Mickelson vs Watson: Was Phil Right to Be Critical of Watson at the Press Conference?

[phan52]

Plus, the PGA and European Tour LOVE the Ryder Cup. They're not going to let go of it lightly. They make a lot of money from it.

Sure, the European Tour loves it. They own it on their end and they benefit greatly from it, particularly financially. The PGA Tour, on the other hand, is at the mercy of the PGA of America and their pathetic process in selecting the Captains and the teams. The Tour made the mistake of letting the Ryder Cup go decades ago when they broke with the PGA, but now they need to step up and take over the process.

I understand that the Ryder Cup is a cash cow for the PGA of America and it can and should remain as such. But who is Ted Bishop and what does he know about the PGA Tour and the players? I'm not a big Tim Finchem fan but he would be a better steward of the process than Ted Bishop will ever be. He knows the players (AND the potential Captains) and is more in tune with what they want.

[iacas]

Sure, the European Tour loves it. They own it on their end and they benefit greatly from it, particularly financially. The PGA Tour, on the other hand, is at the mercy of the PGA of America and their pathetic process in selecting the Captains and the teams.

The PGA Tour is not "at their mercy." They have no claim in the Ryder Cup.

The Tour made the mistake of letting the Ryder Cup go decades ago when they broke with the PGA, but now they need to step up and take over the process.

That ain't gonna happen, unless the PGA Tour wants to BUY it or RENT it from the PGA. They can't just "take over." No way, no how. Heck, the PGA Tour still licenses its own name from the PGA. They're not 100% split.

[BanditGrip]

I'm kind of torn on this. I can see valid arguments on both sides...

[phan52]

Originally Posted by phan52

The Tour made the mistake of letting the Ryder Cup go decades ago when they broke with the PGA, but now they need to step up and take over the process.

Originally Posted by iacas

That ain't gonna happen, unless the PGA Tour wants to BUY it or RENT it from the PGA. They can't just "take over." No way, no how. Heck, the PGA Tour still licenses its own name from the PGA. They're not 100% split.

Read what I said. I did not say they should take over the Ryder Cup, I said they should take over the process. The PGA of America owns it fair and square but the Tour can take over the decision making process easily by holding back the Tour players. What has been going on reflects very poorly on the Tour players. And yes, they are the ones doing the losing but I am sure that the current situation does not sit well with them and is considered a factor. I don't think the PGA of America would fare well without the Tour players. That is quite a hammer.

[iacas]

Read what I said. I did not say they should take over the Ryder Cup, I said they should take over the process.

I did read. I simply live in the real world and realize the PGA Tour isn't going to "take over the process." It's not theirs. The PGA Tour has the Presidents Cup.

What has been going on reflects very poorly on the Tour players. And yes, they are the ones doing the losing but I am sure that the current situation does not sit well with them and is considered a factor. I don't think the PGA of America would fare well without the Tour players. That is quite a hammer.

I don't think the players are going to abstain from playing. Good luck getting them to wield that hammer.

They're going to change up the process. They'll get at least 12-20 years out of that before this even becomes a faint possibility, IMO.

[nick1998bunker]

I'm not gonna read every single post so excuse me if this has been brought up a lot, but what exactly is this process they are talking about. I know from playing team golf that it's almost solely on how well the players are playing.

[iacas]

I'm not gonna read every single post so excuse me if this has been brought up a lot, but what exactly is this process they are talking about. I know from playing team golf that it's almost solely on how well the players are playing.

You should have read more posts.

There's more to it than just "how well the players are playing," particularly when the captain PICKS (some of) the players and PAIRS the players and PLAYS (or sits) the players.

[turtleback]

You should have read more posts.

There's more to it than just "how well the players are playing," particularly when the captain PICKS (some of) the players and PAIRS the players and PLAYS (or sits) the players.

And makes them wear silly clothing.

[iacas]

And makes them wear silly clothing.

Indeed.

[cubdog]

Was anyone else surprised that Azinger is not part of the new Task Force? I'll be interested to hear his comments on Morning Drive tomorrow.

cubdog

[Shorty]

Was anyone else surprised that Azinger is not part of the new Task Force? I'll be interested to hear his comments on Morning Drive tomorrow.

cubdog

Azinger would be insane to be part of it.

He would understandably want to keep his record intact.

[newtogolf]

Azinger would be insane to be part of it.

He would understandably want to keep his record intact.

I can see your point, but if he really believed in the potential of the pod approach I think he'd take the risk.

[FarawayFairways]

I don't think he does believe in it to the extent that people are associating him with it. Indeed, it's been noticeable that whereas so many others have looked to single solutions, Zinger has been talking about a multi causal picture, and much longer remedial temporal horizons.

