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Single Length vs. Varying Length

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35 members have voted

  1. 1. What do you think about single length Irons

    • Legitimate
      0
    • GIMMICK!
      17


173 posts in this topic Last Reply

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I tried out the Cobra King Forged OL irons this past weekend when I was in Orlando.  My carry distances were WAY down from my gamers.  Love the feel and how they set up but there's no way I could game them based on the carry distances I was seeing.

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The new Edel SLI looks pretty appealing, as well as the Cobra models. I've researched Paderson shafts though (in the new Edel SLI) and it's oddly high in torque for an iron. Perhaps that's part of the design.

I have been playing with a set of the "classic" 1irongolf single-length irons. That company/website screams gimmick, but I wanted to try them anyway. 5-GW at 36" (typical 9 iron).

In my experience so far, the 8-GW play very similar to regular, progressive sets because the length is comparable. It is quite enjoyable hitting the "little" mid-irons and I am serious when I say the distance is still there. By no means am I a master of centripetal force, but the stronger lofts do go farther than the weaker ones considering (perhaps assuming) all other factors being equal.

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I've been using Pinhawk SL single length irons for over a year now and I don't think that I'll ever go back to a traditional set of irons based on how well my ball striking has improved after the switch. It was incredibly awkward in the beginning, but I got over it fairly quickly since I wasn't spraying the ball all over the course anymore.

Of course, single length sets have different lofts than traditional clubs to account for the difference in club lengths (stronger lofts) and the gaps are fairly consistent as well.

The trade-off of the stronger loft is more roll-out on the longer clubs, but we're really only talking about a couple extra yards. Since most people fat their 4/5 irons anyway, more roll-out is a good price to pay for consistently hitting your balls on the green, right?

If you can't see past the idea that this may be a gimmick, you'll probably never try a set regardless of what I say - but if you want to try single length irons without investing a ton of money, you can build a set of Pinhawk SL irons (5 thru PW) for about $250, which is less than most new drivers these days.

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On 3/17/2017 at 10:23 PM, Single Length Irons Guy said:

I've been using Pinhawk SL single length irons for over a year now and I don't think that I'll ever go back to a traditional set of irons based on how well my ball striking has improved after the switch. It was incredibly awkward in the beginning, but I got over it fairly quickly since I wasn't spraying the ball all over the course anymore.

Of course, single length sets have different lofts than traditional clubs to account for the difference in club lengths (stronger lofts) and the gaps are fairly consistent as well.

The trade-off of the stronger loft is more roll-out on the longer clubs, but we're really only talking about a couple extra yards. Since most people fat their 4/5 irons anyway, more roll-out is a good price to pay for consistently hitting your balls on the green, right?

If you can't see past the idea that this may be a gimmick, you'll probably never try a set regardless of what I say - but if you want to try single length irons without investing a ton of money, you can build a set of Pinhawk SL irons (5 thru PW) for about $250, which is less than most new drivers these days.

Well, essentially SL irons are in fact, a gimmick. Why? Let's face it. Had  Bryson Dechambeau not played them (who by the way has been a flop on the tour) this discussion would not even exist. This idea was tried years ago and never came to any fruition. Now years a later a quirky young guy with a physics major who won the NCAA and US Amateur wearing a Ben Hogan hat sparks a little interest and all of a sudden....maybe, just maybe he's on to something....nope.  Gimmick. No data shows anything to prove they have any advantage at all. It's all anecdotal evidence such as what you provided. Gimmick.

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I voted gimmick. Although I honestly was a little intrigued by the concept and I think it could be legitimate for a small population of golfers, it's not for me. 

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I was very intrigued until I saw that the single length was pretty long. I naively thought they might all be like 8 irons, but I think it's closer to 6 irons length.

My instructor said "it's been tried before", and "stay away".

 

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7 minutes ago, Kalnoky said:

I was very intrigued until I saw that the single length was pretty long. I naively thought they might all be like 8 irons, but I think it's closer to 6 irons length.

You realize that's like 3/4 to 1", right? :-)

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27 minutes ago, Kalnoky said:

I was very intrigued until I saw that the single length was pretty long. I naively thought they might all be like 8 irons, but I think it's closer to 6 irons length.

