Familiarity with the course and scores

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9wood

Of course being familiar with a course which you regularly play is naturally going to give you better scores. I know quite a few people that play only one golf course simply because they have a paid membership and don't play on any unfamiliar courses. Then these golfers tell you about how well they scored and about how their handicaps are getting lower. It makes me wonder how much their handicap and scores would go up if they were to go play on unfamiliar courses once in a while. Maybe my own scores aren't as low as I would like. But then again I don't have a membership to any one golf course and I end up playing at five or six different courses. Every now and then I will even go play a round at some course I have never been to before. I don't like getting into the one golf course rut, and I do like new challenges.

Any thoughts?

I may be an odd ball here.  I play 95% of the time at my home course and by all accounts including mine, the course rating is underrated by 2+ strokes.   My 16 - 18 HI went up to 20 soon after joining the club.   Once in a while, I play other courses and I fare well (they often end up in top 10 of my 20 HI scores in the system).

Out of curiosity, how well do you play at Coyote Creek?

That's pretty much the only course I know reasonably well up in your area. . .

[Golfingdad]

I'll go out on a limb here and say that I think familiarity matters very LITTLE in most cases.  It will certainly hurt you the FIRST time you play some courses, especially those with visual tricks worked into the design, or blind shots as well.  But after a course is played once or twice, especially as Matt mentioned above if you know Aimpoint, I don't think it matters anymore at all.

How the course suits your game is what matters.  I can play my home course 1000 times a year and unless I can straighten out my driver and start hitting all of the fairways instead of losing one or two balls OB, then I'm not ever going to play as good there as I do at another local course I enjoy that is long, and therefore has a higher rating, but has few trees, managable rough, and holes bordering other holes.  I score considerably better there, on average, than anywhere else I play, and that would stay true no matter how many times I play my home course, and how few times I play that course.

[Lihu]

I'll go out on a limb here and say that I think familiarity matters very LITTLE in most cases.  It will certainly hurt you the FIRST time you play some courses, especially those with visual tricks worked into the design, or blind shots as well.  But after a course is played once or twice, especially as Matt mentioned above if you know Aimpoint, I don't think it matters anymore at all.

How the course suits your game is what matters.  I can play my home course 1000 times a year and unless I can straighten out my driver and start hitting all of the fairways instead of losing one or two balls OB, then I'm not ever going to play as good there as I do at another local course I enjoy that is long, and therefore has a higher rating, but has few trees, managable rough, and holes bordering other holes.  I score considerably better there, on average, than anywhere else I play, and that would stay true no matter how many times I play my home course, and how few times I play that course.

Agreed, most cases. I tend to agree with this assessment even at my current level of play, but it makes a huge difference for high teen to 36 HC golfers. Also, how the course suits your game depends upon if you have a game. Remember that not everyone has consistent enough ball striking to call what they have a "game".

[rkim291968]

I'll go out on a limb here and say that I think familiarity matters very LITTLE in most cases.  It will certainly hurt you the FIRST time you play some courses, especially those with visual tricks worked into the design, or blind shots as well.  But after a course is played once or twice, especially as Matt mentioned above if you know Aimpoint, I don't think it matters anymore at all.

How the course suits your game is what matters.  I can play my home course 1000 times a year and unless I can straighten out my driver and start hitting all of the fairways instead of losing one or two balls OB, then I'm not ever going to play as good there as I do at another local course I enjoy that is long, and therefore has a higher rating, but has few trees, managable rough, and holes bordering other holes.  I score considerably better there, on average, than anywhere else I play, and that would stay true no matter how many times I play my home course, and how few times I play that course.

Can't agree with you on that.   After a few rounds, yeah, you get used to it quickly but still going to play worse than the course you played 1000 times.   It takes more than a few rounds to develop an optimal strategy for the course, understand green contours & subtleties, etc..   BTW Aimpoint does not help you with distance control which I think is more difficult to adjust on a new course.

Out of curiosity, how well do you play at Coyote Creek?

That's pretty much the only course I know reasonably well up in your area. . .

I never played there before.

[Golfingdad]

Can't agree with you on that.

Figured as much (not about you, about everybody) which is why I volunteered that I was out on a limb. ;)

After a few rounds, yeah, you get used to it quickly but still going to play worse than the course you played 1000 times. It takes more than a few rounds to develop an optimal strategy for the course, understand green contours & subtleties, etc..

Sure, some course might take more than a few rounds to figure out a perfect strategy but most of the time, one or two is going to be enough.

BTW Aimpoint does not help you with distance control which I think is more difficult to adjust on a new course.

Actually that's incorrect.  It absolutely helps with distance control.