I'd say he's been talking down the significance of a pod system more than anyone.

In  any event, it's not exactly unknown in sport, and I think he knows he hasn't discovered the secret alchemy. I can certainly think of examples where pods have been used and failed before. In the longer term it tends to promote devisive cliques, but Ryder Cup is a short term temporary team so perhaps it's more suited here than it would be in other teams.

Come to think about it, isn't Zinger on record somewhere as saying it isn't about pod systems, and that this isn't the solution. Anyone who thinks it is, and that the American malaise can be put right with a single intervention is likely to be disappointed, and I think PA knows that. It could also be of course that he's trying to manage expectations and lower the bar

My own suspicion is that Paul Azinger doesn't want to be be part of a committee that could easily degenerate into a talking shop. My read on his interventions so far is that he wants a large chunk of autonomy in the decision making process and would rather work on a report with recommendations to his brief

I think it mildly amusing at one level when Mickelson was asked at Gleneagles what needed doing. I'm sure part of the answer he gave (the part that isn't reported now) was something to the effect of "I don't know, I've lost 8 matches, don't ask me, I'm the last person to .... etc"

[FarawayFairways]

Here's the full transcript

http://www.asaptext.com/pga/media/rydercup_2014/transcripts/american_team_2014_09_28_19_03.pdf

[natureboy]

I don't think he does believe in it to the extent that people are associating him with it. Indeed, it's been noticeable that whereas so many others have looked to single solutions, Zinger has been talking about a multi causal picture, and much longer remedial temporal horizons.

I'd say he's been talking down the significance of a pod system more than anyone.

In  any event, it's not exactly unknown in sport, and I think he knows he hasn't discovered the secret alchemy. I can certainly think of examples where pods have been used and failed before. In the longer term it tends to promote devisive cliques, but Ryder Cup is a short term temporary team so perhaps it's more suited here than it would be in other teams.

Come to think about it, isn't Zinger on record somewhere as saying it isn't about pod systems, and that this isn't the solution. Anyone who thinks it is, and that the American malaise can be put right with a single intervention is likely to be disappointed, and I think PA knows that. It could also be of course that he's trying to manage expectations and lower the bar

My own suspicion is that Paul Azinger doesn't want to be be part of a committee that could easily degenerate into a talking shop. My read on his interventions so far is that he wants a large chunk of autonomy in the decision making process and would rather work on a report with recommendations to his brief

I think it mildly amusing at one level when Mickelson was asked at Gleneagles what needed doing. I'm sure part of the answer he gave (the part that isn't reported now) was something to the effect of "I don't know, I've lost 8 matches, don't ask me, I'm the last person to .... etc"

Actually it was more like, " Oh no!! I've been on 8 losing teams! ." Given what we've heard about some of the behind the scenes brow-beating, I've wondered about the deep sarcasm I heard in his tone when he made this statement.

I now wonder if some of his attempts at early input were discounted because he hasn't delivered a 'champion's share' of wins that U.S. legends of the past did (against generally weaker opposing teams) and perhaps 'expect' of current 'soft' top U.S. players?

[Dash Riprock]

Phil behaved terribly, no excuse whatsoever IMHO..needs to publicly apologise to Tom and  all the youngsters. I think if he does that soon even at this late date, he can still salvage what is left of his reputation

[guitarman621]

I voted no because the last time I checked golf is a gentlemans game & that was quite rude for Mickelson to say it. I think Watson did the best he could. Our players just didn't get the job done. It is easy to sit here & be backseat captains after the fact. Tom Watson has meant a lot for the game of golf & he doesn't deserve to be critized because our players got their asses handed to them again.I lost a lot of the respect I had for Phil after I heard his comments. Still love him as a player & a person, but he was out of line with his behavior. Lets just regroup & send our hottest players at the time the next time the Ryder Cup comes around. There definitely were a couple guys that were left at home that could have helped us out I think. Like Billy Horshel for example.

[HankL]

Perhaps people forget when and how Watson went off on Gary Player about Player being a cheat......was that OK for Tom back then.  I don't care if it is Sports or Politics or what have you.  You are responsible for your won conduct and don't throw the first punch if you don't expect one coming right back on you.  Certainly the bottom line is that the guys did not perform well.  If you ever played golf, you know you just don't say I am going to be good today and wha-la you are.....It is not that easy and I would suggest that the Saturday night meeting set the tone for Sunday.  No one wins but a real man will stand up to TW b.s. and that is what Phil did....where was the rest of the team?