putted into the water on #15 (IIRC) at Augusta one year. Still counted as a GIR.

So if you putt off the green after hitting it in regulation, then hole the next putt or chip in it still counts as one putt? It looks weird on the stats sheet as it looks as if the player made birdie when in fact they made a par.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by The_Pharaoh

So if you putt off the green after hitting it in regulation, then hole the next putt or chip in it still counts as one putt? It looks weird on the stats sheet as it looks as if the player made birdie when in fact they made a par.

I've heard it both ways - that it's a putt and that it's not. Is it an up and down or not? That's a similar question.

In the end, who cares? It doesn't happen anywhere near often enough to worry about it...

[The_Pharaoh]

Originally Posted by iacas

I've heard it both ways - that it's a putt and that it's not. Is it an up and down or not? That's a similar question.

In the end, who cares? It doesn't happen anywhere near often enough to worry about it...

For my own stats I count it as a GIR and one putt, however I usually don't hole the one coming back on. Yes, I admit it, it has happened to me in the past! ;-) And I don't count it as an U&D.;

I actually sent a couple of e-mails to the PGA Tour to clarify these stat issues and never got a reply.

I was also concerned with Sand Saves. What happens if you thin a sand shot over the green into another bunker, then get U&D;? Is it 0/1 on the first bunker and 1/1 on the second or is it only one SS attempt per hole regardless of the number of bunkers you go in? Same thing if you leave one in the bunker...

[TourSpoon]

Originally Posted by The_Pharaoh

I was also concerned with Sand Saves. What happens if you thin a sand shot over the green into another bunker, then get U&D;? Is it 0/1 on the first bunker and 1/1 on the second or is it only one SS attempt per hole regardless of the number of bunkers you go in? Same thing if you leave one in the bunker...

This happened to me today...in bunker A thinned across into bunker B, splashed to 8 feet and made the putt.  For Scorecard, I tried to put both U and S for the SS stat, but in the end it was a S.  I think it should be U for the first and S for the second.

[The_Pharaoh]

Originally Posted by TourSpoon

This happened to me today...in bunker A thinned across into bunker B, splashed to 8 feet and made the putt.  For Scorecard, I tried to put both U and S for the SS stat, but in the end it was a S.  I think it should be U for the first and S for the second.

Unfo, I think it means no SS and no U&D; for that hole. I think you can only claim a SS if you get up and down from bunker A.

[ControlJunkie]

I always liked the stat from TW PGA Tour game on this one - Green Under Regulation

[Zeph]

AFAIK, there are no clear definitions on U&D; and SS in events like these. Some give themself an U&D; by getting down in two from off the green regardless of final score, some only do it when scoring a par or better. In the end, it is a personal statistic that mainly is meant to help you analyse your game. For a high handicapper that struggle with getting close to the green in regulation, checking U&D; anytime he gets down in two from off the green can make sense. His long game is preventing him from getting greenside in regulation, but he can still monitor his short game ability by doing it like this. A low handicap player is probably better served by using it only when going for par or better. Same goes with sand saves.

I would for instance not give myself a SS if I flubbed the first bunker shot, but got U&D; on the next attempt. It is meant to tell me something about the quality of my bunker play, if I need two tries to get it out, I won't give myself a positive stat point.

[The_Pharaoh]

Originally Posted by Zeph

I would for instance not give myself a SS if I flubbed the first bunker shot, but got U&D; on the next attempt. It is meant to tell me something about the quality of my bunker play, if I need two tries to get it out, I won't give myself a positive stat point.

Unless, of course, you hole the second attempt which happens now and again.

[TourSpoon]

Originally Posted by Zeph

AFAIK, there are no clear definitions on U&D; and SS in events like these. Some give themself an U&D; by getting down in two from off the green regardless of final score, some only do it when scoring a par or better. In the end, it is a personal statistic that mainly is meant to help you analyse your game. For a high handicapper that struggle with getting close to the green in regulation, checking U&D; anytime he gets down in two from off the green can make sense. His long game is preventing him from getting greenside in regulation, but he can still monitor his short game ability by doing it like this. A low handicap player is probably better served by using it only when going for par or better. Same goes with sand saves.

I would for instance not give myself a SS if I flubbed the first bunker shot, but got U&D; on the next attempt. It is meant to tell me something about the quality of my bunker play, if I need two tries to get it out, I won't give myself a positive stat point.

Ok, I know what you are saying, but this was a par 5 greenside bunker in two, still made the par.  Plus SS on the tour is regardless of score.  U/D is only for par saves.

[Shorty]

Originally Posted by The_Pharaoh

So if you putt off the green after hitting it in regulation, then hole the next putt or chip in it still counts as one putt? It looks weird on the stats sheet as it looks as if the player made birdie when in fact they made a par.

Gawd.  Give us a break.  I once tried to putt through a bunker with no lip from a tight lie.  I putted it into the bunker.  I then tried to putt it out of the bunker and left it short of the green.  I then holed  it from off the green.  Statistically, that's zero putts.  Just goes to show how misleading stats are.  I can guarantee that apparently great putting stats are usually a reflection of poor iron play, not good putting.

You can use stats any way you like, but if the pin is 10 feet awat from you and you putt it from off the green and take 3, statistically its 2 putts, but it means something else.  Crap putting.  Think about how and why you want to use statistics.  They are to help you to analyse your strengths and weaknesses.  They are not an end in themselves.

[jdotConnor]

for GIR on par 5's reached in 2 I think of it like getting somewhere "on time" if I'm 30 minutes early I'm still "on time" just early.

for sand saves and up and downs I only count them so if the 1 putt is for par.  I don't, but you could count, in the case of a par 4 almost driven or a par 5 reached in 2 to birdie.

[TourSpoon]

Originally Posted by Shorty

but if the pin is 10 feet awat from you and you putt it from off the green and take 3, statistically its 2 putts, but it means something else.  Crap putting.  Think about how and why you want to use statistics.  They are to help you to analyse your strengths and weaknesses.  They are not an end in themselves.

I have to agree with Shorty on this one.  A Crap Putt would have to be recorded.  Again, this would be a rare stat (hopefully).