My Swing (Antneye)

[iacas]

On 9/19/2017 at 12:12 PM, Antneye said:

I used to watch a lot of Paul Wilson videos, and he is a big proponent of keeping the arms out of the swing.  I think this topic is one of the primary reasons he preaches that.  When I do this properly my feel is one of "leaving my arms behind" and not really feeling like I am engaging them until I get down to about A6.  Some of my best drives ever were struck with that feeling, but I struggle to make it repeatable.  

Every great player gets a lot of power from the arms, and Paul Wilson is teaching a feel that is very definitely not real.

FWIW.

[Antneye]

19 minutes ago, iacas said:

Every great player gets a lot of power from the arms, and Paul Wilson is teaching a feel that is very definitely not real.

FWIW.

Yeah.... As I study the swing more, I am coming to the same conclusion. I think some of the looseness is important, but to think the arms should not be involved at all is just asking for trouble. 

 

[RandallT]

@Antneye , I just wanted to chime in re: the loose arms. I mentioned above that I'm working a similar thing with regard to the steepness of the club at the start of the downswing. So you know I'm not an instructor- just a fellow traveler working on a similar thing, so I'll share a feel for me that is related, and even undermines the idea of loose arms:

What is working for me is when I start the downswing, I feel that the arms and hands stay very connected to my shoulder/torso rotation. It is almost the opposite of loose arms. Not tense, but definitely not loose.

If anything I "feel" that I give a little help to my arms in the horizontal direction as I come down. 

But the idea I want to convey is that in the past, I've had this fear of getting the horizontal movement of my arms/hands because I've always heard things like "let your arms stay loose"- which for me meant loose/relaxed arms working more downward.  I've even seen demonstrations where people show that one of the causes of OTT is when you move your arms horizontally, and they demonstrate and shift everything out and over the ball, which of course leads to OTT.

The results I'm feeling now as I move the arms and hands from the top is that the club lays down more, which is a natural reaction to the direction of the handle of the club. So I'm just trusting that the club kinda goes the OPPOSITE way that my arms/hands go, if that makes sense.

Anyway, your feels are different, as are your priorities but I wanted to share because I think it's relevant to your feels on loose arms. That "loose arm" idea was definitely a dead end for me, and probably detrimental in the way I had imagined the swing mechanics to be. YMMV

[Antneye]

I think I understand what you are saying and we may both be saying the same thing since it's so hard to describe a feel. 

I seem to have eliminated most of my OTT by letting my arms move due to that torso connection rather than actively starting the swing with them. I've referred to this as removing my arms from my swing but in reality I am simply slightly delaying actively engaging them. I not sure if that description  makes more sense, but it seems to have the same result you are describing and has helped me not to be so quick and jerky at the top. 

[RandallT]

Gotcha. For what it's worth, I've been working on this for a couple years, and I'm getting closer. Lots of false senses of "I've got this licked" along the way. So good luck!

[Antneye]

I have not been able to film in ages, but I am stuck between sessions (and rounds) that feel as if it is all clicking, and then having disastrous sessions where I feel I have made no progress whatsoever.

I am coming off a total blow-up round on a very difficult course and am feeling antsy because I do not know when I can next get to the range.  

 

HCP holding steady at 21.6 over the last month or so.  Still down from where I started, but not moving fast enough for my liking.

[Antneye]

I ended up going back to where I bought my driver to get re-fit because I wanted to eliminate the driver shaft as a cause of my driver inconsistency.  I am glad I went because it ends up being one item less I have to worry about.  The Pro who fitted me ended up putting me in a different stock shaft for my Cobra F7 (no charge).  The new an my old are both regular, but the new one is a little stiffer down towards the club head (I forget the actual terminology) and although the two were close my results with the new shaft had a much tighter dispersion pattern.  While I was getting fit he through in some tips for me.  It seems I had migrated back to being pretty hunched over and my balance was pretty bad.  Below are some practice swings with my adjusted posture.  

It looks like my head is pretty stable and not darting towards the ball as it was in the past.  I can't wait to get out and hit some balls to see how it feels.

 

 

[Antneye]

Here is another video, this time with a 6 iron, of my adjusted posture.  I know the lack of a ball minimizes the usefulness of the video, but I am strictly looking at posture and balance.  This adjustment seems to have really stabilized my head from going forward but I do seem to have a slight sway back away from target (not sure if that is a major concern though).

