Opinion on pros and cons of private club membership

[minitour]

Con: $

Pro: Everything else.

[cruzthepug]

I ended up joining the public course where my group have been playing for several years. The cost worked out to break-even if you play once a week, we play at least twice, so it was a no brainer. After I joined the other 3 in my group joined as well, one of them has kids that play and he got a family membership for only a couple hundred more. I've been looking at joining one of the local country clubs, although it's closer to my house I really can't justify about 4x the cost. I am playing in a tournament at the club this weekend and played a practice round yesterday and the course is nice and they have a very nice practice facility, pool, restaurant, etc.. I still don't think I can justify the cost.

[double eagle]

Golf is having a tough time right now.   The Y Generation are not interested in golf.   In fact they're leaving the game at 30% more than the previous year.  Many private clubs are going to feel the pinch and will be required to increase their dues and/or make serious annual assessments to the members.   My advice to you is enjoy the game at the public level and accept the fact that you may have to spend 5 hours in the beautiful sunshine instead of 4 hours at a private club.  Last year in the US there were 11 new courses built.......there were 167 that closed.   If you google the "Oldsmobile/Golf" concept you'll read that by the year 2050 golf could be a thing of the past.   Scary.  I attend a USGA Workshop every year and I don't like what I hear.

[DaveP043]

I've been a member at a private club for about 20 years, We pay something like $4,000 a year in monthly dues, plus a very small food minimum.  My wife and I play unlimited golf, and between us we average between 120 and 150 rounds per year, which works out to the ballpark of $30 per round.  In the metropolitan Washington DC area, there's no way t beat that value at public facilities.

Additional advantages are:

Availability - we'd love to have more members for the health of the club, but right now there's not a big competition for weekend tee times, and the weekdays are generally wide-open.  If we play on a Sunday morning, and feel like going back out for 9 more, its no problem at all.

Friends - We've developed a great group of friends at the club.  I can go out at just about any time of day and play with someone I know and like.  I have a steady group of about 25 guys I play with, we use up to 3 tee times every weekend morning.  We travel with a number of different couples for vacations.

Interclub - We play in a men's handicap interclub league the includes 20 private clubs in northern Virginia.  The members include Washington Golf, which has had sitting presidents as members, and the Trump National club, which I think will be hosting a Senior PGA in a few years.  Jsgolfer, another member here at TST, is a member at the club I'm playing at on Sunday for a match.

Reciprocity - On rare occasions when travelling, I've asked to play at a nearby private club, and I've needed to be a club member elsewhere to be invited in.  A call from my home pro has made that possible.

[BuckeyeNut]

Golf is having a tough time right now.   The Y Generation are not interested in golf.   In fact they're leaving the game at 30% more than the previous year.  Many private clubs are going to feel the pinch and will be required to increase their dues and/or make serious annual assessments to the members.   My advice to you is enjoy the game at the public level and accept the fact that you may have to spend 5 hours in the beautiful sunshine instead of 4 hours at a private club.  Last year in the US there were 11 new courses built.......there were 167 that closed.   If you google the "Oldsmobile/Golf" concept you'll read that by the year 2050 golf could be a thing of the past.   Scary.  I attend a USGA Workshop every year and I don't like what I hear.

I have to disagree on a couple levels........

For now, I will address 1.   Slow play at many if not most private courses is also an issue.   Whether you play 18 holes in 3hrs or 5hrs is more a function of the time of day you play than whether it's private or public.   Proud "Dawn Patrol" golfer here........slow play is never an issue because we lead the way!!  My 4-some normally plays 18 in 3hrs flat.....unless a certain person the group as a replacement.... and then it takes us  3hrs 15 minutes..LOL

If a slowish group somehow gets out front on my home track, they'll get steamrolled.  If they don't wave us through after 1-2 holes of us riding their azzes, we'll drive past and skip a hole rather than wait.  We normally have the first time, but every once in a blue moon, somebody will take it from us...LOL    If they do, they better play fast or we'll be right on them.........and other regulars will be queuing up to do the same.

