Must Search for a Lost Ball?

[ghalfaire]

So, yesterday while playing with the men's club at a local course, I managed to put a drive into a thick stand of trees & bushes on the right side of the fairway.   Suspecting I might not be able to find the ball and the trees are not a penalty area, I announced that I would hit a provisional  ball.  As the old saying of "same golfer, more experience" would imply I striped the provisional ball down the middle.  As I was proceeding to my first ball I could see that even if I found it that it would certainly be unplayable and without relief within two club lengths.   Also the line formed between where I suspected the ball was and the flag was,would not  be very appealing as I would have to go back a about 30-50 yards from the first trees and would have had to hit the ball out of the rough over the trees to get back to the fairway or chip out and lay 3 about a 100 yards short of my provisional ball.   Not only that but these particular trees are not friendly to humans trying to find a ball, lots of things to stick you in there.  Thus, I decided I would not look for the ball as I was sure the rules didn't require one to do that if they choose not to.  But one to the players in the foursome said the rule required me to look for the ball. Since I am new to the group and the course was crowded and I didn't have my rule book with me (stupid), I did not argue.  As luck would have it the ball was found and I ended up in the rough trying to hit over the trees.   To make a long story short this cost me more than the stroke and distance would have.

Now that I am back at the house with time to look at the  rules, specifically rule 7.1 would seem to be the appropriate one.  I don't see that this rule requires one to look for the ball.  In fact rule 7.1a says "you MAY take reasonable actions to find and identify ball".  I think implicit in the word "MAY" is that the action is optional. 

So who is right here, is one required to look for a potentially lost ball (I would think not for a lot of reasons)?

[Big C]

You are right and you are under no obligation to look. 

With that said, I believe (and some of our rules experts can probably chime in here) that if another player believes he may have found your ball that you are required to identify it at that time. 

I believe this topic came up a few years back when debating where to draw the line between being a good sportsman and being a fierce competitor. 

In the scenario being debated, the set up was this: You and your opponent are teeing up on a par 3. You hit a decent shot near the green. Your opponent follows by shanking his ball into heavy woods. It may not be found, but if it is, it's likely "dead." 

Your opponent decides to play a provisional and hits his second ball to tap in range for what would be a kick in bogey. As a result, he decides not to look for his first ball. 

Would you be a poor sportsman for deciding to look for his first ball, against his wishes? 

@ghalfaire in your case, your opponent may have simply been misinformed and genuinely believed you had to search. But if you had correctly responded that you were not obligated to do so and he decided to look for your ball anyway, than I would argue that he was being a poor sport. 

[Missouri Swede]

7.1 says a player is responsible for finding their ball in play after each stroke.  But how much effort goes into that is up for discussion.

Perhaps more to the point of your situation at the time. Having found the ball, choose to take relief from an unplayable lie. You can’t play your provisional ball, but you can go back to the tee and hit another tee shot (stroke and distance option).  Hopefully it’s as good as your provisional ball was.

Edited June 28, 2023 by Missouri Swede

[saevel25]

When in doubt, just email the USGA on a rule clarification. 

[iacas]

41 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

When in doubt, just email the USGA on a rule clarification. 

Or just ask here, like he did. 🙂

You're not required to look for your ball. You are obligated to identify it if someone finds what they think is your ball. You can ask them not to look, but they don't have to listen to you.

If you run ahead and play a shot from your provisional, it becomes the ball in play, though, as you'd have played a shot from closer to the hole than your original ball was thought to be.

[DaveP043]

The only time when you might choose not to look for your Original Ball is once you've played a Provisional, so look at 18.3  for Provisional Balls.  Not only are you not required to look, but you can ask other players not to look as well.  They don't have to follow your request, and if they find a ball that could be yours, you do have to identify it as long as the Provisional has not yet become the ball in play.

[iacas]

@DaveP043:

😉

[ghalfaire]

Thanks to all of you for your responses. 

So you know, it wasn't me that found the ball, it was the fellow that said I had to look for it (of course).  Since I take time to read the rule book once in awhile I am pleased I did understand the rule. 

I also agree with the above comments that if you say you don't want to look for the ball, IMO it is poor sportsmanship for your competitor to go look for your ball.  But there is some Karma I guess as the fellow cut his arm up a little in the thicket finding my ball. Lots of sticking & thorny plants in AZ.

[pganapathy]

Because you called the second ball a provisional, it isn't the ball in play unless one of the following happens.

1) You take a stroke at the provisional.  At that point it is the ball in play and finding the first ball doesn't matter.  The only time this rule does not apply is if the first ball you hit is actually in the hole, which means you have holed out and you are done with the hole, and therefore taking a stroke at the provisional ball is just practice effectively.

2) You have looked for the ball for 3 minutes and not found it.

3) You have found your ball but it is OB

 

You are not obligated to look for your ball but your opponents can look for it.  If they find a ball and tell you about it, you are obliged to identify it and see if it is yours.

