Adrian Peterson Indicted On Child Negligence

[mmoan2]

If it was because I beat a child or slugged a woman and dragged her like a piece of meat? Yep. You can call me a lousy a Dr. and a horrible person. Rehabilitate? LOL! Boy are you in La La Land.

Yelling at your wife and being short tempered is grounds for counseling. Beating a child with a stick or having it in you to knock a woman to unconsciousness is not a subject for rehabilitation.

I've spent years and years around those kind of people. They are not capable of rehabilitation. You're probably one of those PC lifers who have succumbed to media filled world of nonsense. Your argument made no sense at all.

Beat a child? Knock out an unarmed female and you say give him some happy face classes and let him be a millionaire in a few years ? I hope you don't ever sit on a jury.

I'm assuming you don't know these guys personally, right? So who's the guy who has succumbed to "media filled world of nonsense?" You're basing your opinions of people based on a couple of stories you read in the media. If you know RR and AP personally and have evidence they've beat women and children consistently for a long time, I stand corrected. AP actually seems more consistently awful to me, from what I've read. But again, I haven't done a thesis on the guy's behavioral problems...

I also don't know where you saw that I said anything about "happy face" classes. I believe Ray Rice, based on the limited evidence I have, mind you, deserves a couple of years in prison. Then when he comes back to society, he needs the happy classes to stay there. That's why we have public law enforcement and legal jurisprudence to protect us. If he has "served his time," as they say, that is society's way of saying he deserves another chance, and then if an NFL team wants to pick him up, that's their prerogative. You want to root against them and boycott them, go nuts. It's a free country. If the NFL wants to ban him, that's also their prerogative. I wouldn't support their decision to do that, but they can do what they want with their league. And I've got news for you. The NFL doesn't give two about domestic violence. It wants to make money, and if it knows people and sponsors will run away from it because it allows DV perpetrators to play, those players go bye-bye.

I've spent years and years around "those kinds of people" as well. I was an all-conference high school football, baseball, and track player who passed on scholarships to drink and play in my rock band in college. I went to a top 25 D1 football school and hung out with lots of talented athletes; some became all-pro NFL football players. I hung around the weight room with a bunch of roidheads who named their intramural football team "Team Vag (yes, as in vagina)." Some are probably still dicks. One is a great guy now.

Your understanding of rehabilitation is, honestly, limited. Rehab doesn't just mean counseling. It means hard time. This isn't me talking. It's guys like John Rawls and Robert Nozick. Guys I studied in my graduate program in public administration with a minor in criminal justice. Prison isn't just to punish. It's to rehabilitate as well. It's possible. It happens all the time. It doesn't always work. So what. I think Michael Vick has done an excellent job of reintegrating into society from what I've seen after his absolutely detestable crimes with his dogfighting operation. Some people I know think he should receive the death penalty. I really don't know the guy, but he seems to have changed. I'm glad to see that. Nothing is better to me than a comeback story. Maybe he's still a jerk. What do I know? He seems better.

No offense taken by the ad hominem knocks. Except for one. My argument made plenty of sense. If you disagree, that's fine.

[newtogolf]

It turns out that in addition to his mom, AP's H.S. football coach used a paddle on him as well.  After each strike the player would have to "thank" the coach.  While this doesn't absolve AP of anything he did to his children, I think it's fair to say that AP was likely abused as a child and has learned parenting skills from people who were child abusers.

[Golfingdad]

I differentiate what AP did from what Rice, Hardy, McDonald and Dwyer did because in the others case, they intentionally struck a women out of anger with the intent to do harm.

In AP's case I think the litmus test is, when he disciplined his children was he in control of his emotions and simply doing what he'd been taught parents do when he was a child or was he acting in a moment of anger?

It kind of sounds like you think that what AP did is more "OK" (or less "not OK" :)) if it was thought out and he was in control of his emotions than if he was just really angry?

Because I think the exact opposite.

[Abu3baid]

It kind of sounds like you think that what AP did is more "OK" (or less "not OK" :)) if it was thought out and he was in control of his emotions than if he was just really angry?

Because I think the exact opposite.

I have to agree with this.. If he was in control of his emotions and he did that kind of damage to the Kid (i.e. see previous pictures) then AP will climb my low life scum bag list rather quickly.

There is no emotionally stable individual that would injure a 4 year old that way, so my automatic assumption is that it was out of anger.

It turns out that in addition to his mom, AP's H.S. football coach used a paddle on him as well.  After each strike the player would have to "thank" the coach.  While this doesn't absolve AP of anything he did to his children, I think it's fair to say that AP was likely abused as a child and has learned parenting skills from people who were child abusers.

I differentiate what AP did from what Rice, Hardy, McDonald and Dwyer did because in the others case, they intentionally struck a women out of anger with the intent to do harm.

