"Releasing the club"

[Shanks A Million]

Funny, but I'm actually having trouble with this. I can't seem to let it release without flipping the club. My whole body hangs on, and turns violently and my right foot is getting pulled forward. If I don't do that, I flip the club, and my hands are only about 3" in front of the ball around impact, then I scoop up and cup my left wrist just after impact. I can't seem to release my arms without flipping the club. Does anyone have any drills to get the arms forward, but the club to still lag?

[iacas]

You should pick up a Pure Ball Striker.

BTW, 3" isn't bad. It's not great, but it's not bad. You don't want excessive shaft lean, after all.

You could also do the flying wedge drill with an acquired motion length stroke. With or without the PBS.

[Shanks A Million]

You should pick up a Pure Ball Striker.

The shaft lean is ok... at

imapct . Therein lies the issue, it flips quickly after impact. The left arm then proceeds to hold off the club and bend, certainly more than it should. In essence, it bends up instead of the club turning over and the arm bending the other way... if you get what I mean. I might be able to get a video up soon.

[uttexas]

Martin Hall on release

[iacas]

The shaft lean is ok... at

Are you speaking generally or saying that your shaft lean at impact is okay?

I was simply saying that 3" is okay (almost too much with the driver, not enough with the wedge, plenty for a long iron) and you don't want to get into a situation where you have too much shaft lean. It's almost as bad as too little.

Therein lies the issue, it flips quickly after impact. The left arm then proceeds to hold off the club and bend, certainly more than it should. In essence, it bends up instead of the club turning over and the arm bending the other way... if you get what I mean. I might be able to get a video up soon.

I get it.

I'd do a basic motion practice swing and then hit balls with an acquired motion length swing (right forearm parallel to parallel) focusing on keeping the right forearm flying wedge (RFFW), flat left wrist (FLW), and LONG arms. Straight arms. Never swing past when your arm wants to start to bend. Your right arm should be able to reach roughly horizontal and the clubhead will feel like it's still pointing straight down at the ground (feel - it won't be, you just want to make sure it's not horizontal or past horizontal). Basically, these should be the top of your backswing and your finish positions:

[Stretch]

If you've ever played cricket, you'll know that's an absolutely cracking cover drive right there!

I like this one. Does take a while to get to the meat, but worth sticking with.

[Shanks A Million]

Are you speaking generally or saying that your shaft lean at impact is okay?

I know what you mean, because the strike feels so effortless with that shaft lean, but it seems like if I try to overdo it, it actually feels worse.

I'll try the drill again, hopefully I can stay on plane now. I have been trying a swing thought where my only effort is to get the club to the top, then let it do its own thing from there. That really helps with long clubs. I am able to get it on a better plane with that lazy drop in move, a-la Couples. I've seen the Martin Hall video, I love it. I've posted it here as well. My problem is that I never seem to get to that position, I hold the club off, and my left arm bends. I've fixed so many problems with my swing over the years, I know I can do this!

[Zeph]

It's my biggest pet peeve in my swing, that damned flipping. I've tried PBS, but found that I had trouble distinguishing between when the PBS lags and put pressure on my finger, and when the hand and finger flip and put pressure on the PBS.

Lynn Blake explained it well in a video. He said the problem was that you are supposed to extend the arms (right) without extending the right wrist. In most sports where you throw something, you always extend the wrist while extending the right arm. Golf is opposite land where you don't extend the right wrist when the right arm straightens.

I've got some good and some bad stuff going on in my swing, but I know that with that same swing, I can hit 2 inches behind the ball or 2 inches in front of it. It's all a matter of timing the flip. So whenever the snow goes away and courses open (hello March/May), I'll put some serious effort into that single issue. Because I can do everything perfectly, but without that part, I can keep hitting it poor all day long, year around.

I don't know how, but of course I've gathered a lot of drills and tips over the last 2-3 years that will be tested. What Lynn said was helpful because it explained very in a few words what you should do and why it's so difficult. He talked about educating the muscles to learn that the right wrist does not release when the right arm straightens. Hitting from sand or something else that severly punish you from flipping can be helpful.

Lastly I can mention that I did experience some good results once when focusing on the follow through, not impact or before impact. Trying to get into the nice positions you see good players do (like the angle Erik lined up on the photo above). I like to think of it like driving a car. The farther ahead you look, the smoother you can steer the car. By focusing on the position a while after the ball, the body will automatically do something to prevent you from doing what you normally do.