My instructor said "it's been tried before", and "stay away".

 

Maybe Iacas is on it.....but I thought you were kidding?

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3 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Maybe Iacas is on it.....but I thought you were kidding?

No, not at all. The 8-iron is my favorite club. That 1" makes a big difference in comfort to me. 

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39 minutes ago, Kalnoky said:

No, not at all. The 8-iron is my favorite club. That 1" makes a big difference in comfort to me. 

Oh! Well alright then. Well, maybe you could build a set that is based on your 8i length? Ok, I'm kidding. I don't buy the SL irons whatsoever. Golf is hard. Unfortunately some people just don't realize that enough. SL:Gimmick.

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11 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Golf is hard. Unfortunately some people just don't realize that enough. SL:Gimmick.

Yes, you are right. That was about 6 months ago I inquired about these SL irons. It never went past a simple inquiry. I haven't bought any new clubs since last summer, and I don't plan on it. I've played enough golf now to know clubs are not the problem or the solution for most of us.  

Edited by Kalnoky

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3 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Well, essentially SL irons are in fact, a gimmick. Why? Let's face it. Had  Bryson Dechambeau not played them (who by the way has been a flop on the tour) this discussion would not even exist. This idea was tried years ago and never came to any fruition. Now years a later a quirky young guy with a physics major who won the NCAA and US Amateur wearing a Ben Hogan hat sparks a little interest and all of a sudden....maybe, just maybe he's on to something....nope.  Gimmick. No data shows anything to prove they have any advantage at all. It's all anecdotal evidence such as what you provided. Gimmick.

I was checking out Bryson's stats since I wasn't sure if "flop" was an accurate way to describe his pro career so far, and admittedly it hasn't been stellar, but he's had some top-10s and 1 win on the Web.com and in less than 15 tournaments in 2016 won over $700k.  But he also had a lot of missed cuts.

The thing that struck me is his GIR isn't very good.  In 2016 he didn't even average 60%.  What's crazy is a week like his pro debut at Harbour Town his GIR was 57%, Fairways were 48%, sand saves 50% and he finished T4.  At the Byron Nelson his GIR was 80%, fairways 61%, sand saves 100% and he missed the cut.  But overall he doesn't seem to be hitting many greens or fairways.

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This thread is why I love America, where one person's fact is another's fiction, and it's perfectly OK!

I was listening to my local sports talk radio today at lunch where they were talking about conspiracy theories. One guy called in and said that he definitely did not believe that our top government officials were really lizard people, but he also believed that the Earth was clearly flat because if we lived on a sphere, the people who lived in the South would be upside down. He was dead serious and wouldn't be swayed by the show hosts who were laughing at him while trying to teach him about gravity.

 

3 hours ago, Kalnoky said:

I was very intrigued until I saw that the single length was pretty long. I naively thought they might all be like 8 irons, but I think it's closer to 6 irons length.

My instructor said "it's been tried before", and "stay away".

 

The thing about single length irons (and traditional irons for that matter) is that only the people around average height should use the "standard" length that manufacturers provide. Your ideal length for golf clubs is based on your height, your wrist-to-floor measurement, and your swing plane. So one golfer may use 6-iron length single length irons, another may use 7-iron length single length irons, while another may use 8-iron length single length irons. Do you think that Dustin Johnson at 6'4" is using the "standard" manufacturer iron lengths that you can buy in stores? Nope.

 

24 minutes ago, 1badbadger said:

I was checking out Bryson's stats since I wasn't sure if "flop" was an accurate way to describe his pro career so far, and admittedly it hasn't been stellar, but he's had some top-10s and 1 win on the Web.com and in less than 15 tournaments in 2016 won over $700k.  But he also had a lot of missed cuts.

The thing that struck me is his GIR isn't very good.  In 2016 he didn't even average 60%.  What's crazy is a week like his pro debut at Harbour Town his GIR was 57%, Fairways were 48%, sand saves 50% and he finished T4.  At the Byron Nelson his GIR was 80%, fairways 61%, sand saves 100% and he missed the cut.  But overall he doesn't seem to be hitting many greens or fairways.

