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turtleback

Legendary Conversation

15 posts in this topic

Anyone see the show on Golf Channel with an hour-long conversation between Jack, Arnie, Gary, and Lee?  I watched it tonight and enjoyed it thoroughly.  I'm guessing they will be replaying it so catch it if you can.  Some great stories from the past, how they each viewed the various majors, how the media was different in their day, etc.    They are all getting old so they might not have the opportunity to do this again.  What really impressed me was the depth of the friendship these competitors and rivals have with each other.  Jack said that they were not only proud of their own careers, they were proud of each other's accomplishments.

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Originally Posted by turtleback

Anyone see the show on Golf Channel with an hour-long conversation between Jack, Arnie, Gary, and Lee?  I watched it tonight and enjoyed it thoroughly.  I'm guessing they will be replaying it so catch it if you can.  Some great stories from the past, how they each viewed the various majors, how the media was different in their day, etc.    They are all getting old so they might not have the opportunity to do this again.  What really impressed me was the depth of the friendship these competitors and rivals have with each other.  Jack said that they were not only proud of their own careers, they were proud of each other's accomplishments.

What, they couldn't invite Tom Watson?

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All 4 of those guys have exhibited great class over their entire careers. Can't help but think that is not the case with MOST of the players today. But man would it be awesome to see a legendary conversation 30 years from now with Tiger, Phil, Vijay, and Ernie. Certainly only Tiger is on the legend level of Player, Palmer, Nicklaus, and Trevino, but damn that could be a great conversation. Surely none of them are close friends like the older guys, but could really see some interesting discussion.

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While the deep friendships between them seem apparent now, much of that has developed as they became the old guys and not so much while they were still trying to beat each others' brains out on the course.   There was a respect for each other as competitors, but the friendships emerged more with the wisdom of age.

As to class throughout their careers, these guys have mostly been that way, and probably few in all of sports epitomize the meaning of the word "class" as much as Arnie.    But Trevino isn't always the jocular image he projects.    An acquaintance of mine was a fairly good friend with Lee for many years, and tells that Lee had a pretty hard, bitter edge to him.   One day after a tournament in Lee's early Senior Tour career a kid approached Lee for an autograph after the round in the area it was accepted to do so.   Lee looked at the kid's autograph book, tossed it on the ground at the kid's feet, and said "I don't do that anymore" and walked off.    My friend confronted Lee about his behavior, and Lee's response was that he had to sign autographs for much of his playing career and he was sick of it and just wouldn't do it anymore.    The incident ended their friendship.

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Really enjoyed the televised discussion, in particular the ever feisty Gary Player. All supreme competitors in their primes, even Mr. Nicklaus appears to have mellowed--but not Gary. I can see how Mr. Player's unrelenting competitiveness could be annoying, but I find it admirable and entertaining . I fully expected him to jump onto the table and do single arm push ups.
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What a great combination of characters.  One of the things I absolutely love about golf.  I too wonder which guys we'll be watching give these interviews in 30 years, and what they'll be nostalgic about.  I can see Tiger ripping Phil, Vijay, and Ernie about when they switched to belly putters, and Ernie coming back with "well, I won that Open in 2012 with a belly putter while you were lining up your third putt!"

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Originally Posted by uttexas

Really enjoyed the televised discussion, in particular the ever feisty Gary Player. All supreme competitors in their primes, even Mr. Nicklaus appears to have mellowed--but not Gary. I can see how Mr. Player's unrelenting competitiveness could be annoying, but I find it admirable and entertaining . I fully expected him to jump onto the table and do single arm push ups.

HA! Now that would have been legendary!!

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Originally Posted by LuciusWooding

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtleback

Anyone see the show on Golf Channel with an hour-long conversation between Jack, Arnie, Gary, and Lee?  I watched it tonight and enjoyed it thoroughly.  I'm guessing they will be replaying it so catch it if you can.  Some great stories from the past, how they each viewed the various majors, how the media was different in their day, etc.    They are all getting old so they might not have the opportunity to do this again.  What really impressed me was the depth of the friendship these competitors and rivals have with each other.  Jack said that they were not only proud of their own careers, they were proud of each other's accomplishments.

