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2 minutes ago, Jack Watson said:

Looks pretty decent really.  Is it working?

Thanks.  Um..  in the last year I've really made a lot of changes.   Ball flight and distance made excellent improvements.   But, as changes will do, consistancy suffered quite a bit.   But, I hit quite a few balls over the winter and it really appearers to have made a positive effect.  Fewer mishits and more consistent flight path has produced rounds of 82 and 81 mixed in with some nice range sessions.    But, obviously, there is still plenty of room for improvement.  

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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4 minutes ago, lastings said:

Thanks.  Um..  in the last year I've really made a lot of changes.   Ball flight and distance made excellent improvements.   But, as changes will do, consistancy suffered quite a bit.   But, I hit quite a few balls over the winter and it really appearers to have made a positive effect.  Fewer mishits and more consistent flight path has produced rounds of 82 and 81 mixed in with some nice range sessions.    But, obviously, there is still plenty of room for improvement.  

That's good.  You improved.  Your swing looks good and it's not one I would personally mess with.

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(edited)

Well, I wasn't going to post my Driver swing just yet, because, one thing at a time.   

But, the more I think about it, the more I need advice.  

While, for the past year or so, I've been trying to rebuild my iron swing piece-by-piece, and I think I'm headed in the right direction.   My swing with my Driver is a different swing.  It always has been.   So, while I've been trying to learn a correct swing with my irons, I've basically been just winging it and sticking with whatever works with my driver.   I feel like I'm cheating my way to the ball flight I want.  

As you'll see below, My body is leaned forward, ball is way out in front, back foot is offset, swing (both backswing and downswing) are very fast.  looks like I'm almost going to fall over when I swing. 
This looks much more like my baseball swing than my golf swing.  

That much said, It's working.  Typically have a slight draw, but if it fades it's a very minimal fade.   If I draw it, though, it'll go about 280-285.   Strangely, I lose about 20 yds of distance on a fade, which is strange.  I posted about that in another thread some where.   

So, I guess the question is since the outcome is fine right now, do I just let sleeping dogs lie until my iron swing is where I want it?  or should I get working on not having two different swings for woods and irons?  
 

 

Edited by lastings

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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I was reading in another thread about turning my feet outwards.   Also, after I posted my last video, I noticed that the ball looked a bit too far back in my stance.   

went to work on those things a bit..   ball forward, no problem at all.  easy change.   turning the feet outward, even just a little bit, as you see here, felt quite awkward.   This is something I will need to work on to get used to..  

 

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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I'd work on…

  • Eliminating that ridiculously strong grip.
  • Fixing the ball position (far more forward).
  • Flaring both feet out at setup.

01.jpg02.jpg

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instructor Development, 5 Simple Keys®/Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins • Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 • "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 • Penn-State Behrend Head Coach • • • • • • • • • • :aimpoint: :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | 5SK.com | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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12 minutes ago, iacas said:

I'd work on…

  • Eliminating that ridiculously strong grip.

Why? His clubhead looks pretty good through impact?

With a weaker grip hell just have to bow the lead wrist to close the face and square up to impact?

 

@lastingsIron swing is looking good. Driver can be difficult to tame but keep at it.

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1 hour ago, Alx said:

Why? His clubhead looks pretty good through impact?

With a weaker grip hell just have to bow the lead wrist to close the face and square up to impact?

Because he's compensating for the ridiculously strong grip in ways that are hampering his game.

Look at how closed the clubface is and how far to the inside it is at A6. That's not a position you see from good players.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instructor Development, 5 Simple Keys®/Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins • Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 • "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 • Penn-State Behrend Head Coach • • • • • • • • • • :aimpoint: :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | 5SK.com | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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58 minutes ago, iacas said:

Because he's compensating for the ridiculously strong grip in ways that are hampering his game.

Look at how closed the clubface is and how far to the inside it is at A6. That's not a position you see from good players.

Ouch. 

When I saw this video of my swing, the first things I noticed was how far back in my stance the ball was, and the lack of any foot flare.  I've been working through those for the past week.  

Easy fixes.  Incorporating those into the swing has been no issue at all. 

The grip is another issue.  I've known for some time that my grip is way too far on the strong side.  But, taking swings with a grip closer to neutral feels so awkward.      Not just awkward, but repeated shanks.  That said, I've never put the work into adjusting my grip because i didn't (and maybe don't still) understand the benefit of doing so.  

But, if you think it's worth the effort, I'll get to work.  Hopefully it takes in reletively short order. 

 

  • Upvote 1

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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11 hours ago, lastings said:

Ouch. 

When I saw this video of my swing, the first things I noticed was how far back in my stance the ball was, and the lack of any foot flare.  I've been working through those for the past week.  

