Course with Interesting Pace of Play Guidelines

[Topper]

I was on another business trip this week to northern NJ and looked at golf courses nearby in case I had time to play.  It turns out that I didn't, but I did find one nearby course that had interesting (and clearly communicated) pace of play expectations that seemed to be a reasonable compromise for both skilled and less skilled golfers.  I don't know if anyone has ever golfed at Bowling Green golf course but I may try to check it out during my next trip to the area.  The greens fees seem reasonable for the area (although "expensive" by central NY standards).

Pace of Play Monitoring: http://www.bowlinggreengolf.com/pace-of-play/pace-of-play-results

Fast Play Tips: http://www.bowlinggreengolf.com/pace-of-play/fast-play-tips

They post guidelines based on ability on when to "pick-up" if you're racking up a big score on a particular hole but at the same time allows high handicappers up to a 9 or 10 which seems more than reasonable.  Anyway, this golf course seem to do a lot more than simply instruct players to keep up with the group in front which is advise that's almost akin to telling someone to just be a better golfer by playing like low handicappers.

I think if courses did a better job of establishing expectations up front it would reduce frustration for fast players when they're unable to get a 3:45 round and help slower players move a little faster without feeling rushed.

Has anyone ever played at this course or at other courses with similar pace of play programs and how well do they work?

[tristanhilton85]

I read through their "tips" and it's really just common sense.  I already do all of those things (except pick up).  Thats probably why as a single on an empty course I'll be done in about 2 hours.

[1par2win]

Makes sense to me. It's is a common sense approach. But the one thing I would take exception to is the condescending comment about how this isn't the US Open. While it is true that the players out on the course are not playing the US Open their course isn't Bethpage Black either. Most likely if a ranger/marshall/whatever they have out there were to say something like that to a player or group it would immediately put the player in a defensive mode and not much good can come of that.

But with that said the avg time for their rounds they posted are about the same as the times around the Twin Cites area so maybe pace of play is a bigger issue in some places than others.

[Topper]

Originally Posted by 1par2win

But with that said the avg time for their rounds they posted are about the same as the times around the Twin Cites area so maybe pace of play is a bigger issue in some places than others.

I don't live in the area but it's a relatively short distance from New York City and NJ is the most densely populated state in the country.  I'm guessing pace of play is a lot more critical there.

[Crab Daddy]

That's a good idea to spell it out for a lot of golfers. At one course I played at, there was a clock at every 3rd or 4th hole. The clocks were all set to reflect your start time. If the time on the clock was later than your start time, you were falling behind a 4 hour pace.

[RayG]

I'll second the notion that those tips are common sense. And I applaud them for trying to get that 4hr round on a Sunday. But for the MOST part, that ain't happening on many courses these days. And no offense to the course, but it doesn't exactly strike terror into me. Looks like a nice parkland course with some "shoulders", but not the most severe course I've seen. And apparently it isn't like they're getting folks sleeping in the parking lot for a chance at a tee time. Course designers can be partially to blame by making their course either; "A Monster", "Challenging", or my favorite- "Tournament Ready". For the whatever small percentage of recreational golfers who can do it, do the rest of us need to carry 200 yds of 'environmentally sensitive" wetlands because you couldn't afford a mower? Or just because you want a nice picture for the scorecard and a 'signature hole'? And to be honest- I've played 5 hour rounds that went pretty quickly because I was enjoying the course and company. I've also played 5 hour rounds that seemed like torture. I've also played 3.5/4 hr rounds and felt rushed. A few times a year I wind up with 'rabbits', and it's extremely annoying having people moving all around while you're setting up for your shot or putt. If you want to move around- at least do it BEHIND someone so they can't see you in your peripheral vision. And DON'T do it if you have particularly squeaky shoes. Not everyone gets it, though. One of my friends can't seem to grasp this one, and is standing and/or fidgeting around in my sight lines. I have to back off and remind him to either stop or move where I can't see him.

[johnclayton1982]

Quote:

• If there is a group behind you, limit the time looking for a ball that is obviously not going to be found to one minute.

The rules let you take five minutes but you should try to take less

See, I don't like this.  Call me a slow player maybe (see other thread), but if we're going to change the rules to play faster, why not go hog wild?  Throw the ball out of bunkers.  Behind a tree?  Kick it into the fairway.  It'll speed things up!

I think some things are OK, but you should never change the actual rules to get faster play.  You get five minutes, take five minutes.  Maybe it feels to a scratch or a 5 or a 10 handicap that who cares if somebody shoots a 97 or a 94, but I'm pretty psyched anytime I break 95.  I'm going to take five minutes to find my ball, because if I can and save a stroke I might break 95 or, on very rare occasions, 90.  The rules are the rules.

[RayG]

I don't have a problem with that- IF you know it's findable. Too many folks will watch that slice scream over the trees at 100 mph and 100ft off the ground, then go look for it. Seriously? In that case, just because you have your 5 minutes, doesn't mean you have to hold up the rest of the group on that 1 in a gagillion shot. Faster to take your Provie, give a quick look around while others are taking their shots, go to your second hitting three and move on.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by johnclayton1982

Maybe it feels to a scratch or a 5 or a 10 handicap that who cares if somebody shoots a 97 or a 94, but I'm pretty psyched anytime I break 95.  I'm going to take five minutes to find my ball, because if I can and save a stroke I might break 95 or, on very rare occasions, 90.  The rules are the rules.

