How good are hybrids, really?

[Kieran123]

I used to play 3H, 4H, and 5H.

Now I only use a 3H but want to drop my 4 iron for a hybrid this season.

In my experience, they are easier to hit, go further ( and higher, which can be a bad thing ). I can cut and draw just as much as I can with my irons. Better out of the rough, but they can balloon a bit

Better players say they may not be able to shape the ball as much - but that ain't me.

Just don't hit them like woods and you'll be fine. Hit them like irons.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by Kieran123

I used to play 3H, 4H, and 5H.

Now I only use a 3H but want to drop my 4 iron for a hybrid this season.

In my experience, they are easier to hit, go further ( and higher, which can be a bad thing ). I can cut and draw just as much as I can with my irons. Better out of the rough, but they can balloon a bit

Better players say they may not be able to shape the ball as much - but that ain't me.

Just don't hit them like woods and you'll be fine. Hit them like irons.

You have to hit them like irons, but therein lies the rub, A player struggling to hit long irons because he doesn't know how to hit them properly is supposed to magically take a solid 2-iron swing with his new 2-hybrid. Good luck. Hybrids are easier to hit for beginners, but proper technique is still required for hitting the ball off the turf with a low lofted club.

[dec7golf]

i think you need to try different options to find a good fit. i used several hybrids and found them (probably through poor technique) to hook a bit .. or to travel too high

recently changed to mizuno mp hybrids that are a little open, and centre of gravity a little higher and they are great.

currently play a 17 degree and 20 degree, then 4 iron.

dont carry any fairway woods at the moment, 17 degree is proving to be long enough

[Stretch]

Its not a holy war, man. If you can mint a 2 iron, more power to you. Personal preference is ultimately going to depend on individual swing characteristics*, but I think it's fair to venture that hybrids generally tend to work better than long irons for lower swing speed players and lower ball hitters. I would also argue that they are on balance harder to disastrously mishit when swung equally crappily.

* (Additionally, please note that past performance is no guarantee of future returns and that this opinion is void where prohibited.)

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by Stretch

Its not a holy war, man. If you can mint a 2 iron, more power to you. Personal preference is ultimately going to depend on individual swing characteristics*, but I think it's fair to venture that hybrids generally tend to work better than long irons for lower swing speed players and lower ball hitters. I would also argue that they are on balance harder to disastrously mishit when swung equally crappily.

* (Additionally, please note that past performance is no guarantee of future returns and that this opinion is void where prohibited.)

You play your game and I'll continue to balk at someone (e.g. a couple posters and Butch) telling me how to play mine.

My point in my reply to Kieran was that people buying hybrid irons still need to learn proper contact. Everyone (or so it seems) says to "hit down on them like an iron". That's somewhat vague and potentially false. I have hybrids that do not give give the best results when swung like the iron they replace. For best results I swing them more like a fairway wood. And yes, my [probably misguided] confidence in a 2-iron is probably about as relevant to a beginner's setup as a 4-capper's lack of confidence when faced with forced carries.

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

You play your game and I'll continue to balk at someone (e.g. a couple posters and Butch) telling me how to play mine.

My point in my reply to Kieran was that people buying hybrid irons still need to learn proper contact. Everyone (or so it seems) says to "hit down on them like an iron". That's somewhat vague and potentially false. I have hybrids that do not give give the best results when swung like the iron they replace. For best results I swing them more like a fairway wood. And yes, my [probably misguided] confidence in a 2-iron is probably about as relevant to a beginner's setup as a 4-capper's lack of confidence when faced with forced carries.

Yes, you still need to learn proper contact - that goes without saying - it's fundamental in golf.

But if I hit the ball close to the toe on a 2 iron, my hands will rattle and the ball will flutter. If I toe it with a hybrid - the forgiveness is there. Sure, I will lose distance and accuracy - but the ball will probably leave the ground somewhat, unlike a 2 iron.

I have always had best results swinging my hybrids like irons, not like fairway woods because the shaft is so much shorter. But if it works for people to sweep the ball, then it works, and I'm not gonna argue with it.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by Kieran123

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

You play your game and I'll continue to balk at someone (e.g. a couple posters and Butch) telling me how to play mine.

