Hackers & the advancement in golf equimpment

[Fourputt]

Both #s are questionable.....but I would believe the "half players can't break 100" is more reliable. Why? What % of golfers (who even play once a month) have a USGA handicap? Hard to tell..but I would guess low. As for the avg golfer not breaking 100. I can vouch for that. Just from playing people & because I volunteered as a starter at a local muni (9 hole course) so I used to watch a lot of people playing golf & if they were keeping an honest score I'd say less than 20% were breaking 50. Now I realize the avg golfer at a 9-hole muni might not be as good......but even when I have been paired with people at courses that cost $100 only about half played better than me.

Actually the 25.1% is an accurate statistic, straight from the USGA website. You can see the chart here:

Men's handicaps . Since they are the official handicapping agency in the US, they have the data to back it up. It's the other number that is hard to verify because how do you accurately track players who aren't returning scores if they just play then leave the course?

[juanrjackson]

One thing I just don't get, however, are the attitudes or belief that good players don't want to play with "hackers" or players with high handicaps. I do a lot of playing as a single, and when I used to suck at scoring I would still get a lot of invites from really good players to play again with them - i just tried to make sure I was fast, respectful of the game, and good company. And now that i've managed to get into single digits and play fairly consistently well, I have a lot of fun playing with people of all different abilities. It all comes down to personality, not score. If the definition of a hacker is someone who doesn't respect the game, is slow to play with, whines and grumbles constantly, and also shoots well over a 100 while acting like an ass, then yes - I don't like to play with hackers. But fortunately, my experience is that those people are in the minority, and instead I'm frequently treated to a delightful day of golf with a person who is interesting and good company, and perhaps they just happen to have to hit the ball a few times more than I do.

I agree...attitude is probably more important than score. Or maybe not even slow play. I have a good friend...but he plays extremely slow....he does everything from wanting to spend 10 mins looking for a lost ball..to taking 10 warmup swings...to lining up every put like it is forthe U.S. Open lol I used to play with him ever weekend....but rarely now.

[juanrjackson]

Actually the 25.1% is an accurate statistic, straight from the USGA website. You can see the chart here:

Even that stat is only realistic to a point. I knew people that played in leagues. They said sometimes they would not turn in good scores because they didn't want their handicap to go get better. So even those #s are only as good as the honest scores people are reporting.

[uttexas]

When playing golf, I don't care how good my playing partners are. I enjoy playing with people that play quickly, laugh, smile, and look like they are having fun.

[woodzie264]

I usually play around a 14 differential, (occassionally better, occassionally worse) with a current handicap of 11.3. I don't consider myself a hacker, but I definitely know I'm not great either; with that said, I couldn't care less how good my playing partners are - like so many have said, I'd rather play with those with positive energy than a those with a better handicap who get worked up about every bad shot

[Upchuck]

My Sunday foursome consists of 2 low handicappers, me & a guy eho had hard time breaking a 100. We always have a great time. I think slow play is the one thing that all golfers dislike. Also, beginners who start golfing on a tough, long courses. I started on a par 3 course, moved on to playing shorter courses & now am comfortable on any course. How about the guys who give you tips the whole round while shooting much worse than you. Work on your own game.

[O.B. Right]

I know you guys dislike playing with hackers...but the avg golfer is a hacker.

I am a total hacker and usually walk on as a single. If anybody I've ever been paired with has disliked playing with me because I'm a hacker, I can honestly say I haven't noticed. The people I get paired up with are usually encouraging and offer good advice - and have always been fun to play with. I have found, almost as a rule, the better the golfer the more gracious and encouraging they tend to be.

[DocWu1948]

The other day, I noticed some persimmon woods in the bin at the practice range and I tried out an old club. It had a metal shaft that was like spaghettii. I couldn't get a ball in the air with it at all. Last year, I walked on and played with a man who was over 80 years old who still used wooden woods. He could only hit them about 80 yards, but he got them in the air. He used the red tees. It was a nice day. The starter told me later that some people don't like being paired with him but I've played with worse players.

Anyway, thank goodness for modern gear.

[Shanks A Million]

I, for one, love playing with beginners and hackers. First, I like to play pretty slow, it's golf, not a race, I like to take my time. When I play with a hacker, I have lots of time in between shots to plan.

It's also fun to go out with someone just learning the game, because they have so much to learn and experience, they've never even seen a truly well struck long iron, or a 40 foot putt holed. They just marvel at every good shot you hit. I've hit awful shots that my playing partners thought were great! I've necked drivers like 180 yards and the hackers I were with would say, "wow, nice shot!" Makes me feel like a tour pro!

The last thing I like, is the chance to teach. I love it when people come to me for advice (I never give unsolicited advice). Teaching is learning, in golf or any other game or hobby.

[Joeyvee]

This reminds me of when my boss saw my surfboard once and said "oh no.. youre a surfer" and I said "No, I do surf though." Am I a golfer? I dunno. I do go to the range and read about and watch golf and hit the course as much as i can afford to right now.. I like playing with my friends who suck and hit 100+ and dont really keep a good count and play a foot wedge once in a while and take mulligans. Its a fun game with them. but I do take it seriously enough to try to play with better golfers who DO keep score and play every shot no matter how bad the lie etc.. I play much better when my group takes it seriously.