The best solution in cases like this is to go quickly and take a stroke at the provisional ball, which makes it the ball in play, post which finding your first ball is immaterial.

I don't care how competitive the match is, I feel it is unsportsmanlike to go look for somebody else's ball when they don't want you to.

[iacas]

4 hours ago, pganapathy said:

1) You take a stroke at the provisional.  At that point it is the ball in play and finding the first ball doesn't matter.  The only time this rule does not apply is if the first ball you hit is actually in the hole, which means you have holed out and you are done with the hole, and therefore taking a stroke at the provisional ball is just practice effectively.

That’s not true. You can hit your provisional so long as it’s from farther from the hole than your original is thought to be.

[Rulesman]

22 hours ago, ghalfaire said:

 As luck would have it the ball was found and I ended up in the rough trying to hit over the trees.   To make a long story short this cost me more than the stroke and distance would have.

 

As Missouri Swede said in post #3.

Treat it as unplayable and take S&D.

 

 

[StuM]

On 6/28/2023 at 5:57 PM, Missouri Swede said:

Perhaps more to the point of your situation at the time. Having found the ball, choose to take relief from an unplayable lie. You can’t play your provisional ball, but you can go back to the tee and hit another tee shot (stroke and distance option).

I am lost on why he cannot play the original provisional after find the ball and consider it “Unplayable”  Going back and taking S&D is an option for an unplayable and that is what he did when he called it a provisional.  Why would he have to waste time & go back to hit a 3rd tee shot?

7 minutes ago, StuM said:

I am lost on why he cannot play the original provisional after find the ball and consider it “Unplayable”  Going back and taking S&D is an option for an unplayable and that is what he did when he called it a provisional.  Why would he have to waste time & go back to hit a 3rd tee shot?

Opps, already answered.  I should have read the full thread before asking the question.

Edited June 30, 2023 by StuM

[StuM]

9 hours ago, iacas said:

That’s not true. You can hit your provisional so long as it’s from farther from the hole than your original is thought to be.

Ok, still a little confused.  If he considers the ball unplayable what is stopping him from taking S&D and playing his provisional?

 

[iacas]

17 minutes ago, StuM said:

Ok, still a little confused.  If he considers the ball unplayable what is stopping him from taking S&D and playing his provisional?

The provisional is abandoned when the ball is found on the course.

Otherwise, a player would have the option of choosing to play his original ball or the provisional. He'd effectively have a choice between two balls in play.

[pganapathy]

11 hours ago, iacas said:

That’s not true. You can hit your provisional so long as it’s from farther from the hole than your original is thought to be.

Thanks so much for that information.  I didn't know that.  I always assumed the moment you take a second stroke at the provisional, it will be the ball in play irrespecetive of whether you find the first ball or not.  The only exception I understood was if the first ball had already gone into the hole and therefore the hole was complete.  Good to learn.  That is why I like this site so much

[iacas]

5 minutes ago, pganapathy said:

Thanks so much for that information.  I didn't know that.  I always assumed the moment you take a second stroke at the provisional, it will be the ball in play irrespecetive of whether you find the first ball or not.  The only exception I understood was if the first ball had already gone into the hole and therefore the hole was complete.  Good to learn.  That is why I like this site so much

See 18.3c(2)

https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-and-clarifications.html#!ruletype=fr&section=rule&rulenum=18&subrulenum=3

• When Provisional Ball Is Played from Spot Nearer Hole Than Where Original Ball Is Estimated to Be. The original ball is no longer in play (even if it is then found on the course before the end of the three-minute search time or is found nearer the hole than had been estimated) and is now a wrong ball that must not be played (see Rule 6.3c).

[pganapathy]

12 minutes ago, iacas said:

See 18.3c(2)

https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-and-clarifications.html#!ruletype=fr&section=rule&rulenum=18&subrulenum=3

• When Provisional Ball Is Played from Spot Nearer Hole Than Where Original Ball Is Estimated to Be. The original ball is no longer in play (even if it is then found on the course before the end of the three-minute search time or is found nearer the hole than had been estimated) and is now a wrong ball that must not be played (see Rule 6.3c).

I am just curious.  What happens if you play the provisional from a spot further than where the original ball is assumed to be.  When will it become the ball in play.  After looking for and not finding in 3 minutes the original ball.  What happens if you don't search for the original ball?

[ghalfaire]

16 hours ago, pganapathy said:

Because you called the second ball a provisional, it isn't the ball in play unless one of the following happens.

 

The best solution in cases like this is to go quickly and take a stroke at the provisional ball, which makes it the ball in play, post which finding your first ball is immaterial.

I don't care how competitive the match is, I feel it is unsportsmanlike to go look for somebody else's ball when they don't want you to.

You're correct.  I should have just gone up and hit the provisional before the ball in play was found.  But as  said I am the new guy in the league and didn't really want to start out with upsetting a long time member.