[nick1998bunker]

I am not a member at a private club but a semi private club. The dues are extremely cheap. It is the second nicest course in the area behind the 50,000 dollar private club and I play a ton. I used to just play sometimes on the weekend but now I usually play 63 holes a week with no extra fee. I usually play after school so I practice for an hour or two basically alone then go play 9 holes walking in an hour if I play 1 ball because it is empty. My Highschool golf team plays at a private course and I would never think about switching a membership. The course is in bad condition comparatively( and there is the same owner between the 2 courses) and play is very slow. 3 high schoolers walking playing full usga rules is typically faster than some members. I recommend the closest to home semi private club

[SeenRed]

I belonged to a private club for many years before relocating to a new area about 10 years ago.  I've been playing public and semi-private since then.

I always enjoyed being a member of a private club, for many of the reasons already mentioned in the thread.  For me, my club became a very comfortable place where I had a tight circle of golfing friends.  There was never a day or a time when I couldn't show up at the course and find a friendly game or a money match with someone in my circle.  When we weren't on the course, we'd be in the clubhouse scaring up a card game...or in the lounge having an adult beverage and watching a game.  I have yet to find that comfort level, or the familiarity, at the public and semi-private clubs I now play.

Red

[ay33660]

Golf is having a tough time right now.   The Y Generation are not interested in golf.   In fact they're leaving the game at 30% more than the previous year.  Many private clubs are going to feel the pinch and will be required to increase their dues and/or make serious annual assessments to the members.   My advice to you is enjoy the game at the public level and accept the fact that you may have to spend 5 hours in the beautiful sunshine instead of 4 hours at a private club.  Last year in the US there were 11 new courses built.......there were 167 that closed.   If you google the "Oldsmobile/Golf" concept you'll read that by the year 2050 golf could be a thing of the past.   Scary.  I attend a USGA Workshop every year and I don't like what I hear.

Interesting .... the private club that I belong to currently has a full play wait list of over 30 players (that is the maximum that can be on the wait list). Beyond that they get on a wait list to the wait list.

That is at $50k for initiation fee. Which by the way is a GREAT deal considering that the other private clubs in the city have initiation fees of $80k to $100k.

There is also a wait list to get into the intermediate play category (21 to 35 year olds).

I have no idea why I constantly read comments about golf dying.

Golf is not having a tough time here.

[SavvySwede]

Quote:

Originally Posted by double eagle

Golf is having a tough time right now.   The Y Generation are not interested in golf.   In fact they're leaving the game at 30% more than the previous year.  Many private clubs are going to feel the pinch and will be required to increase their dues and/or make serious annual assessments to the members.   My advice to you is enjoy the game at the public level and accept the fact that you may have to spend 5 hours in the beautiful sunshine instead of 4 hours at a private club.  Last year in the US there were 11 new courses built.......there were 167 that closed.   If you google the "Oldsmobile/Golf" concept you'll read that by the year 2050 golf could be a thing of the past.   Scary.  I attend a USGA Workshop every year and I don't like what I hear.

Interesting .... the private club that I belong to currently has a full play wait list of over 30 players (that is the maximum that can be on the wait list). Beyond that they get on a wait list to the wait list.

That is at $50k for initiation fee. Which by the way is a GREAT deal considering that the other private clubs in the city have initiation fees of $80k to $100k.

There is also a wait list to get into the intermediate play category (21 to 35 year olds).

I have no idea why I constantly read comments about golf dying.

Golf is not having a tough time here.

You a talking about a golf club in a densely populated area catering to the wealthy. A business model that very few golf courses could sustain. How many golfers would be willing or able to play golf if that was what was required? I play 80 rounds or so year and spend around $1200 a year on greens fees because I get some free rounds at the course where I work.

[logo]

You a talking about a golf club in a densely populated area catering to the wealthy. A business model that very few golf courses could sustain. How many golfers would be willing or able to play golf if that was what was required? I play 80 rounds or so year and spend around $1200 a year on greens fees because I get some free rounds at the course where I work.