Easy fixes.  Incorporating those into the swing has been no issue at all. 

The grip is another issue.  I've known for some time that my grip is way too far on the strong side.  But, taking swings with a grip closer to neutral feels so awkward.      Not just awkward, but repeated shanks.  That said, I've never put the work into adjusting my grip because i didn't (and maybe don't still) understand the benefit of doing so.  

But, if you think it's worth the effort, I'll get to work.  Hopefully it takes in reletively short order. 

 

Keep at it. My Evolvr instructor had me weaken my grip a couple of years ago and I still have to work at it. Try taking your grip differently than current as a reminder. Example: I used to always grip with my left hand first. Now, I set my right index finger and thumb on the grip, put my left and in, then right. It reminds me to weaken.

Scott

Titleist, Edel, Scotty Cameron Putter, Snell - AimPoint - Evolvr - MirrorVision -MEVO+

My Swing Thread

boogielicious - Adjective describing the perfect surf wave

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On 5/21/2017 at 2:51 AM, iacas said:

Because he's compensating for the ridiculously strong grip in ways that are hampering his game.

Look at how closed the clubface is and how far to the inside it is at A6. That's not a position you see from good players.

Eh... Hes hitting the shots to the right so a lot of it is just camera angles. "Closed" face at A6, at impact and past its square. Makes for low rate of closure and a stable face. Why change any of that?

How does it hamper his game? 

 

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3 minutes ago, Alx said:

Eh... Hes hitting the shots to the right so a lot of it is just camera angles. "Closed" face at A6, at impact and past its square. Makes for low rate of closure and a stable face. Why change any of that?

How does it hamper his game?

Sorry, I'm not going to elaborate much more beyond this…

I see the ball back position as a compensation to try to hit the ball before the clubface slams shut. It's a compensation that thus allows his arms to come down a bit slower, or could lead to tipping his head back or failing to get forward properly. Look at how he has to cup the left wrist, too, just to try to hold off the face as well. People with strong grips tend to swing out to the right, too, as a way of "forcing" the ball right (I did a video on this), and a shallow AoA can lead to some difficult impact conditions - contact remains a bugaboo here. Another reason he probably has the ball back, btw. 

His swing isn't bad. I think a few small tweaks and he can play some really good golf.

The first of those is to go to a slightly strong grip instead of an incredibly strong grip.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instructor Development, 5 Simple Keys®/Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins • Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 • "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 • Penn-State Behrend Head Coach • • • • • • • • • • :aimpoint: :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | 5SK.com | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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I was just trying to get confirmation on what you think that specific thing causes.

His balance is so far off on all of those shots that alone could cause all those inconsistencies? I mean he has like 100% weight on the lead leg at impact with no support from the trail. Trail leg even lifts off the ground at impact.

Im not trying to annoy you just trying to understand.

 

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hey, look.....   I've become a case study!   :8)

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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1 hour ago, iacas said:

Sorry, I'm not going to elaborate much more beyond this…

I see the ball back position as a compensation to try to hit the ball before the clubface slams shut. It's a compensation that thus allows his arms to come down a bit slower, or could lead to tipping his head back or failing to get forward properly. Look at how he has to cup the left wrist, too, just to try to hold off the face as well. People with strong grips tend to swing out to the right, too, as a way of "forcing" the ball right (I did a video on this), and a shallow AoA can lead to some difficult impact conditions - contact remains a bugaboo here. Another reason he probably has the ball back, btw. 

His swing isn't bad. I think a few small tweaks and he can play some really good golf.

The first of those is to go to a slightly strong grip instead of an incredibly strong grip.

This is plenty and makes sense.

Usually when someones told me to eliminate the strong grip theyve meant going straight to neutral.

Just wanted to clear some things up. Thanks.

41 minutes ago, lastings said:

hey, look.....   I've become a case study!   :8)

You have very solid things going on in the swing. A lot of the stuff youre saying Ive gone through with my own swing.

Its fun seeing someone else go through similar phases :-D

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ok..   round two today of working with the new grip.   

headed over to the simulator over lunch and hit 50 or 60 balls with the 7-iron.   I am certainly becoming much more comfortable with the new grip.   Still feels very awkward, but I am starting to make pretty consistent contact on the ball.  but feels pretty awkward all the way up through my elbows, and I feel like I have less control over the path of the club on both the back-swing and down swing.   still another 5+ session from being comfortable, I think.   

anyways, three things I immediately noticed today.   

1) I am not getting a consistent flight path, as I was. now, sometimes draw, sometimes fade.  but, both curves are very light, and the fade is actually nice, because it starts a bit left of target and fades back towards it.   