My point in my reply to Kieran was that people buying hybrid irons still need to learn proper contact. Everyone (or so it seems) says to "hit down on them like an iron". That's somewhat vague and potentially false. I have hybrids that do not give give the best results when swung like the iron they replace. For best results I swing them more like a fairway wood. And yes, my [probably misguided] confidence in a 2-iron is probably about as relevant to a beginner's setup as a 4-capper's lack of confidence when faced with forced carries.

Yes, you still need to learn proper contact - that goes without saying - it's fundamental in golf.

But if I hit the ball close to the toe on a 2 iron, my hands will rattle and the ball will flutter. If I toe it with a hybrid - the forgiveness is there. Sure, I will lose distance and accuracy - but the ball will probably leave the ground somewhat, unlike a 2 iron.

I have always had best results swinging my hybrids like irons, not like fairway woods because the shaft is so much shorter. But if it works for people to sweep the ball, then it works, and I'm not gonna argue with it.

I'll certainly try to swing my 2h like a 2-iron again this season, but I suspect the reason it hasn't worked because of the shaft - need some with a stiffer tip (lower torque?). If [almost] everyone agrees it's how it's done, maybe I have the wrong equipment.

Your description of a mishit and fluttering long iron versus a similar shot with a hybrid is actually one reason I shy away from them. Sometimes a poorly struck ball that goes 150 yards bouncing its way down the middle of the fairway or one that flutters its way the right rough is preferable to one that banana slices or snap hooks into the trees. We all have our own fears. For some it's carries and for me its the ball taking a 90 degree detour. Actually now that I've commented on it, I'll probably struggle with forced carries this year. Stupid karma.

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

I'll certainly try to swing my 2h like a 2-iron again this season, but I suspect the reason it hasn't worked because of the shaft - need some with a stiffer tip (lower torque?). If [almost] everyone agrees it's how it's done, maybe I have the wrong equipment.

Everyone swings differently - and I would assume that plays a big part.

The hybrids I've owned are stiff shafted, have no idea about the torque on them ( stock shafts )

My SS for my driver is around 112ish ( I think yours is similar? ) - but you are hitting a different club so that's irrelevant

[Blacksheep]

I own two Hybrids. Both are older Hogan Edge hybrids, and I hit them better only becuse of the carry distance I get out of them. I normally hit my 3 iron about 210. But, not all of that is carry distance.I play a course that has a couple of holes where you have got to carry large water holes in front of par 5 greens. The hybrids allow me to carry over the water and the bunkers that guard the front of the green. Before I would just lay up if in that range. I've tried the newer hybrids , but hit them about the same as my older Hogans tha I paid a total of $35 for.

[JCoop]

I just started playing golf last year and have Tommy Armor 3i-9i in the bag. I love those clubs! By the end of the season (damned winter....) I was wishing I had a 2i. The irons just feel natural to me. But maybe I should try a hybrid or two this year just to see what all the fuss is about.

[rustyredcab]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

...  A couple guys (including me) were questioning the logic that every amateur should ditch his long to mid irons because Butch Harmons says so. ...

I think you lump me in with those who say it is logical to ditch the long irons.

1. It is not because Butch said it that I share the belief. My current teaching pros agree. Every teacher I've had agrees. And my observations and experience agree.

2. I never said every amateur should ditch his long irons. I said all but accomplished players and crazy people should replace their long irons with hybrids. And BTW, some of my best friends are crazy. I'm all for crazy golfers doing crazy things.

When most of us have long iron distance left, we are just trying to get the ball on the correct section of the green or even just somewhere on the green. If you are a mid handicapper and can do that most of the time with a 3-iron, you'll do it even more often when you learn to hit a hybrid that fits you. Now if you like to work that 190 yard shot right, left, high, or low depending on the situation, and you expect to be in birdie range almost every time, you are an accomplished player and may benefit from the added workability of a 3-iron.

