Choking Down on the Driver

[Joe Mama]

A number of posters in other forums have claimed that they hit straighter and often farther when they choke down about 1.5 inches on the driver. For a total distance amounting to about 75 inches from shoulder to club face, it's hard to see why a two percent shortening of effective swing radius could make a significant difference in performance. The minuscule change in rotational (moment of) inertia couldn't account for the alleged better control, and any lie angle differences would only apply to irons. So, why does choking work (if it works)? My guess is that instead of having perhaps only 0.5 inch of the handle sticking outside the base of the left hand, there are now perhaps two inches of shaft that extend beyond the palm. The shaft is now much more easily able to nestle into the left palm's lifeline, thereby allowing the shaft to become more of an extension of the left arm. Does this seem reasonable?

[iacas]

A number of posters in other forums have claimed that they hit straighter and often farther when they choke down about 1.5 inches on the driver. For a total distance amounting to about 75 inches from shoulder to club face, it's hard to see why a two percent shortening of effective swing radius could make a significant difference in performance. The minuscule change in rotational (moment of) inertia couldn't account for the alleged better control, and any lie angle differences would only apply to irons. So, why does choking work (if it works)?

My guess is that instead of having perhaps only 0.5 inch of the handle sticking outside the base of the left hand, there are now perhaps two inches of shaft that extend beyond the palm. The shaft is now much more easily able to nestle into the left palm's lifeline, thereby allowing the shaft to become more of an extension of the left arm.

Does this seem reasonable?

Gripping the club up the lifeline of the lead hand would be a pretty lousy way to swing a golf club for most people.

So no, that does not strike me as reasonable.

[mvmac]

Gripping the club up the lifeline of the lead hand would be a pretty lousy way to swing a golf club for most people.

Right, that's a commonality of a lot of bad grips.

[Joe Mama]

It will make the shaft more of an extension of the left lower arm, which, no other things considered, should be a good thing, but I agree that it is an awkward way to grip the handle. It's not a reasonable explanation of why choking down works, for some. So, the question is: What reason can one offer to explain how choking down helps? It is not enough to simply say, It works for some golfers. I would like to know exactly WHY it works. Here's Anthony Kim: Does it work because the choked club feels lighter at the top because the center of mass is closer to the hinge axis at the wrists? Does it work because the rotational inertia of the choked club is less by an amount that actually does make a difference? Does anyone know?

[Patch]

Choking down makes the club shorter. Shorter might mean more control. I always thought that is why a lot of golfers can hit their 3-5 woods more accurately than their driver because they are shorter clubs. Also  (I think) I read somewhere it changes the swing weight/ and/or balance of the club a little. I can't verify that, so take it with a grain of salt I suppose.

The club grip in the life line is getting pretty close to the Natural (Moe Norman) Golf Swing grip. With the right lie adjustment, that grip can give some golfers more control, and has a lot to do with keeping the club on plane. Now I don't use the palm grip myself, but I have messed around with it with my irons because  they have the correct lie angle that can be used with that grip. I came away with the thought that this could work, if not for the uncomfortable "new" feeling it presented.

[saevel25]

Choking down makes the club shorter. Shorter might mean more control. I always thought that is why a lot of golfers can hit their 3-5 woods more accurately than their driver because they are shorter clubs.

Not necessarily true.

Drivers are actually more accurate because of they are designed. Also some people hit their driver more accurately when it's longer. Rory has stated he prefer's a 45" shaft because he grew up in the era when those drivers were made that way.

An article took 6 holes from which a good percentage of players hit fairway woods as well as driver. They showed that the driver found the fairway an average of nearly 15% more of the time.

Though they might be shorter clubs, the design of the 3-wood makes them nearly as accurate as a driver. You are hitting a 3-wood with the same accuracy as a driver, but 15-20 yards shorter.

The only time I hit 3-wood is if my driver will reach a hazard or if the hole tightens considerably where my driver would land.

[DrvFrShow]

I think it also depends upon the era in which a person played most of their golf. My neighbor is about a 5 HC. He's played for 40 years. He can't hit these new drivers worth a damn. He's tried the mini-drivers, and finally took his Titleist D910 and put a 43.75" lightweight steel shaft in it and rebalanced the club and is now able to hit draws and fades as he wants once again with no loss of distance.

I cut my Big Bertha down 1" to 44.5" and can control it better - it feels a bit lighter on the SW and I can get about 3-4 mph extra for more distance, and I'm not having as much difficulty getting the club head square.

My "3W" is really a 2W and is only 3/4" shorter than my driver now. It's more accurate than my driver, but I lose about 15 yds. This can mean the difference of hitting an 9 iron or a hard 8 iron into a green.