2) the pull-hook is non-existent.  I didn't hit a single one all day long.   so, that is a bonus.  

3) ball flight is much higher and backspin on the 7-iron has increased from about 6400 to 7100.  so, thats probably a good thing.   

 

anyways, back to work.   I'll probably swing by the range on the way home today.  Once i start to feel more comfortable later this week, I'll try to get some video and report back.  

 

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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1 hour ago, lastings said:

1) I am not getting a consistent flight path, as I was. now, sometimes draw, sometimes fade.  but, both curves are very light, and the fade is actually nice, because it starts a bit left of target and fades back towards it.

To be expected. For now it'll primarily be related to the clubface control, as you get used to it, but I also expect to see the path change a little as well as some other little things.

1 hour ago, lastings said:

2) the pull-hook is non-existent.  I didn't hit a single one all day long.   so, that is a bonus.

That's to be expected.

7 minutes ago, lastings said:

3) ball flight is much higher and backspin on the 7-iron has increased from about 6400 to 7100.  so, thats probably a good thing.

7100 is about right.

7 minutes ago, lastings said:

anyways, back to work.   I'll probably swing by the range on the way home today.  Once i start to feel more comfortable later this week, I'll try to get some video and report back.  

When you use video, tip: split out the slow-mo ones with the fast ones. I'm only ever really interested in the slow-mo ones.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instructor Development, 5 Simple Keys®/Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins • Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 • "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 • Penn-State Behrend Head Coach • • • • • • • • • • :aimpoint: :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | 5SK.com | LSW | Instructional Droplets

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(edited)
16 minutes ago, iacas said:

When you use video, tip: split out the slow-mo ones with the fast ones. I'm only ever really interested in the slow-mo ones.

noted. and, thank you.  

Edited by lastings

:tmade:  - SIM2 - Kuro Kage silver 60 shaft
:cobra:  - F9 3W, 15 degree - Fukijara Atmos white tour spec stiff flex shaft

:tmade: - M2 hybrid, 19 degree
:tmade: - GAPR 3 iron - 18degree
:mizuno: MP-H5 4-5 iron, MP-25 6-8 iron, MP-5 9-PW

Miura - 1957 series k-grind - 56 degree
:bettinardi: - 52 degree
:titleist: - Scotty Cameron Newport 2 - Putter

check out my swing here

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On 5/21/2017 at 5:12 AM, boogielicious said:

Keep at it. My Evolvr instructor had me weaken my grip a couple of years ago and I still have to work at it. Try taking your grip differently than current as a reminder. Example: I used to always grip with my left hand first. Now, I set my right index finger and thumb on the grip, put my left and in, then right. It reminds me to weaken.

This is a totally reasonable approach.  Thought I'd throw in my method for this as another option.

I hold the club sticking straight away from belt buckle or so, parallel to the ground, with my right hand.  Then, with my hand splayed out a bit (not crazy stretch or anything, but not fingers touching) and flat, I choose an angle to hold my left hand, place the handle in the "right" position, so resting on the middle section of my pointer finger, resting on or a touch towards the wrist from the bottom knuckle of the pinkie finger.  Then wrap the fingers onto the handle, then roll the hand towards the handle to a comfortable spot.

For me this method gives a consistent grip, and I can control strong/weak just by the angle of my left hand before I place the handle.  If my left hand plane is perpendicular to the ground, I'll get a super strong grip, too strong.  With the left hand plane parallel to the ground, I'll get a weak grip, probably too weak, though for me I don't think it ends up as overly weak as the perpendicular way ends up over strong.

If I have time tonight maybe I'll take some pics to make this clearer...

35 minutes ago, iacas said:

When you use video, tip: split out the slow-mo ones with the fast ones. I'm only ever really interested in the slow-mo ones.

I've always felt this way too, but I've often wondered if more knowledgable players or instructors also liked to see the full speed clips to get a feel for the dynamics of the swing.  Like, maybe at full speed you can get a feel for the dynamics and athletic motions a player is trying to use that a player is trying to use that wouldn't be obvious at slow speed.  Maybe that might help an instructor decide which things are a priority, or which path or feel or drill towards fixing something is most likely to succeed with that player?

I suppose you're saying that's not true, at least not for you?  Like, you get all of that from the slo-mo?  Or that might be useful for an instructor of tour players but the shit we've all got wrong with our swings is so basic that it's not needed?  Something else?

Matt

Mid-Weight Heavy Putter
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Cleveland CG15 54˚
Nike Vapor Pro Combo, 4i-GW
Titleist 585h 19˚
Tour Edge Exotics XCG 15˚ 3 Wood
Taylormade R7 Quad 9.5˚

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