Bully for you, but if you do that more than once or twice a round, and especially if in the process you're losing the group in front of you, then please stop doing that because the rules of etiquette trump your quest to break 95 during a non-sanctioned casual round used to not determine a handicap. Yeah, seriously.

[jetsknicks1]

Originally Posted by Crab Daddy

That's a good idea to spell it out for a lot of golfers.

At one course I played at, there was a clock at every 3rd or 4th hole. The clocks were all set to reflect your start time. If the time on the clock was later than your start time, you were falling behind a 4 hour pace.

I love playing courses that have the clocks because it lets everyone, including the group ahead and behind you know exactly where they are in relation to pace of play.

[B-Con]

Regarding the length of time you spend looking for your ball, for myself I've used the rule that the time I spend looking is inversely proportional to the number of balls I expect to have to lose. When I used to lose 5 balls a round, I'd spend a minute or minute and a half looking. Basically just enough time to give the general area a look over and to check behind some trees. When I got it down to a couple balls, I'd invest two or three minutes looking, to make sure I'd find it. In general, I say that the first minute of looking for your ball is free. The golf course is a big place and you deserve to look for your ball if you have an idea of where it is. How much time you spend after that should be related to how often you do it. I'd say that you should spend about 5 minutes total per game looking for lost balls [i]beyond[/i] one minute marker for each ball. If you lose 5 balls, you should spend no more than 2 minutes on a ball. If you lose 2 balls, go ahead and look for about 3 to 4 minutes per ball. If you lose 1 ball, feel free to look for a solid 5 minutes. I don't mind waiting on a teebox for a couple minutes while you try to find a ball, but I do mind doing it every fourth hole. And when I say "looking" I really mean "time spent not hitting". This includes all time spent up to dropping the next one (or re-hitting for those that actually do). If you spend 2 minutes not hitting, that's really only 1.5 minutes of actual "looking". You have to factor in how much time it'll take you to get to a position where you can actually hit your next shot since that holds up people behind you just as much as time spent any other way. [quote]Line up your putt while others are putting. When putting, leave the clubs you used for chipping in line with the next tee. Mark your scorecard after leaving the green. Talk while you walk.[/quote] These four things are those little time-savers that not all golfers think about. Clubs get left in awkward positions that require backtracking, people stop golfing to talk for a little bit, scorecards get marked at inopportune times, putts don't get read until it's their turn, etc. Saving 15 seconds three times per hole saves about 14 minutes total on the round.

[Shindig]

I recently visited the course that is likely to be my new home course when I move, and they evidently enforce pace of play, but rarely have to. I was told by someone that a 4-hour round is regular there. I guess I'll find out in a few months.

[BuckeyeNut]

Originally Posted by Topper

I was on another business trip this week to northern NJ and looked at golf courses nearby in case I had time to play.  It turns out that I didn't, but I did find one nearby course that had interesting (and clearly communicated) pace of play expectations that seemed to be a reasonable compromise for both skilled and less skilled golfers.  I don't know if anyone has ever golfed at Bowling Green golf course but I may try to check it out during my next trip to the area.  The greens fees seem reasonable for the area (although "expensive" by central NY standards).

Pace of Play Monitoring:  http://www.bowlinggreengolf.com/pace-of-play/pace-of-play-results

Fast Play Tips: http://www.bowlinggreengolf.com/pace-of-play/fast-play-tips

They post guidelines based on ability on when to "pick-up" if you're racking up a big score on a particular hole but at the same time allows high handicappers up to a 9 or 10 which seems more than reasonable.  Anyway, this golf course seem to do a lot more than simply instruct players to keep up with the group in front which is advise that's almost akin to telling someone to just be a better golfer by playing like low handicappers.

I think if courses did a better job of establishing expectations up front it would reduce frustration for fast players when they're unable to get a 3:45 round and help slower players move a little faster without feeling rushed.

Has anyone ever played at this course or at other courses with similar pace of play programs and how well do they work?

I'm all for it!!! Kudo's to this course for taking on slow play.....

If it's a casual round, I believe in equitable stroke control dictating when to pick up.  If you don't have a HC......the above isn't a bad place to start.  All good suggestions, IMO........

[zeg]

Originally Posted by RayG

I don't have a problem with that- IF you know it's findable. Too many folks will watch that slice scream over the trees at 100 mph and 100ft off the ground, then go look for it. Seriously? In that case, just because you have your 5 minutes, doesn't mean you have to hold up the rest of the group on that 1 in a gagillion shot. Faster to take your Provie, give a quick look around while others are taking their shots, go to your second hitting three and move on.

Yep, usually I have a pretty good feeling for whether the ball is findable or not.  If I just don't see it in an open area, I'll take closer to the full time, just because I know I'm likely to find it.  If it's in heavy scrub, then I'm just going to look in the most likely places and move on.

The other factor I consider is where I'm looking and whether I'm going to have any hope at playing an open shot.  If not, the stroke+distance isn't that much extra penalty compared to a chip-out, so I am less likely to spend much time before taking the provisional.