Can Somebody Explain to Me Why Lie Angle Balanced Putters Are Important?

[GolfLug]

So got fitted in a 35" Odyssey Microhinge Double wide 'blade' yesterday at GG. Choice was between it, SQ to SQ, LAB DF3, Rose Axis and Mizuno Craft  (also a double wide).

Apparently I'm pretty good a aiming right of the hole consistently regardless of putter type. But it all came down to distance control and the insert feel. We hit puts in the putting area for the fitting but then ended up on the aisle carpet to hit long 40ish feet putts. Which is where the Microhinge did the best for my stroke. The Mizuno was a close second. The DF3 and Axis weren't bad either but I just felt really confident over the Microhinge and slightly soft but firm contact resonated so well.

FWIW, I wanted to like the lie-angle balanced putters more than I did and was prepared to spend a bit. I guess putting is the individualistic aspect of our game. Hopefully, I didn't leave anything on the table. Anyone who knows my putting knows I need all the help I can get.

[ChetlovesMer]

I just found out, Face Balanced Is NOT Enough! 

Turns out you need Face Balanced AND Face Down! 

Check it out: 

SQ Putter Hybrid - Performance Golf

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AS FEATURED IN: NEVER 3-PUTT AGAIN: New Putter Moves Straight Back Straight Through FOR YOU Why is a “straight back straight through” putter the easiest way to make more putts? Because that… ELIMINATES an open or...

How on Earth do you expect to ever make a putt with the putter you are using!?!?!?!?!?!?

[mdl]

I don't know if it's the torque balance or whatever else. But I got fitted for an Edel 4.0 a few years back and gained a bit under two strokes on the green! So, at minimum, get fit 😁

[ChetlovesMer]

I watched this video and I thought it was interesting.

 

 

Having said that what is really interesting is the comment section for this video. WOW, there is a cult-like following for LAB putters all of a sudden. 

I've heard it at the driving range too. Guys talking about not IF but WHEN they are going to be getting their LAB putter. I've said to them that "the revealer" isn't really a scientific thing and they all look at me like I have two heads. The are 100% convinced that the LAB putter will transform their game. 

I have to give it to LAB, coming up with "The Revealer" is a stroke of marketing genius. Apparently if your putter spins in "the revealer" you'll never make another putt again.  

[boogielicious]

7 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I watched this video and I thought it was interesting.

 

 

Having said that what is really interesting is the comment section for this video. WOW, there is a cult-like following for LAB putters all of a sudden. 

I've heard it at the driving range too. Guys talking about not IF but WHEN they are going to be getting their LAB putter. I've said to them that "the revealer" isn't really a scientific thing and they all look at me like I have two heads. The are 100% convinced that the LAB putter will transform their game. 

I have to give it to LAB, coming up with "The Revealer" is a stroke of marketing genius. Apparently if your putter spins in "the revealer" you'll never make another putt again.  

It’s funny how the folks who jump to the newest, latest, greatest putter technology never actually work on what causes them to miss putts. They are bad at the three fundamentals, reading, start line, speed control. And I bet none of them actually get fit for the putter to make sure they can aim it.

[ChetlovesMer]

5 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

It’s funny how the folks who jump to the newest, latest, greatest putter technology never actually work on what causes them to miss putts. They are bad at the three fundamentals, reading, start line, speed control. And I bet none of them actually get fit for the putter to make sure they can aim it.

You're not wrong. 
But hey, I like shiny things as much or even more than the next guy. 

I really enjoy trying out new equipment. 
Having said that, the zero-torque thing "feels" a bit like the counter-balanced putter of about a decade ago. All of sudden every putter had to be "counter-balanced". Today nobody talks about getting a counter-balanced putter. ... Although, I suggest that counter-balancing a putter actually has more merit than sticking it in "the revealer". 

[iacas]

14 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I have to give it to LAB, coming up with "The Revealer" is a stroke of marketing genius. Apparently if your putter spins in "the revealer" you'll never make another putt again.  

I gained 1.06 strokes against a PGA Tour player putting with my lob wedge as @billchao can attest.

Pretty sure the lob wedge would fail in the Revealer.

Just now, ChetlovesMer said:

I really enjoy trying out new equipment. 
Having said that, the zero-torque thing "feels" a bit like the counter-balanced putter of about a decade ago. All of sudden every putter had to be "counter-balanced". Today nobody talks about getting a counter-balanced putter. ... Although, I suggest that counter-balancing a putter actually has more merit than sticking it in "the revealer". 