[zrlaegel]

Do you enjoy golfing? If yes, then to hell with everyone else. i remember not to long ago when i was like that. the only reason Im not now is cause i practiced my ass off. if i stopped practicing. i would be right @ a 15-20 handicap again. the only thing i dont like is slow play. and unsolicited advice from someone who two holes earlier just sliced it into the woods and made triple. Just have fun man.

[Leftygolfer]

I walk on a bunch. I don't care if you are terrible or not. I enjoy watching good players play and the competition. I am not like that. I used to suck terribly and I treat people with respect. Just play fast.

[Greg]

As my posted handicap would suggest, I would fall into the "hacker" category. I dont really even know what my handicap really is, I average usually in the mid to upper 40's for 9 holes and lucky to break 100 for 18 so thats where i got it from, I only play 18 maybe once a month, usually just 9 at a time. I think the only time I get frustrated is slow play. I try to play fast as Im usually alone, around here at the courses I play they'll let you play alone. On the weekends ill join a friend or 2 that I play with a lot, one is about at the same level as me and the other one is probably somewhere in the teens as on handicap. He'd probably be a single digit handicap but doesnt get to play or practice very often due to having 3 young children at home, lucky to play 2-3 times a month, usually the only time he ever plays is when i come see him on weekends. Im wildly inconsistent, Ill hit great shots and bad shots sometimes consecutively on the same hole, usually bogey is a good score for me with maybe a par or 2 every 9. I just dont have the time or money to invest in a lot of practice or lessons. Ive been playing for about 2 years now, i wish i had started years ago but just didnt have any interest then. But this is a sport where you can play your whole life, even as a very old man I see myself out there trying to improve and keep playing. I see other people especially on weekends that struggle to simply make a decent swipe at the ball and realize not too long ago thats what i looked like. Everyone struggles at first, its keeping at it that gets you better. Yes equipment can help to some degree, I couldnt imagine hitting old clubs from the 70's or earlier, no forgiveness in those.

[Fourputt]

Everyone struggles at first, its keeping at it that gets you better. Yes equipment can help to some degree,

Now you know what it was like for guys like me. You really had to be dedicated to stay with it. Wooden woods and blade irons, and no swing to speak of, made for a sharp learning curve. I never even thought of taking a lesson during that period either.... but persistence paid off and I survived to the era of game improvement equipment.

[Greg]

Now you know what it was like for guys like me. You really had to be dedicated to stay with it. Wooden woods and blade irons, and no swing to speak of, made for a sharp learning curve. I never even thought of taking a lesson during that period either.... but persistence paid off and I survived to the era of game improvement equipment.

I watch those old matches sometimes late at night/early morning as I work at night. I remember once they had Palmer, Player, and one other guy playing. The swings then were even affected by the equipment and these were the best players in the world at the time. I remember Nicklaus commenting on why on why he had to arch his back so much and it was to simply get the ball in the air due to what was new equipment then. Even then, Arnold hit a 330 yard drive on one hole, just imagine how far he would have hit it with modern equipment in his prime. Guess goes to show how good those players really were.

[Fat Slice]

Most of the time I don't play as well as the people with me. Sometimes I play better than the random people I get thrown in with. I always try to be polite and friendly no matter what. One of the worst hackers I ever played with turned out to be the head of a tax agency that had been mistakenly yet unyieldingly screwing my company over for years. Gab gab gab, putt putt putt, laugh laugh laugh, and after 18 the tax thing got fixed. End of story. Golf is more than scoring.

[Shanks A Million]

I watch those old matches sometimes late at night/early morning as I work at night. I remember once they had Palmer, Player, and one other guy playing. The swings then were even affected by the equipment and these were the best players in the world at the time. I remember Nicklaus commenting on why on why he had to arch his back so much and it was to simply get the ball in the air due to what was new equipment then. Even then, Arnold hit a 330 yard drive on one hole, just imagine how far he would have hit it with modern equipment in his prime. Guess goes to show how good those players really were.

Not much further. The actual distance on a dead center hit has not increased all that much. The longest drive ever recorded in a PGA event was hit with a persimmon wood.

[colin007]

Not on any course I play you can't, and certainly not when I'm working as the starter. The ranger will regroup you if you try it. If I pair up 2 twosomes to make a full foursome, they had better still be a foursome at the turn, or they will be grouped together again before they tee off on 10. And the ranger will be watching them the rest of the back 9. If you don't want to play with someone, tell the starter. He'll be happy to let you wait until there is another opening... maybe another couple of hours. When the course is busy all you do is back it up worse by splitting and creating 2 groups where there should be only one. If the people you are playing with are slow, then educate them. If they don't take the hint then call the shop and have the ranger sent over. You don't have the right to do your own pairing, that's what starter has a tee sheet for.

we need more starters like you around here, get the slow players the F off the course...

It happens all the time around here and if any ranger tried that BS on me, you can bet that would be a course I wouldnt play at again. Theres plenty of golf courses in this world who would be more than happy to get my business.

good riddance. if you cant follow the directions of the starter then you need to go.