---

An interesting stat here would be to find out how many people out there had legit handicaps from playing a variety of courses, then joined a specific club and started playing all of their rounds in one place and subsequently saw a marked decrease in their handicaps over that same time period.  I suspect it would be a fairly small percentage, and even those that did go down could possibly be attributed to other factors like the course did suit their game, or they started taking lessons from the club pro, or they simply just played MORE and that alone made them improve.

[rkim291968]

Originally Posted by rkim291968

After a few rounds, yeah, you get used to it quickly but still going to play worse than the course you played 1000 times. It takes more than a few rounds to develop an optimal strategy for the course, understand green contours & subtleties, etc..

Sure, some course might take more than a few rounds to figure out a perfect strategy but most of the time, one or two is going to be enough.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkim291968

BTW Aimpoint does not help you with distance control which I think is more difficult to adjust on a new course.

Actually that's incorrect.  It absolutely helps with distance control.

An interesting stat here would be to find out how many people out there had legit handicaps from playing a variety of courses, then joined a specific club and started playing all of their rounds in one place and subsequently saw a marked decrease in their handicaps over that same time period.  I suspect it would be a fairly small percentage, and even those that did go down could possibly be attributed to other factors like the course did suit their game, or they started taking lessons from the club pro, or they simply just played MORE and that alone made them improve.

We may not be too far on this if we take into consideration that for easy courses, heck, I think most will do ok after the 1st round.  Harder the course ... the longer it'd take to get used to.

If Aimpoint helped me with distance control, it was shadowed by my fitted Edel putter.   But YMMV.

My experience:

1st & 2nd home course - my HI improved.

3rd (current) home course - my HI went south and almost all other members report(ed) the same.

[Golfingdad]

We may not be too far on this if we take into consideration that for easy courses, heck, I think most will do ok after the 1st round.  Harder the course ... the longer it'd take to get used to.

Agreed, but does everybody consider the same courses hard and the same courses easy?  Just considering the two courses I'm talking about, if you are a straight hitter who struggles with rough, bunkers and short game then you would likely consider my home course the easier of the two.  But if you're like me, then the long course with room on many holes to miss wildly and still score well is much easier.  One is suited to one guy and the other is suited to the other guy, and until they each address their swing/game issues, that isn't going to change no matter how many times each course is played by each guy.

If Aimpoint helped me with distance control, it was shadowed by my fitted Edel putter.   But YMMV.

Oh crap, you have an Edel and use Aimpoint - this is much easier to explain then. ;)  I have the same experience but there is a distinction:

Like you, my Edel putter is most definitely the main reason WHY I've improved at distance control in putting.  However, the knowledge as to HOW to go about making adjustments, round by round, is something I learned in Aimpoint.  This would even work better, I think, for somebody who does normally play the same course all of the time.  You know your courses stimp and you know what length stroke it takes to hit a 15' putt up and down various slopes on those greens.  So after you've figured the stimp of the strange course, a few minutes of 15' putts up and down similar sloped hills will allow you to calibrate your stroke to their 15' putt speeds.  You can extrapolate everything from there.

1st & 2nd home course - my HI improved.

3rd (current) home course - my HI went south and almost all other members report(ed) the same.

Interesting.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkim291968

If Aimpoint helped me with distance control, it was shadowed by my fitted Edel putter.   But YMMV.

Oh crap, you have an Edel and use Aimpoint - this is much easier to explain then. ;)  I have the same experience but there is a distinction:

Like you, my Edel putter is most definitely the main reason WHY I've improved at distance control in putting.  However, the knowledge as to HOW to go about making adjustments, round by round, is something I learned in Aimpoint.  This would even work better, I think, for somebody who does normally play the same course all of the time.  You know your courses stimp and you know what length stroke it takes to hit a 15' putt up and down various slopes on those greens.  So after you've figured the stimp of the strange course, a few minutes of 15' putts up and down similar sloped hills will allow you to calibrate your stroke to their 15' putt speeds.  You can extrapolate everything from there.

Are you two trying to sell everyone on EDEL and Aimpoint?

You two should post a video together starring the two products for convincing more of us to spend $700 on a complete putting solution.

[rkim291968]

Are you two trying to sell everyone on EDEL and Aimpoint?

You two should post a video together starring the two products for convincing more of us to spend $700 on a complete putting solution.

... and you get more.  If you respond within 20 minutes, we will throw in an Edel sandwedge for added cost of shipping and handling.   So, call now!

Almost everyone who plays my home course for the 1st time bombs.   A few who did well were near scratch golfers who were very accurate.   Even they had issues figuring out the greens (a few has optical illusions where you putt one way and the ball goes the opposite way).   I must say, that pushed me to take an Aimpoint lesson.    BTW, $600 (not $700, I didn't personalize my putter) came out of my son's inheritance money.   You can do the same .