[jamo]

The drill that I do with a stick taped to my club has really helped me. It gets you to swing with next to no flip (left wrist cupping) or rolling of the wrists, otherwise a stick hits you in the gut.

[Shanks A Million]

It's my biggest pet peeve in my swing...

True, all of that. My flip comes post impact, so it's not hurting me as much as it could, but it still annoys me. The followthrough is just wrong. The left arm just never looks right.

[TourSpoon]

The drill that I do with a stick taped to my club has really helped me. It gets you to swing with next to no flip (left wrist cupping) or rolling of the wrists, otherwise a stick hits you in the gut.

Yep...that's a good one...also the old hockey stick drill works too (also works with a broom).

[Open-Faced Club Sandwedge]

True, all of that. My flip comes post impact, so it's not hurting me as much as it could, but it still annoys me. The followthrough is just wrong. The left arm just never looks right.

Ever play tennis? If not, then maybe this tip will be irrelevant, but I used to play tennis, and when I did I played with a one-hand backhand. A one-handed backhand in tennis is a lot like a left-arm-only swing for a right-handed golfer. The power comes from the body rotation and the extension of the arm, and you can't flip it, or the shot will be a powerless pull. The momentum of the racket though impact, which could cup your wrist if you were doing it wrong, ends up rolling the racket. The wrist supinates to allow the racket to follow through unchecked (no "holding off"), and the arm stays extended into the follow-through.

Even if you've never played tennis, I bet you can picture the kind of motion I'm talking about. The golf club lags way behind the hands on the downswing, and mostly catches up to the hands for impact. There's no choice but for it to outrace the hands immediately after impact. The lest wrist, if it's not going to cup to allow the club to outrace it, has to roll (and eventually cock). Practicing just that part of the motion may be what you need. -Andrew

[Robato]

Thought about your prob for a while. When you say 'violently,' I imagined that you might be swinging too hard. I'm always trying to get that forward shaft lean and face turnover to go correctly in my swing, and today at the range I did it quite well by just swinging less hard. WAY less hard. If a golfer takes the club back almost parallel, and arrives at the ball with forward shaft lean, and enough lag, then it doesnt have to have any violent action to it. I mean, even it I were to swing the club wrong and make a mistake in the path, the speed would be too smooth for there to be any jerk-like motion anyways. So I say make a drill where you swing slower, like you are showing off the best form you could. Let the club do the work, dont worry about distance, feel the accuracy come, and I hope that might help.

[TourSpoon]

Shanks...pick up a copy of the Impact Zone...great read and is specific to this topic. It was the best $15 that I have spent in a long time.

[Shanks A Million]

Ever play tennis? If not, then maybe this tip will be irrelevant, but I used to play tennis, and when I did I played with a one-hand backhand. A one-handed backhand in tennis is a lot like a left-arm-only swing for a right-handed golfer. The power comes from the body rotation and the extension of the arm, and you can't flip it, or the shot will be a powerless pull. The momentum of the racket though impact, which could cup your wrist if you were doing it wrong, ends up rolling the racket. The wrist supinates to allow the racket to follow through unchecked (no "holding off"), and the arm stays extended into the follow-through.

I played tennis for many years in late elementary and middle school, so I do get it. I've considered a lot of opinions, but the problem seems to be stemming from a deeper issue, shallow hands. I'm feeling like the club is coming too much back inside after impact, instead of "releasing" outside.

To be honest, every time I feel bad, I go back a month or two and look at my swing. The amount of progress being made day to day is just unbelievable. What used to be a flat backwing, past parallel, flip, with a finish position that looked like a knockdown at best, I've come a long way. My working on a deep hands drill has seemed to actually help this problem a bit. Only real problem, the deeper the hands, the more inside out the swing generally, which means big pushes and hooks.

[sean_miller]

It's my biggest pet peeve in my swing, that damned flipping. I've tried PBS, but found that I had trouble distinguishing between when the PBS lags and put pressure on my finger, and when the hand and finger flip and put pressure on the PBS.

Not on topic, but the "Pure BS" training device sure seems to be popular.

Another thread here got me practicing something late in the season. Place a tee in line with my ball. After hitting the ball, check the depth of the divot. The best strikes (for me) had a shallow divot starting a couple inches in font of the tee, and bottoming out 5-6 inches in front of the tee.

[Stretch]

Not on topic, but the "Pure BS" training device sure seems to be popular.

I see what you did there.