There is one other good reason to carry a 3-iron as a high handicapper. When I was a young man and a 27 handicap, I was lucky enough to play one of the hardest course in the US (the version you'll see at this year when you watch the Ryder Cup has had 1000 trees removed over the years). I played from the woods on most second and many third shots and found that a 3-iron was my most used club after the putter. As a punch out club, it was great at keeping the ball under the trees. Driver, 3-iron, 3-iron, 9-iron, wedge, putt, putt, putt... "Put me down for another eight."

[Domenic]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

You have to hit them like irons, but therein lies the rub, A player struggling to hit long irons because he doesn't know how to hit them properly is supposed to magically take a solid 2-iron swing with his new 2-hybrid. Good luck. Hybrids are easier to hit for beginners, but proper technique is still required for hitting the ball off the turf with a low lofted club.

precisely, it's not a magic wand, just like the belly putter. they simply make it easier in some cases. Like that foreign dude from Callaway with the painters hats dropped his hybrids becasue his irons blended better. Same as Bill Haas, and he plays MB's!

[clubchamp]

Originally Posted by Domenic

precisely, it's not a magic wand, just like the belly putter. they simply make it easier in some cases. Like that foreign dude from Callaway with the painters hats dropped his hybrids becasue his irons blended better. Same as Bill Haas, and he plays MB's!

Comparing pro's to average golfers is pointless since most of them hit long irons fairly solid and don't deal with the swing issues of an average golfer. Hybrids are in most cases easier to hit but you still need a decent swing to hit them well. It's like anything else with golf if it works for you, great, I carry 2 hybrids because they fill a yardage gap and I like the ball flight. I've played with guys who carry hybrids all the way up to a 6i and one of them shot in the high 70s again it works for them.

[Laws of Woo]

I have yet to find a hybrid that I like more so than my long irons. I hit my 3 and 4 irons well and really haven't found a need for a hybrid yet. When I picked up my new set of irons last year, it came 4-GW and I had a hard time tracking down the 3 iron. Before I eventually found one, I tried several hybrids and the majority of them didn't suit my eye (too big and/or too much offset) so weren't even struck. The Adams Pro Black and Pro A12 were really the only ones that stood out, but not enough to stop looking for the 3 iron. Found the 3 iron to match my set and I'm very happy with it so far. May yet put a hybrid in my bag, but only in place of a 2 iron as they're getting more and more hard to find.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by rustyredcab

Quote:

Originally Posted by sean_miller

...  A couple guys (including me) were questioning the logic that every amateur should ditch his long to mid irons because Butch Harmons says so. ...

. . .  if you like to work that 190 yard shot right, left, high, or low depending on the situation, and you expect to be in birdie range almost every time, you are an accomplished player and may benefit from the added workability of a 3-iron.

When I play a course that has reachable par 5s with forced carries, I do sometimes drop my 3 or 4-iron in favour of a 3-hybrid, but I still probably carry a 2-iron because I know I can trust it off the tee on tight holes.  BTW - from 190, I'm probably reaching for a 6-iron and the only time I "expect" a birdie is when I'm on in 2 on a par 5, and even then I can live with a par.

[mdl]

As other's have said, it's a personal thing, and I have to disagree with the sentiment that only low single digit cappers should play a 4i, even a 5i.  I hit my 2h much better than my 3i (they're only 1˚ apart, my set's strongly lofted), so I rarely hit my 3i, but I hit my 4i WAY better than my 3i and some days it's one of my best irons.  I haven't ever gamed a 4h, so I don't know for sure it's true I couldn't find a 4h I hit even better, but given that I have days where I'm bad off the tee and my scoring irons aren't working and hitting 4i into some longer par 3s gives me some needed pars and sometimes a birdie, I take some exception to the idea that I'm just an arrogant mid-capper who doesn't realize what's good for him.

[Goodfella]

I hated my hybrids at first, but now that I figured out how to hit them I love them. I have a 3 and 4 hybrid. They are hard at first and take practice to hit well.

[k-troop]

Everyone has a different opinion of hybrids:  what they're good for, whether they work like irons or woods, etc.  IMO, that's because all hybrids are different.  If we were all playing the same hybrid, we might all have similar opinions (at least about what kind of impact produces the best shot).