[Golfingdad]

...  came out of my son's inheritance money.

When it comes down to it, doesn't everything?

[mvmac]

Are you two trying to sell everyone on EDEL and Aimpoint?

You two should post a video together starring the two products for convincing more of us to spend $700 on a complete putting solution.

I think that's a bit unfair, they're just answering questions about making an unfamiliar course easier to navigate. @rkim291968 said there are optical illusions on greens, AimPoint helps simplify and speed up the whole green reading process. I'm a fan because it's legit.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

Are you two trying to sell everyone on EDEL and Aimpoint?

You two should post a video together starring the two products for convincing more of us to spend $700 on a complete putting solution.

I think that's a bit unfair, they're just answering questions about making an unfamiliar course easier to navigate. @rkim291968 said there are optical illusions on greens, AimPoint helps simplify and speed up the whole green reading process. I'm a fan because it's legit.

Don't get me wrong, I hear they are both great. I was just joking with them. . .

[RFKFREAK]

Don't get me wrong, I hear they are both great. I was just joking with them. . .

That's how I took it, especially with the smiley face.

And, I agree with @Golfingdad that it somewhat depends on the type of course.  A wide open, long course suits me way better than a tighter shorter course because I'm just not an accurate ball striker.

[No Mulligans]

That's how I took it, especially with the smiley face.

And, I agree with @Golfingdad that it somewhat depends on the type of course.  A wide open, long course suits me way better than a tighter shorter course because I'm just not an accurate ball striker.

Yep, me too.

The two muni's in San Diego... Torrey Pines (I only play the North course) and Balboa Park.  I find Balboa harder even though it's shorter, it's narrow and if you miss the fairway by a little bit you're going to really be penalized.  If I want my HI to go up all I have to do is play a bunch of rounds at Balboa 18.  The course ratings/slope for these two courses don't seem to adjust properly for the relative difficulty of these two courses; at least not for me.  I'm guessing the rating/slope process is weighted too heavily on overall distance for Balboa 18.

[rkim291968]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RFKFREAK

That's how I took it, especially with the smiley face.

And, I agree with @Golfingdad that it somewhat depends on the type of course.  A wide open, long course suits me way better than a tighter shorter course because I'm just not an accurate ball striker.

Yep, me too.

The two muni's in San Diego... Torrey Pines (I only play the North course) and Balboa Park.  I find Balboa harder even though it's shorter, it's narrow and if you miss the fairway by a little bit you're going to really be penalized.  If I want my HI to go up all I have to do is play a bunch of rounds at Balboa 18.  The course ratings/slope for these two courses don't seem to adjust properly for the relative difficulty of these two courses; at least not for me.  I'm guessing the rating/slope process is weighted too heavily on overall distance for Balboa 18.

This got me thinking.  There are courses with reasonable rating but weather makes it tough (enough for golfers to lose 3 - 6 strokes per round)  to score.  Number of my course's holes are on top/near the hill where wind sometimes makes it impossible to play.  And the wind direction changes by seconds.  This is the reason I have been focusing on mastering knockdown shots.  Perhaps, that's the reason why people lose 2 handicap points when they join.   Ok, I will stop here.  If I say more about it, it's gonna sound like whining.

[grayhen714]

I usually score better at courses near my home

[RickK]

When I only played one course all the time, my handicap did not travel well.  I started playing in a tournament league where we play 20+ different courses each year.  While my handicap did not change much by doing this, I found that I played better to the handicap away from my home course.  Familiarity of ones home course leads to over time not having to think much about where to hit the ball, distances to hazards, etc.  You hit it here, you automatically know you can hit 7 iron to clear the hazard and be on the green, 6 if the pin is back.  You know that on some holes you do not want to be short on the green if the pin is back right or whatever.  You don't have to give it much thought.  Then you play elsewhere and you are not automatically familiar with all the nuances of the course.  You have to think more which I believe leads to you becoming a better player.

[BuckeyeNut]

Playing a new unfamiliar course is a challenge for obvious reasons, but it only takes a few rounds to get into a comfort zone.  Most golfers that "Play Around" play a core of less than 10-15 courses regularly. After a few rounds at each course, all the courses in the normal rotation become like a home course.   As opposed to playing a course for only the 2nd time in 15 years.............

I still get back to Ohio every once in awhile to visit the old haunts. Even after 15 years+, these courses are still like home courses to me providing I had the opportunity to get familiar with them back in the day.........providing they weren't totally bulldozed/reshaped and redesigned between then and now...LOL

If you play any course 4-5 times a year....it should play like a home course pretty quick!