What, they couldn't invite Tom Watson?

That was my first thought.

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I enjoyed the interview. I have seen all four of them play back in the 90s on the Senior Tour. Nicklaus could still hit that towering fade and Trevino was a master with the wedge.
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Originally Posted by LuciusWooding View Post

Originally Posted by turtleback

Anyone see the show on Golf Channel with an hour-long conversation between Jack, Arnie, Gary, and Lee?  I watched it tonight and enjoyed it thoroughly.  I'm guessing they will be replaying it so catch it if you can.  Some great stories from the past, how they each viewed the various majors, how the media was different in their day, etc.    They are all getting old so they might not have the opportunity to do this again.  What really impressed me was the depth of the friendship these competitors and rivals have with each other.  Jack said that they were not only proud of their own careers, they were proud of each other's accomplishments.

What, they couldn't invite Tom Watson?

Originally Posted by sean_miller

That was my first thought.

I suspect that it was because Watson's career didn't really overlap much with any of the prime of Arnie and, to a lesser extent, Gary.

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If there were a fifth person to join that group, Billy Casper would have been more appropriate.

At any rate, that sounds like an awesome interview! Will have to check that out.

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gary player strikes me as a full on napoleon.

and i thought that arnie and jack dont really and never did really like each other?  that what seems like friendship is them being cordial and not wanting to seem like they hate each other?

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Originally Posted by zipazoid

If there were a fifth person to join that group, Billy Casper would have been more appropriate.

At any rate, that sounds like an awesome interview! Will have to check that out.


Yeah, but in the most important sense, Billy's career didn't really measure up to the others.  Despite having a huge number of tour wins, his resume was kind of light on majors for that era.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by colin007 View Post

and i thought that arnie and jack dont really and never did really like each other?  that what seems like friendship is them being cordial and not wanting to seem like they hate each other?

Complicated relationship. They went from adversaries to cordial to partners to competitors in the course design business to elder statesmen. Here's a great book on their relationship thru the years -

http://books.google.com/books/about/Arnie_and_Jack.html?id=toKIEHepkIgC

Quote:
Surprisingly, one of sport’s most contentious, complex, and defining clashes played out not in the boxing ring or at the line of scrimmage but on the genteel green fairways of the world’s finest golf courses. Arnie and Jack. Palmer and Nicklaus. Their fifty-year duel, in both the clubhouse and the boardroom, propelled each to the status of American icon and pushed modern golf to the heights and popularity it enjoys today.

Arnie was the cowboy, with rugged good looks, Popeye-like forearms, a flailing swing, and charm enough to win fans worldwide. Jack was scientific, precise, conservative, aloof, even fat and awkward. Ultimately, Nicklaus got the better of Palmer on the course, beating him in major victories 18-7. But Palmer bested Nicklaus almost everywhere else, especially in the hearts of the public and in endorsement dollars. By the end of this page-turning narrative, we see that each man wanted what the other had: Arnold wanted the trophies. Jack wanted the love.
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Originally Posted by turtleback

Anyone see the show on Golf Channel with an hour-long conversation between Jack, Arnie, Gary, and Lee?  I watched it tonight and enjoyed it thoroughly.  I'm guessing they will be replaying it so catch it if you can.  Some great stories from the past, how they each viewed the various majors, how the media was different in their day, etc.    They are all getting old so they might not have the opportunity to do this again.  What really impressed me was the depth of the friendship these competitors and rivals have with each other.  Jack said that they were not only proud of their own careers, they were proud of each other's accomplishments.

I have dvr'd it and have watched bits and pieces of it, and yes, what I've seen so far is excellent. So nice to see these four giants of the game get together and reminisce. True enough this may not happen ever again, though I hope it does.

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