I played a round of golf on Friday and had my best day of ball striking with my driver in quite some time, but my irons were a bit erratic as I adjust to this.

Feedback on this is welcome please.

 

 

[iacas]

That posture looks good. Just make sure your head/neck are relaxed, too, and you keep looking directly at the ball. The chin was up a little in some of the videos.

[Antneye]

37 minutes ago, iacas said:

That posture looks good. Just make sure your head/neck are relaxed, too, and you keep looking directly at the ball. The chin was up a little in some of the videos.

Thanks!  I'll keep an eye on the chin. 

 

 

[Antneye]

I went out over lunch for a quick range session.  My primary focus was maintaining the posture adjustments I have made.  I definitely like the feel of it and the results on my driver are much improved.  Of course, this is golf, so all of my other clubs were problematic.  My irons were all either slight draws or big slices.  Prior to this adjustment my irons were flying pretty straight with the occasional draw or fade.  Even my 3 wood was slicing and that is something I have not seen in a while.

I assume it is just a reaction to the new stance and it will take some work to dial the swing in so I am not going to panic.  I can tell from my divots that I am definitely cutting across the ball with my irons.  All divots were flowing left of target and out to in...something I have not seen in quite some time.

I'm not entirely sure what to focus on with this iron issue as I felt like I was not coming over the top, but I was clearly cutting across the ball.  I'm not sure when I will be able to get video of me actually hitting balls.

 

 

[Antneye]

I played a round this Saturday and it was similar to my last range session.  My driver was improved over my recent struggles, but my irons have really developed a slice with what appears to be an OTT swing just from looking at my divots (if not OTT, it is definitely out to in at the point of contact).

I am at a loss as to why this has occurred since improving my posture.  I don't want to go back on my posture adjustments.  I am just struggling to figure out what I am doing differently with my swing from this new setup.

[Antneye]

I got out to the range this week and propped up my phone so the video is a bit crude and only DTL.  Nothing has really changed since my past post.  I am getting much better with my driver, fighting a fade/slice with my irons.  I am posting the video below.  Since then, I managed to play a round and I was extremely pleased with the results.  My driver was on all day and I was able to play the day without a single penalty stroke.  Initially I was off with my irons and had some bad second shots and a poor break that lead to two triple bogeys on the first three holes.  Hole by hole it got bettter and by the time I made the turn I was rolling.  If not for continued "yips" with my putter I would have had a personal best 9 on the back.  I managed to go 51-44  95 even with missing 3 putts from less than 4' on the back.  

Pretty solid improvement on my ball striking.  I walked off the course very encouraged by my results even though my score is not what I would like to see.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 2, 2017 by Antneye
typo

[billchao]

@Antneye, just a quick tip: I like to lay an alignment stick or golf club on the ground to line up the camera. Your angle is just a little off.

You can get a tripod that you can attach to your golf bag and a mount for holding your phone, too. I know propping it up can be a PITA.

[Antneye]

1 hour ago, billchao said:

@Antneye, just a quick tip: I like to lay an alignment stick or golf club on the ground to line up the camera. Your angle is just a little off.

You can get a tripod that you can attach to your golf bag and a mount for holding your phone, too. I know propping it up can be a PITA.

Thanks! 

[Antneye]

It's been a while since I have updated this thread.  My handicap is sitting at a 21 and after some improvement I've gone backwards of the tees.  I think it's time for a check-up.

Things I see in the video: I still have some head movement forward (I just can't seem to stop that).  I think my overall posture is far better than it was when I first started, but I am horribly inconsistent still.

 

 

 

Edited July 21, 2018 by Antneye

[iacas]

Your ball position is pretty far back and you seem to lack much axis tilt.

[Antneye]

5 minutes ago, iacas said:

Your ball position is pretty far back and you seem to lack much axis tilt.

Thanks.  On ball position I have really been struggling with big pulls when I have the ball in the traditional forward position.  I am not sure why that is, but it has lead to me bringing the ball further back.  Any ideas on why this would be the case and what adjustments I should make?

On axis tilt, can you clarify what you mean?  I am assuming that you mean at set up I should have my torso slightly tilted away from the target line?

I feel like I am close with my overall game but these driver struggles are really holding me back.  I've shot some of the best 9's in my life of late, but go through bouts of not being able to hit anything in play off the tees.  Rounds of 54-43, 55-41 etc.  Not to mention the days that I never even find the driver for any stretch of holes which has yielded some >100 rounds after I had settled into the low to mid 90's on average.