The driver is a club that can come and go. When it's on, it's on. When it goes off, it can go off, and usually the 3 wood won't make much of a difference then. It's something going kaflooey with the swing. Best to go with something you can control at that point. That's when I start hitting 4 or 5 irons off the tee - it's damage control at that point -  they go straight and stay out of the woods.

[dsc123]

I did this for a while and it seemed to help.  I think it helped me keep the club face more square at impact.

[Joe Mama]

Choking down makes the club shorter...... I read somewhere it changes the swing weight/ and/or balance of the club a little. I can't verify that, so take it with a grain of salt I suppose.

There is no doubt that choking down changes the "swing weight" of a club. Swing weight is basically the torque applied to the club by Earth's pull (I.e., the club's weight) relative to, say, the butt end of the shaft, when the shaft is horizontal near the top of the backswing. This torque is calculated by multiplying the club's weight by the distance between the butt end of the shaft to the "balance point" (the center of gravity, or center of mass). The balance point may easily be determined experimentally by finding the point at which the club may be balanced atop your outstretched index finger. The balance point of a typical driver is approximately 30 inches from the butt end. The "fulcrum," about about which the club will rotate, is close to the end of the shaft, so the swing weight (in relative units) is about 30W, where W is the weight of the club. If the hands are moved two inches closer to the balance point, the new swing weight would be 28W, which amounts to a percentage decrease of about 6.7%. With a smaller swing weight, less torque is needed to raise the club head to the desired speed. Further help in this regard comes from the reduction in the club's rotational inertia (MOI, moment of inertia), which I estimate to be in the neighborhood of 10%. This reduction further reduces the torque needed to accelerate the club head. Taking into account both contributions, it looks like it's reasonable to suspect that choking down two inches on the driver could make a significant difference in one's ability to control the club. The gain in distance that otherwise would occur because of these two effects would be offset by a reduction in the effective swing radius, which, all other things being equal, lowers club head speed. By how much would one have to choke the driver before the effect of reduced swing radius offsets the effects of lowered swing weight and MOI, and no gain in speed is achieved?

[natureboy]

A number of posters in other forums have claimed that they hit straighter and often farther when they choke down about 1.5 inches on the driver. For a total distance amounting to about 75 inches from shoulder to club face, it's hard to see why a two percent shortening of effective swing radius could make a significant difference in performance. The minuscule change in rotational (moment of) inertia couldn't account for the alleged better control, and any lie angle differences would only apply to irons. So, why does choking work (if it works)?

My guess is that instead of having perhaps only 0.5 inch of the handle sticking outside the base of the left hand, there are now perhaps two inches of shaft that extend beyond the palm. The shaft is now much more easily able to nestle into the left palm's lifeline, thereby allowing the shaft to become more of an extension of the left arm.

Does this seem reasonable?

So was this a rhetorical question?

There is no doubt that choking down changes the "swing weight" of a club. Swing weight is basically the torque applied to the club by Earth's pull (I.e., the club's weight) relative to, say, the butt end of the shaft, when the shaft is horizontal near the top of the backswing. This torque is calculated by multiplying the club's weight by the distance between the butt end of the shaft to the "balance point" (the center of gravity, or center of mass). The balance point may easily be determined experimentally by finding the point at which the club may be balanced atop your outstretched index finger.

The balance point of a typical driver is approximately 30 inches from the butt end. The "fulcrum," about about which the club will rotate, is close to the end of the shaft, so the swing weight (in relative units) is about 30W, where W is the weight of the club. If the hands are moved two inches closer to the balance point, the new swing weight would be 28W, which amounts to a percentage decrease of about 6.7%. With a smaller swing weight, less torque is needed to raise the club head to the desired speed. Further help in this regard comes from the reduction in the club's rotational inertia (MOI, moment of inertia), which I estimate to be in the neighborhood of 10%. This reduction further reduces the torque needed to accelerate the club head. Taking into account both contributions, it looks like it's reasonable to suspect that choking down two inches on the driver could make a significant difference in one's ability to control the club. The gain in distance that otherwise would occur because of these two effects would be offset by a reduction in the effective swing radius, which, all other things being equal, lowers club head speed.

By how much would one have to choke the driver before the effect of reduced swing radius offsets the effects of lowered swing weight and MOI, and no gain in speed is achieved?

Do you maybe have the answer already?

I've experimented with chocking down and it jibes with what most describe the benefit as...striking the ball solidly with more consistency. In other words hitting the ball closer to the projected c/g on the face more often. I don't get better distance. It's slightly lower on average vs. a well-hit normal swing. I may hit it low on the face less often and the amount of curve off-line (which robs distance) may be less.

Possible reasons: The golf swing has inherent variability in it swing to swing with body and hand positions. Small errors multiply at the end of a longer lever. Gripping down also effectively stiffens the shaft a bit which could aid in feel of delivering the sweet spot more consistently or perhaps reduce differences in shaft / toe droop from small changes in the swing.