I agree with you. No way that works anywhere but very wealthy areas. And I mean really wealthy. Only 10% of american families have a household income above 100k and only 2.5% have one above 250k. I am 36 years old and live in pretty populated area. Most of my friends have great jobs - doctors, lawyers, business, etc - we all fall in the that 10% and 1-2 of us fall in that 2.5% (barely). But if any of them tried to spend 50k on golf their wives would divorce them and I dont think they could do it even if they were allowed. I think none of us would even pay a 5k initiation fee. That 2008 economical bust scared us. We are trying to put away savings for what comes next - a bigger house downpayment, etc. We have to spend our money on bigger houses, better cars, kids, etc. to keep up with the jonses - that is where our money goes. Additionally, since we live in warmer climates all of our neighborhoods have clubhouses, pools, parks, tennis etc. A private club membership is only good for golf. We dont need the amenities. I pay just under $1000 a year for unlimited walking and driving range at a public course. Honestly if it were more than that I probably wouldn't. Most of the people I am friends with my age won't even pay that because we work long hours, have kids, travel, etc and would rather just pay the daily fee when they get out. I dont think country clubs are something for my generation. There is too much other stuff we want to spend our money on (ipads, etc.). I don't even see the appeal of the private course in my area. The only reason I would join one is if I have millions just doing nothing in the bank. They just are not worth it when you have decent public courses at a fraction of the cost.

[PeteK]

I recently looked into membership at the local private club.  Granted I'm pretty new to the game, but I didn't really see much of an advantage at all.  Especially given their pricing.  You had to pay a membership fee annually, spend x amount of dollars in the clubhouse to maintain membership, and on top of that you still have to pay $100 for 18 holes of golf.  What's the point?  I can spend less than that to golf every other course around here and not pay an annual fee.

[ay33660]

You a talking about a golf club in a densely populated area catering to the wealthy. A business model that very few golf courses could sustain. How many golfers would be willing or able to play golf if that was what was required? I play 80 rounds or so year and spend around $1200 a year on greens fees because I get some free rounds at the course where I work.

You live in the NJ area which is a more densely populated area than mine which is Vancouver, BC, Canada I think.

Private clubs in the New Jersey / New York area must be a lot more expensive than $100k to join.

[ay33660]

I agree with you. No way that works anywhere but very wealthy areas. And I mean really wealthy. Only 10% of american families have a household income above 100k and only 2.5% have one above 250k. I am 36 years old and live in pretty populated area. Most of my friends have great jobs - doctors, lawyers, business, etc - we all fall in the that 10% and 1-2 of us fall in that 2.5% (barely). But if any of them tried to spend 50k on golf their wives would divorce them and I dont think they could do it even if they were allowed. I think none of us would even pay a 5k initiation fee. That 2008 economical bust scared us. We are trying to put away savings for what comes next - a bigger house downpayment, etc. We have to spend our money on bigger houses, better cars, kids, etc. to keep up with the jonses - that is where our money goes. Additionally, since we live in warmer climates all of our neighborhoods have clubhouses, pools, parks, tennis etc. A private club membership is only good for golf. We dont need the amenities. I pay just under $1000 a year for unlimited walking and driving range at a public course. Honestly if it were more than that I probably wouldn't. Most of the people I am friends with my age won't even pay that because we work long hours, have kids, travel, etc and would rather just pay the daily fee when they get out. I dont think country clubs are something for my generation. There is too much other stuff we want to spend our money on (ipads, etc.). I don't even see the appeal of the private course in my area. The only reason I would join one is if I have millions just doing nothing in the bank. They just are not worth it when you have decent public courses at a fraction of the cost.

As I mentioned there is a wait list for intermediate memberships (22 to 35) also.

They get a lot better deal cause I believe their initiation is 50% of the regular initiation fees.

We have a lot of professionals who are members.

I always thought that Canadian professional made a LOT less than American professionals.

On average  -

MD (non specialist) - $200k to $300k

MD (specialists) - $500k to $650k

Dentist - $250k to $700k

Lawyers - $200k to $450k

Accountants - $200k to $500k

Engineers - $150k to $250k

But the really wealthy guys are the business owners.

And a good number of the young guys (intermediates) seem to have time to run their businesses and to golf mid day during the week!

Also we really only have a good 8 or 9 months of golf in the year.

We also don't have a pool or tennis court at our club. It is strictly for golf.