In AP's case I think the litmus test is, when he disciplined his children was he in control of his emotions and simply doing what he'd been taught parents do when he was a child or was he acting in a moment of anger?

Fortunately for me I don't have that sort of litmus test.. They are all scum bags to various degrees with AP topping that list because he is doing it to a 4 year old!

[newtogolf]

It kind of sounds like you think that what AP did is more "OK" (or less "not OK" :)) if it was thought out and he was in control of his emotions than if he was just really angry?

Because I think the exact opposite.

It wouldn't be the first time we are at opposite ends of an agreement, would it?

I think intent factors heavily into the discussion and determination of what the penalty should be.  AP was raised in a household and school where corporal punishment was used regularly.  If he was disciplining his children as he had been disciplined I think that has to factor into his intent to be a good parent versus doing harm to his child.

The question is did he intend to hurt his child, or act in a fit of rage versus not realizing until afterwards that his discipline method resulted in hurting the child.  I'm not saying what AP did was okay, what I'm saying is that he might need help or counseling versus jail time so he understands that corporal punishment isn't as tolerated as it once was and that given his level of physical conditioning and strength he needs to be very careful in utilizing it.

[Golfingdad]

It wouldn't be the first time we are at opposite ends of an agreement, would it?

I think intent factors heavily into the discussion and determination of what the penalty should be.  AP was raised in a household and school where corporal punishment was used regularly.  If he was disciplining his children as he had been disciplined I think that has to factor into his intent to be a good parent versus doing harm to his child.

The question is did he intend to hurt his child, or act in a fit of rage versus not realizing until afterwards that his discipline method resulted in hurting the child.  I'm not saying what AP did was okay, what I'm saying is that he might need help or counseling versus jail time so he understands that corporal punishment isn't as tolerated as it once was and that given his level of physical conditioning and strength he needs to be very careful in utilizing it.

Yeah, I don't really disagree with much of that.  Especially the last part ... but, of course, I believe that could be true for all kinds of offenses.

[iacas]

I think intent factors heavily into the discussion and determination of what the penalty should be.

I don't know. How do you accurately determine "intent?" He could just lie.

[Abu3baid]

Quote:

"… toughest of the bunch," Peterson wrote. "He got about five more pops than normal. He didn't drop one tear! So that was another indicator I'll have to try another system with him. SMH he's tough as nails …"

When he says toughest of the bunch this tells me that he takes pride in beating his kids and making them cry to break them down so that they don't ever think of flinching in front of him.. looks to me like he is a habitual child abuser if you ask me!

you can keep shaking your head, I hope it is in jail!.. If your thought process is to keep beating the kid till you break him down like a horse then I really hope they throw the book at you.. That 4 year old deserves better!  you ***** ******

Quote:

The mother replied: "Well you can't hit him til he cries! That's just mean. He's trying to be strong for you. He's afraid of you. He's 4, he's not playing mind games with you …"

Well, at least AP can't claim that no body was giving him good advice.. the mothers first mistake was having relations with this guy, but at least she knows when something is wrong, and she spoke out, even if it is only via text!

[Golfingdad]

Good stuff here: http://grantland.com/the-triangle/week-3-picks-adrian-peterson-roger-goodell/

The on topic part:

So that hurt. All of it. You know injuries happen, you reconcile them, you blame the karma gods, you blame the person who caused it (whether it’s fair or not), you bank on a quick rehab and do whatever else you need to do. But losing your signature player (and one of the league’s most entertaining players in general) because he intentionally injured his own son? How do you bounce back from that? How do you root for him again?

Important: I don’t believe Peterson should lose his football career. Eventually, the man will publicly exhibit the proper level of contrition (we’re not even close yet) and turn this situation into a positive (pretty easily, he could become one of our most visible advocates against child abuse, as soon as he successfully deals with whatever baggage he’s carrying). And there’s clearly a cultural component to what happened here, as Charles Barkley clumsily tried to argue on CBS last Sunday.

At the same time, I am raising two kids — my daughter (9) and my son (6) — both of whom were 4 once. If you haven’t raised a child yet, please understand the following things:

1. Kids can be annoying as hell.

2. Kids can be frustrating as hell.

3. Little boys are dumber than little girls.

4. Four-year-old boys might be lovable as hell, but they’re also operating within the perfect storm of “Why did you do that?,” “What are you thinking?,” and “You can never do that again!!!!!” Four-year-old boys will absolutely try to jump down a flight of stairs, dive into the shallow end of the pool, punch you in the balls, inadvertently run across the street when you’re not looking … they are just complete dumb-asses at all times. I have multiple friends who had or have little boys; all of them, at some point, said to themselves, “Wait, is there something wrong with my son?” And I was right there with them.