Bryson does use single length irons, but he also uses a single plane swing with a very upright lie angle and little-to-no wrist hinge. His issues come from the fact that he refuses to hinge his wrists in any swing, which severely limits his ability to get the ball close to the hole while chipping. There's a video on YouTube where a Cobra rep flat-out states that they didn't copy Bryson's upright lie angle for their new "one length" clubs because so few people use a single plane swing.

Given how long you have to hit it in the PGA tour, he's probably at a disadvantage and coming up short his green approach shots. I haven't looked at those particular courses, but perhaps he hits more greens on the shorter "strategic" courses rather than the "long" courses.

I think it's important to remember that single length clubs would not be the best for professional players who are required to hit into 250 yard par-3's and that the rest of us are not professionals and not required to hit into 250 yard par-3's. They are basically two different tools for two different "games."

 

4 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Well, essentially SL irons are in fact, a gimmick. Why? Let's face it. Had  Bryson Dechambeau not played them (who by the way has been a flop on the tour) this discussion would not even exist. This idea was tried years ago and never came to any fruition. Now years a later a quirky young guy with a physics major who won the NCAA and US Amateur wearing a Ben Hogan hat sparks a little interest and all of a sudden....maybe, just maybe he's on to something....nope.  Gimmick. No data shows anything to prove they have any advantage at all. It's all anecdotal evidence such as what you provided. Gimmick.

David Lake at 1iron golf has been manufacturing single length irons since 1998, and prior to the 1920s all golf clubs were the same length. Given that David's been in business for almost 20 years and that he believes that Cobra's entry into the market won't come close to touching his annual sales, he must be making money on this idea.

Also, single length irons don't give you an advantage over someone using standard irons, they simply give you a better chance of hitting the ball consistently since you only have to be good at one swing plane instead of 10 swing planes.

You could argue that for a good golfer (i.e. less than 5 handicap) that single length irons would be a disadvantage on the long irons due to the shallower descent angle of the ball, leading to more roll-out. On the other hand, in a video review of Cobra's one length irons, Rick Shiels couldn't get over the fact that the one length pitching wedge generated over 2,000 more spin while going the same distance as the "regular" pitching wedge, which would be an advantage due to shorter roll-out.


@Vinsk No need to flame me, to each his own!

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41 minutes ago, Single Length Irons Guy said:

Given how long you have to hit it in the PGA tour, he's probably at a disadvantage and coming up short his green approach shots. I haven't looked at those particular courses, but perhaps he hits more greens on the shorter "strategic" courses rather than the "long" courses.

Bryson's swing speed is plenty high enough. He's not a short hitter.

That's one of the reasons - his high clubhead speed - that he can get shorter long irons in the air well enough to play a SLI 4-iron, for example.

He's top 50 in Clubhead Speed: http://www.pgatour.com/stats/stat.02401.html

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3 hours ago, Single Length Irons Guy said:

@Vinsk No need to flame me, to each his own!

Not flaming at all. I just don't believe that playing SLI was the answer to your or anybody else's pathway to better golf. Bryson likes to tinker, excessively. Maybe he did experiment and truly found his best game with SL irons. Maybe not. To each his own? Well statistically no. If it was that diverse we'd see SL irons as a huge market. Outliers don't give me much proof there's anything to it more than...well...a gimmick.

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16 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Bryson likes to tinker, excessively. Maybe he did experiment and truly found his best game with SL irons. Maybe not. 

I would have to think that if Bryson didn't hit SL irons the best, he wouldn't be playing them.  I really don't think he's using them just to be different.  Having said that, there is consumer curiosity about them, but I don't think they will become mainstream in the marketplace.  

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15 hours ago, 1badbadger said:

I would have to think that if Bryson didn't hit SL irons the best, he wouldn't be playing them.  I really don't think he's using them just to be different.  Having said that, there is consumer curiosity about them, but I don't think they will become mainstream in the marketplace.  

I agree. What I meant was Bryson seems like the type who could be 'stubborn' and think 'my calculations show that this is the best way to (x), it HAS to work.' 

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