Tiger Wants to Ban the Long Putter

[Elvisliveson]

Quote:

Originally Posted by topspin4hand

"ban the illegal drivers"  ??   I don't get this comment about drivers that are already illegal.

Me neither. Something that is declared illegal is, by definition, banned.

[newtogolf]

You're right on, the belly putter isn't an advantage for everyone, only for those who can't putt as well with a traditional putter.  Bradley won a Major using one, could he have won it with a conventional putter that didn't allow him to anchor it to his body?  If he couldn't, then it provided him with an advantage.

I compare it to letting guys whose natural swing doesn't generate as much spin as their competitors to use the older grooves.  When equipment can be pointed to as the cause for someone performining at an equal or higher level, the equipment is providing them with an advantage.  If someone can't compete with a standard putter because of the yips then they maybe they don't belong at the pro level any longer.

Originally Posted by zipazoid

The talking heads at the AT&T; were talking about the long putter yesterday, and the conclusion they drew is, the genie's out of the lamp now & can't be put back in, that it's been around too long to ban. They also opined that if the long putter was indeed such an advantage then why isn't everyone using it?

I don't agree with either point.

To the first, who cares about longevity? The smaller 'British ball' was used for years on the European Tour before it was banned for tournament play. Where was the outcry about how long it was being used?

To the second, obviously it is not an advantage for everyone. Personally, I tried the long putter and it just feels goofy to me. But I got a good putting stroke. So does Ben Crenshaw, far better than mine, and he decries the long putter as well. It has traditionally been the mode of desperation for those that can't putt the traditional way - Bernhard Langer & Orville Moody being good examples. But more recently the younger players like Keegan Bradley are using it. What does that say?

Well, to me it says they've found a shortcut. Anchor the club in your belly & it stabilizes the stroke & removes nerves. And that is the reason it should be banned.

Not banning the long putter, but banning any kind of anchoring of a club against the body. If your stroke is getting twitchy, figure out a way to remove the twitches without using the body as a crutch. In my case, in my early 40s I got that middle-age twitch/yip. Know how I fixed it? I tried crosshand, claw, looking at the hole, choking down so the grip was against my wrist. Anything except anchoring. I found a grip that works - it takes my left hand (I'm left-handed) out of the stroke so it can twitch all it wants without affecting the stroke.

So anchoring is too much of a magic pill that eliminates hard work. That, more than anything, should be reason enough to banning it - one week a guy can't make a four-footer & two weeks later he's rolling everything in with a 52-inch hockey stick stuck in his chest with his elbow flared out. It looks ugly, and it is. Ban it.

[WWBDD]

Originally Posted by sammie

The long or belly putter can be dated back to the 1930′s and now more golfers are winning so lets ban them. How about the drivers and golf balls that many people think are illegal. How about the tight lies hybrids that cut through the rough like a machete. I thought hitting in the rough was a was 1/2 shot penalty, now it is bonus in some shots. Now people have a whole set of hybrids, no irons, you want to talk about cheating.

You have a whole generation of golfers young and old that have used these long putters for years, now we going to say no. In a time when golf couses are hurting for players and you want to limit the use of equipment that has always been legal.

Leo Diegal was using this method of belly putting back in the 30′s. He won majors.  80 plus years it has been around, Johnny Miller, Rocco the list is endless. Billy Casper anchored his arm to his left leg. Were each USGA committees and R&A; committees wrong for so many years.

Finally, there is no grandfathering and no two sets of rules for Pros and amateurs. So one thing I believe is certain, if you outlaw these putters on the pro tours, amateurs won’t touch them and the long putter industry is done. Thus maybe losing more golfers.

I don't disagree with most of your arguments, but I can't remember the last time I saw a long putter at a local golf course.

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by sammie

If we ban the long putter, I think we should ban the illegal drivers and easy shortcut hybrids as well.

Which 'illegal' drivers do you speak of?

And 'easy shortcut hybrids'..?

I'm going to take a stab at what I think you meant. Newer drivers have a trampoline effect on the clubface, and I believe the USGA has put limits on how much faces can trampoline. Are you saying do away with that altogether? Then let's go back to persimmon.

Re hybrids. No doubt they are easier to hit than long irons, but explain to me how they're a shortcut? They basically took a 3-wood head, made it smaller, and added loft. It's a golf club that is swung like every other golf club.

This contrasts to anchoring a long putter. That fundamentally changes the definition of of golf swing, or stroke. That's why I said, don't worry about the length of the club - shit, putt with a 6-foot-long putter for all I care. But no anchoring. That's what changes things.

[sean_miller]

Ban oversized drivers and perimiter weighted irons too - cheatin' bastids!!!

[Shorty]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Ban oversized drivers and perimiter weighted irons too - cheatin' bastids!!!

I won't play with anyone who uses anything other than a Bullseye© style putter.