Sometimes, you have to discipline them so they know right from wrong — mainly so they don’t hurt themselves or someone else, because, again, little boys are lovable dumb-asses. And that’s something every parent handles differently. You can yell, you can scream, you can take away their favorite toy/show/activity, you can even play the spanking card (some do, some don’t). You do whatever it takes to get from Point A to Point B. Within reason.

But HURTING your own kid?

Or leaving still-bleeding-after-six-hours welts all over the lower half of his body?

I mean …

When you’re a parent, you constantly identify with other parents in every situation. You recognize the same defeated looks, you recognize the same look of panic when a parent can’t control a kid in public, you recognize the same look of utter horror on an airplane when a shrieking kid is gaining steam and there are still three hours to go. And on the flip side, when some parental experience is spiraling out of control, you might see a veteran parent glancing your way with one of those “Hang in there, it gets better” looks. There are dozens and dozens of ways you bond with other parents, day in and day out, and that’s just how it goes. It’s almost like an unspoken language that you can’t speak in unless you’ve been there.

For me, the problem with what Peterson did, and everything it represents, is that I fundamentally can’t understand why someone would injure their own kid. My children have injured themselves unintentionally a handful of times. When your child is in pain, it’s just about the craziest experience you will ever have as a human being. It’s like your head comes off your body. When my son was 2, my daughter accidentally slammed a shower door on his index finger and nearly chopped it off. That thing was dangling. And if you’ve ever heard your own child scream in pain and terror, you never forget the sound. You just don’t.

We threw some clothes on him — blood dripping everywhere — and he was crying so hard that his eyes were practically rolling back in his head. If that wasn’t bad enough, my daughter was sobbing and blaming herself for what happened. And everyone was covered in blood. We packed into the car and pulled off a 15-minute drive in about eight minutes. I was weaving between lanes and passing people on the wrong side of the road like a NASCAR driver. It was insane. I wanted to make sure he didn’t lose his finger, but also the crying was just about the worst noise I had ever heard. Four years later, I can still hear it.

And yeah, we saved the finger, and there’s barely even a scar because little kids have healing powers that transcend just about anything. Adrian Peterson’s kid probably won’t have scars, either. That Peterson can live with himself for causing that sound, with no apparent remorse, disturbs the shit out of me. I can’t look at him the same way.

But that’s just me. So we remain in that excruciating vortex where sports (the escape from real life) intersects with real life — yet again — and we’re just sitting here looking at each other and waiting for the perfect answer, which is never coming. Eventually, someone will convince Peterson that he needs therapy, and that he needs to become an advocate against child abuse. Peterson will follow that person’s instructions for one of two reasons: He wants to save his football career or he understands that he failed as a parent and a human being (and needs to fix it going forward). One or both of those reasons will be genuine. Let’s hope for both.

(In other words, to be continued.)

[Slice of Life]

One question for you guys...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2014/09/19/hope-solo-and-the-domestic-violence-case-no-one-is-talking-about/?tid=trending_strip_1

Where's the outrage? Where's the media and sponsor pressure?

Nike drops AP and sponsors her...double standard much?

[Abu3baid]

One question for you guys...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2014/09/19/hope-solo-and-the-domestic-violence-case-no-one-is-talking-about/?tid=trending_strip_1

Where's the outrage? Where's the media and sponsor pressure?

Nike drops AP and sponsors her...double standard much?

Well, a few things come to mind.

1.  She's a woman.. so the thought of a woman and domestic violence is really considered a complete outlier.. the association is always with men and domestic abuse

2.  This is womens soccer, and you are not going to get the same kind of media attention, nor the sponsorship attention you would say like the NFL

3.  Don't think for a second that Nike cares about "Domestic Abuse" - They care about $$$$ and so does the NFL!!

[Slice of Life]

Well, a few things come to mind.

1.  She's a woman.. so the thought of a woman and domestic violence is really considered a complete outlier.. the association is always with men and domestic abuse

2.  This is womens soccer, and you are not going to get the same kind of media attention, nor the sponsorship attention you would say like the NFL

3.  Don't think for a second that Nike cares about "Domestic Abuse" - They care about $$$$ and so does the NFL!!

None of those are relevant. Not saying you're wrong...

[MS256]

One question for you guys...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2014/09/19/hope-solo-and-the-domestic-violence-case-no-one-is-talking-about/?tid=trending_strip_1

Where's the outrage? Where's the media and sponsor pressure?

Nike drops AP and sponsors her...double standard much?

Short answer: Yes there's a double standard.

Debatable is how much of a double standard there should be if any.

Right or wrong the perception is that since men are bigger and stronger (especially athletes) they are more dangerous when they are out of control and hit people. Men hitting weaker people is perceived as a bigger problem than women doing the same thing.

BTW. One thing that does get lost in all of this is that the percentage of domestic violence charges against NFL players is at a lower percentage than the public at large.