So you guys are lucky in that respect.

[ay33660]

I recently looked into membership at the local private club.  Granted I'm pretty new to the game, but I didn't really see much of an advantage at all.  Especially given their pricing.  You had to pay a membership fee annually, spend x amount of dollars in the clubhouse to maintain membership, and on top of that you still have to pay $100 for 18 holes of golf.  What's the point?  I can spend less than that to golf every other course around here and not pay an annual fee.

How is that a private club?

At my club -

- one time initiation fee $50k

- monthly dues around $450

- quarterly food minimum $220

- unlimited golf - no other costs for each round

[logo]

As I mentioned there is a wait list for intermediate memberships (22 to 35) also.

They get a lot better deal cause I believe their initiation is 50% of the regular initiation fees.

We have a lot of professionals who are members.

I always thought that Canadian professional made a LOT less than American professionals.

On average  -

MD (non specialist) - $200k to $300k

MD (specialists) - $500k to $650k

Dentist - $250k to $700k

Lawyers - $200k to $450k

Accountants - $200k to $500k

Engineers - $150k to $250k

But the really wealthy guys are the business owners.

And a good number of the young guys (intermediates) seem to have time to run their businesses and to golf mid day during the week!

Also we really only have a good 8 or 9 months of golf in the year.

We also don't have a pool or tennis court at our club. It is strictly for golf.

So you guys are lucky in that respect.

Those salaries are not close to what people make here. Its not even half. Even my friends in DC/NYC do not make those kinds of salaries. Here you can see average medical field salaries across the us...the average MD makes 100-200k (http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Degree=Doctor_of_Medicine_%28MD%29/Salary) and those upper ends are urban areas. The MDs where I live in the south US make on the low end of that.

[PeteK]

How is that a private club?

At my club -

- one time initiation fee $50k

- monthly dues around $450

- quarterly food minimum $220

- unlimited golf - no other costs for each round

Beats me!  I didn't think it was right when they told me, but I've only been golfing for about 2 years now so I've never really been to a private country club.  The local municipal course has a yearly membership that isn't much less than the annual dues at the country club, but at the municipal course you get unlimited free golf for your money and there is no quarterly minimum.  Maybe I live in bizarro world.  It seems bass ackwards.

[rkim291968]

Some exclusive private clubs are doing well.  Being a member is a status symbol, a door into socializing with who is who in the community.   I can believe there would be a waiting list to get into despite lofty initiation fee.   We entertained joining a country club, visited a few facility, etc., last year.   At the end, getting stuck with initiation fee + monthly payment didn't work for us as we plan to move around after I quit my job.  I also didn't like "socializing" aspects of a country club.   We are only in it for golf and didn't want to get bothered with different committees, donation drives, being pressured to volunteer, parties for members, ....    But others join for that aspect of the membership, not so much for golf!    We ended up renewing our public golf membership.

No offense to the rich professional folks who post here.   Rubbing shoulders with doctors, lawyers, well to do business people, and misc millionaires isn't for me.  I am from a humble beginning and gets lost when surrounded by aforementioned folks.

[ay33660]

Those salaries are not close to what people make here. Its not even half. Even my friends in DC/NYC do not make those kinds of salaries. Here you can see average medical field salaries across the us...the average MD makes 100-200k (http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Degree=Doctor_of_Medicine_%28MD%29/Salary) and those upper ends are urban areas. The MDs where I live in the south US make on the low end of that.

Wow I am surprised.

Vancouver is a very expensive city.

Land values are crazy here. This is mostly because we have become a favorite city for various business owners and/or political officials from China to launder (no bad word), hide (nope bad again), funnel (again not good) ...... invest (yeah that's the word) their ill gotten funds. I mean the "official" rule in China is that you can only take out of the country US$50,000 in one year. Yet purchases of middle of the road properties (as in not waterfront) on the west side of Vancouver is around $4M to $6M. Waterfront will run into $10M to $30M.

As a result a bare city lot (50ft x 100ft) will cost you $3.5M at a minimum. Then you have to spend approx. $1.5M to build a house or renovate.

And now a friend of mine who is a realtor says there is some growing interest from Russian buyers.