Anser style putters are a quick fix for people who can't putt, and steel shafted drivers take the artistry out of the game.

Sure.... I could buy a hybrid and knock 6 shots off my game, but I couldn't live with myself.

[Domenic]

okay so we're all back to persimmon woods, and hickory shafted blades.

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by Domenic

okay so we're all back to persimmon woods, and hickory shafted blades.

And gutta-percha balls.

[sammie]

What do you think I meant. The big faced legal drivers that should be illegal.  Not to mention the club shafts that are out of control. My point is if we are going to addrees the long putter, lets do them all. You want to ban long putters fine, but lets ban the big faced drivers, with the graphite shaft and the out of control golf balls.

[WWBDD]

Originally Posted by sammie

... lets ban the big faced drivers, with the graphite shaft and the out of control golf balls.

They have ... it's just a matter of degree.

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by sammie

What do you think I meant. The big faced legal drivers that should be illegal.  Not to mention the club shafts that are out of control. My point is if we are going to addrees the long putter, lets do them all. You want to ban long putters fine, but lets ban the big faced drivers, with the graphite shaft and the out of control golf balls.

I don't know. That's why I asked.

I don't agree with "if we are going to address the long putter, lets do them all" because the others are just advances in technology, which have been addressed. You think manufacturers are making the longest possible driver or ball? They're not. They're making the longest possible legal driver or ball. The USGA/R&A; control that. So maybe what you're looking for is stricter limits on technology. For example, the largest allowed clubhead size is 460cc. They could dial that back to 420cc, 380cc, whatever. They could also ban (or reduce) trampoline effect. But I don't think they should. Because the integrity of the game remains - you still have to make a good swing. The swing doesn't change.

But anchoring the putter against your body (again, I'm not for banning long putters - I'm for banning anchoring) isn't a technology advancement. It's a way someone thought of to shortcut. Not much different from when Snead used to putt croquet-style back in the 60's. And as soon as he started making putts, they banned it. As they should with anchoring.

[walk18]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

Ban oversized drivers and perimiter weighted irons too - cheatin' bastids!!!

Originally Posted by Domenic

okay so we're all back to persimmon woods, and hickory shafted blades.

Originally Posted by zipazoid

And gutta-percha balls.

Originally Posted by sammie

What do you think I meant. The big faced legal drivers that should be illegal.  Not to mention the club shafts that are out of control. My point is if we are going to addrees the long putter, lets do them all. You want to ban long putters fine, but lets ban the big faced drivers, with the graphite shaft and the out of control golf balls.

Are any of these things anchored to the body? Why is this so hard for people to understand?

[bplewis24]

I think at least one of them was being sarcastic :)

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by bplewis24

I think at least one of them was being sarcastic :)

I dunno. I can really control a gutta-percha.

[sammie]

It is not difficult for me to understand anchoring. I have qualified for state opens and state amateurs events. I know  the game and follow the history closely. What you guys don't understand is anchoring has gone on for years in different degrees. Players have anchored the putter grips to their forearms and anchor their  elbows to the body. Billy Casper a well know great putter anchored his left arm to his leg. Then we need to review all anchoring. Where do you stop the anchoring. If you guys think it as simple as the club cannot touch your body then you are naive about that. You can anchor the long putter by anchoring you left elbow to your body but the club and hand do not touch the body, that works just as well. Once agaon I respect  your opinions but the topic of anchoring is not just black and white there are so many grey areas.

[LuciusWooding]

Oh man, guys, I think I've been anchoring my putter to my hands... In fact I do that with all my clubs. Is that the way the game is meant to be played?

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by sammie

It is not difficult for me to understand anchoring. I have qualified for state opens and state amateurs events. I know  the game and follow the history closely. What you guys don't understand is anchoring has gone on for years in different degrees. Players have anchored the putter grips to their forearms and anchor their  elbows to the body. Billy Casper a well know great putter anchored his left arm to his leg. Then we need to review all anchoring. Where do you stop the anchoring. If you guys think it as simple as the club cannot touch your body then you are naive about that. You can anchor the long putter by anchoring you left elbow to your body but the club and hand do not touch the body, that works just as well. Once agaon I respect  your opinions but the topic of anchoring is not just black and white there are so many grey areas.

Thanks for the resume. I believe you know your stuff. I trust you will believe I do too so I will dispense with my resume.

So now that we've established we both know what we're talking about...

Anchoring against the forearm vs the body is totally different. And anchoring one body part against another body part is totally different.

Different from what?

From anchoring the club against the body.

So the rule change would be simple - At address, no part of the club can touch any part of the body except the hands or forearms. Nothing above the elbow.

A more drastic rule would be nothing above the wrist.

Simple.

[bplewis24]

Originally Posted by LuciusWooding

Oh man, guys, I think I've been anchoring my putter to my hands... In fact I do that with all my clubs. Is that the way the game is meant to be played?

Duh.