[newtogolf]

Double standards exist everywhere, it's just part of the new age thought process.  Hope Solo beating up on her half sister and 17 year old nephew is not big news.  If the 17 year old nephew beat the crap out of Hope Solo that would be news.

What people don't realize is the double standards take away from the significance of the cause.  Domestic violence shouldn't be tolerated regardless of what sex of the abuser and the victim are.

[newtogolf]

Short answer: Yes there's a double standard.

Debatable is how much of a double standard there should be if any.

Right or wrong the perception is that since men are bigger and stronger (especially athletes) they are more dangerous when they are out of control and hit people. Men hitting weaker people is perceived as a bigger problem than women doing the same thing.

BTW. One thing that does get lost in all of this is that the percentage of domestic violence charges against NFL players is at a lower percentage than the public at large.

I can think of a lot of guys I'd rather get hit by than Ronda Rousey.  With women's MMA getting more and more popular maybe that perception will change one day.  Anyone can be abusive and anyone can be a victim, but most don't seem to understand that.   Will be interesting to see how the first major celebrity same sex domestic violence case gets handled, Hope Solo doesn't really count as either.

Criminal incidents overall are lower in the NFL than the public but the media doesn't care about us average Joe's.

[Golfingdad]

One question for you guys...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2014/09/19/hope-solo-and-the-domestic-violence-case-no-one-is-talking-about/?tid=trending_strip_1

Where's the outrage? Where's the media and sponsor pressure?

Nike drops AP and sponsors her...double standard much?

Absolutely absurd (and frankly, insulting) comparison.

Ray Rice sucker punched a woman half (maybe more like 1/3???) his size and knocked her out cold.

Adrian Peterson bruised and bloodied a 4 year old boy, somebody who's probably on the order of 1/8 his size and strength.

Hope Solo got in a fight with her sister and her sisters 17 year old son.  It is a pretty damn safe bet that those three are all considerably closer in size and strength than the perpetrators and victims in the other cases.  Additionally, it's only in the "domestic violence" arena because they're related.  The headline might as well read "Hope Solo gets in fight with woman and woman's grown son."

One of these doesn't belong with the others.  If you cannot tell which then I can't help you.

Also, @Abu3baid is correct ... the other reason why nobody talks about it is because she doesn't play in the NFL or NBA.

[Slice of Life]

Absolutely absurd (and frankly, insulting) comparison.

Ray Rice sucker punched a woman half (maybe more like 1/3???) his size and knocked her out cold.

Adrian Peterson bruised and bloodied a 4 year old boy, somebody who's probably on the order of 1/8 his size and strength.

Hope Solo got in a fight with her sister and her sisters 17 year old son.  It is a pretty damn safe bet that those three are all considerably closer in size and strength than the perpetrators and victims in the other cases.  Additionally, it's only in the "domestic violence" arena because they're related.  The headline might as well read "Hope Solo gets in fight with woman and woman's grown son."

One of these doesn't belong with the others.  If you cannot tell which then I can't help you.

Also, @Abu3baid is correct ... the other reason why nobody talks about it is because she doesn't play in the NFL or NBA.

Sorry, I tend to disagree. The rage/anger aspect and crime is exactly the same. Why should she be punished less by her work because she's weaker than Ray Rice? I guarantee you that Hope Solo, a professional athlete who lives in the gym, is at least twice as strong as her sister.

I'd say it's absurd (and frankly, insulting) to imply that women shouldn't be held as responsible for their actions as men just because they aren't as strong.

Sorry, if there's gonna be "equality", it has to be everywhere. Can't pick and choose where you want to be equal and where you want special treatment.

"Solo reportedly followed him and the two got into an argument that allegedly escalated as Solo "charged" at him and took a swing at him. They then tussled on the ground and she "repeatedly punched him in the face and tackled him," reports say. The nephew grabbed her by the hair and held her to the ground until she appeared to calm down, at which point she reportedly grabbed his hair and pulled him back down, punching him some more, according to the incident report.

Solo's half-sister arrived and tried to break up the fight, but Solo reportedly turned her aggression to her and punched her in the face "several times."

The nephew got a wooden broom that he "broke over (Solo's) head," but Solo reportedly did not relent, so he pointed a BB gun at her.

Solo eventually stopped and her half-sister ultimately pushed her out the door, but she re-entered through an unlocked sliding door and, after some argument, assaulted her sister some more, the affidavit says."

Right...just some poor small misunderstood woman...difference here is that she kept coming.

[Slice of Life]

Just for a reference, Hope Solo is almost identical to me in size. If I beat her up, would it not be a big deal because we were closer to the same size. weight, and strength?

No.

Just like if Hope Solo's husband was 5'6", 140 lbs and she punched him, it wouldn't be a big deal.

It's strictly a big deal because one's a man, and one's a woman. Don't pretend like it has to do with size. If Ray Rice's wife was a pro female bodybuilder the situation would be no different.