My putter is counter-balanced.

My lob wedge is not.

[ChetlovesMer]

Just now, iacas said:

I gained 1.06 strokes against a PGA Tour player putting with my lob wedge as @billchao can attest.

Pretty sure the lob wedge would fail in the Revealer.

IMPOSSIBLE! It's literally impossible to make putts if your putter fails in the revealer. 

"THE REVEALER IS OUR PUTTING GOD!"

 

1 minute ago, iacas said:

My putter is counter-balanced.

Mine too... as you know. 
I think that's actually a legit bit of tech. But the masses don't care. That's not the latest and greatest buzz word. 

Plus .... wait for it .... Counterbalancing will not stop your putter from spinning in "The Revealer"! 

[Ty_Webb]

My putter is also counterbalanced. I have a 100g weight in the grip. I read something back in the day about how counterbalancing can improve putter stability and I noticed that my putter was quite wobbly. I put the 100g weight in the grip myself and it instantly settled down. I totally believe it. I did read once that it can have a detrimental effect on your speed control, but my speed control when I'm actually playing is pretty good for the most part.

I don't think I've ever heard LAB say that no putter that fails the revealer will be any good. All they've said is that if it fails in the revealer then it's not lie angle balanced. I don't think that's an especially unreasonable claim. You can argue whether lie angle balancing helps or not - they say they think it does - I can see an argument for how it could be helpful. It's marginal, but putting is also tiny margins so 🤷‍♂️

[iacas]

9 minutes ago, Ty_Webb said:

I don't think I've ever heard LAB say that no putter that fails the revealer will be any good.

Dude.

[ChetlovesMer]

2 hours ago, Ty_Webb said:

I don't think I've ever heard LAB say that no putter that fails the revealer will be any good.

They don't, but their drones of cult followers do. LAB definitely DOES say that if your putter fails "The Revealer" test it is working against you. 👍🤣👍

Go up about 6 posts, click on the youtube video and read the comment section. There are at least a half dozen posts about "The Revealer" being the end all be all of whether or not a putter is worth a damn. 🤷‍♂️

Edited January 14, 2025 by ChetlovesMer

[Ty_Webb]

1 hour ago, ChetlovesMer said:

They don't, but their drones of cult followers do. LAB definitely DOES say that if your putter fails "The Revealer" test it is working against you. 👍🤣👍

Go up about 6 posts, click on the youtube video and read the comment section. There are at least a half dozen posts about "The Revealer" being the end all be all of whether or not a putter is worth a damn. 🤷‍♂️

Youtube comments are not generally something I give a whole heap of weight to. The "working against you" thing is kind of their whole schtick. I don't think it's unreasonable for them to say that. It's obviously possible to putt well with a regular putter. Putting comes down to can you pick the right line, get the speed right and then can you start the ball where you want to. If you do those things well, then you'll putt well (hardly groundbreaking I know). Would a lie angle balanced putter help you start it on line? I don't know. I know lots of people have opinions about it. I can imagine that it might help some people and there are plenty of cult followers who think it does. I don't own one and I'm not sure I'm likely to either, but I go have a mess around at the PGA superstore every now and again and it does feel a little different for me. My putter has about 45* toe hang and when I last got fit the fitter told me that was a good level for my stroke. That's very different from a LAB so perhaps not surprising it feels different.

[ChetlovesMer]

3 minutes ago, Ty_Webb said:

Youtube comments are not generally something I give a whole heap of weight to. 

I'm sorry. I may have been unclear. I was just mocking the youtube comment section and mocking the folks who believe the revealer is real physics. That's all. 

6 minutes ago, Ty_Webb said:

It's obviously possible to putt well with a regular putter. Putting comes down to can you pick the right line, get the speed right and then can you start the ball where you want to. If you do those things well, then you'll putt well 

We know, That's why we are mocking the people who believe in "the revealer". 

I'm just kidding around. 

[iacas]

55 minutes ago, Ty_Webb said:

Youtube comments are not generally something I give a whole heap of weight to. 

Dude.

49 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I'm sorry. I may have been unclear. I was just mocking the youtube comment section and mocking the folks who believe the revealer is real physics. That's all. 

We know, That's why we are mocking the people who believe in "the revealer". 

I'm just kidding around. 

Sheesh. 🙂 

[ChetlovesMer]

Okay, I had some time to kill between visiting customers today and I happened to be very close to a PGA SuperStore,

So, because I love beating a dead horse. I decided to try a bunch of putters again. I was not totally surprised to see that nearly every manufacturer has at least one model that is "torque balanced" or some variation there of. 

Today I decided to experiment by hitting some putts away from the center of the putter face. A few off the toe, a few off the heel. 

What I did was hit a couple of putts (normal) so that I felt pretty sure I could make the putt pretty easily and then I tried to make the putt hitting off the toe and tried to make it hitting it off the heel. (Yeah, It was very scientific.) 

From my very scientific data that I gathered today. I think that what ever Evnroll is doing to their putters does a much better job on toe hits and/or heel hits than does what ever LAB is doing with their zero-torque technology. 

If I was a person who hit the ball all over the putter face, I'd look at investing in an Evnroll (especially the Cleveland Evnroll M1 mallet). 

BTW - That crooked grip thing that LAB does is still annoying. I don't know if anyone out there likes that technology, but I freaking can't stand it. Put the freaking grip on straight! (I know, they do. There offer all of their putters with a proper grip which is put on correctly.) 

[rod7515]

This was a great read from start to finish. Ive been watching the LAB putters for 3 or 4 years now. Ive never been a good putter and Ive worked at putting but i just dont seem to get better at it. I play at least 3 times a week with a 11.6 Hdcp and i have owned probably 20+ putters over my last 10 years. Ive even tried the broomstick putters which at first I thought helped but as time went on i missed just as many putts. For me it comes down to nerves which i struggle to control when putting. I always feel like i have someone leaning over me watching my every move when i putt. I had a friend I play with this fall go get fitted for a LAB and he came back all excited, he bought one and he was already a player that probably averages 32 putts a round. So i think I would say hes a good putter. I used his putter a few times and the feeling i get compared to my putter which right now is a Ping Vault 2.0 Piper and just before that an Evnroll ER5v and before that Spyder Ghost........anyway the feeling I notice was that i can take the putter back without it twisting some. At least thats the feeling i get. I dont know if i would be a better putter with a LAB putter but after this year i will know as I went and was fitted and have one on the way. I can only hope it makes a differnce. If not ive got plenty of putters to fall back on! 

Rod

[dennyjones]

13 hours ago, rod7515 said:

This was a great read from start to finish. Ive been watching the LAB putters for 3 or 4 years now. Ive never been a good putter and Ive worked at putting but i just dont seem to get better at it. I play at least 3 times a week with a 11.6 Hdcp and i have owned probably 20+ putters over my last 10 years. Ive even tried the broomstick putters which at first I thought helped but as time went on i missed just as many putts. For me it comes down to nerves which i struggle to control when putting. I always feel like i have someone leaning over me watching my every move when i putt. I had a friend I play with this fall go get fitted for a LAB and he came back all excited, he bought one and he was already a player that probably averages 32 putts a round. So i think I would say hes a good putter. I used his putter a few times and the feeling i get compared to my putter which right now is a Ping Vault 2.0 Piper and just before that an Evnroll ER5v and before that Spyder Ghost........anyway the feeling I notice was that i can take the putter back without it twisting some. At least thats the feeling i get. I dont know if i would be a better putter with a LAB putter but after this year i will know as I went and was fitted and have one on the way. I can only hope it makes a differnce. If not ive got plenty of putters to fall back on! 

Rod

Keep us up to date with your findings, please.  I'm not looking for a putter, but I'm sure you're not alone in your venture to get the putts rolling better.

[saevel25]

13 hours ago, rod7515 said:

I had a friend I play with this fall go get fitted for a LAB and he came back all excited, he bought one and he was already a player that probably averages 32 putts a round. So i think I would say hes a good putter.

32 putts are average for a single digit handicap golfer. Limiting three putting is the biggest task. Speed control is the most important aspect of putting. Probably the 2nd most important is aim. 

14 hours ago, rod7515 said:

Anyway the feeling I notice was that i can take the putter back without it twisting some. At least thats the feeling i get. I dont know if i would be a better putter with a LAB putter but after this year i will know as I went and was fitted and have one on the way. I can only hope it makes a differnce. If not ive got plenty of putters to fall back on! 

The putter is going to rotate open a bit on the backstroke. It might stay square to the arc of the putting stroke, but that does mean the face opens up a bit on the backstroke when measured against where the face is oriented at address.

Go get a putter lesson as well.