iacas

Erik Hitting a Few Chips and Pitches

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The sequel to http://thesandtrap.com/t/39411/quickie-pitching-video

Here's a video showing me hitting a few chips and pitches (about 4 chips and 8 pitches).

If you have questions, please let me know.

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Nice.  There are a few things in there that I never really thought about.  I can see where I have been doing a couple of things wrong in the past.

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Really good demonstration.  Note how soft the motion is and how Erik let's the club "fall" as he hit those pitch shots.  Still has some shaft lean at impact but not adding any thrust with the right arm.

These shots can be really fun to practice and help you save some shots.  Make sure the weight is forward, hinge the wrist and let the club head swing.

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Originally Posted by TN94z

Nice.  There are a few things in there that I never really thought about.  I can see where I have been doing a couple of things wrong in the past.

Thanks. Any specifics? It would interest me to know what was new to you or made you think.

Originally Posted by mvmac

Really good demonstration.  Note how soft the motion is and how Erik let's the club "fall" as he hit those pitch shots.  Still has some shaft lean at impact but not adding any thrust with the right arm.

Yes, the "falling" clubhead is mostly what causes that right wrist to lose the angle. I'm not actively "throwing" much. Maybe a little bit but not much. It's primarily a result of feeling gravity and letting the weight of the clubhead fall as I pivot.

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Good instruction.

Is it possible to hit low chip shots using bounce w/o opening the face?  I've found that when I'm trying to chip the ball at times I can have bad results if I hit it just a touch fat when the leading edge digs in.  Something that I do on chips is going down in loft and opening the face so I can use the bounce but still have it come out flat.

Also, I've been for years playing all my pitches with a slightly to severely open stance/open face to use the bounce as much as possible.  Would playing a wedge with more bounce allow me to use the same swing more square? I'm an avid bouncer (for lack of better word).

Final question.  How do you decide what shot you want to hit in real situations.  I've heard (which I think is bad advice) get the ball on the ground quickly as possible.  I try to paint a picture of what I want to happen and just feel the swing that will produce that shot.  Sometimes pitching it to the hole looks right, others a driving pitch seems to look good.  My biggest determinant of exactly how I want to play the shot is what do I think will give me the best percentage of hitting well.  Just curious to your thoughts.

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Oh, so you're telling me on these pitch shots I'm not supposed to hit it with the blade and send it 30-40 yards beyond the green? Interesting, I never realized this fact. No, actually, sometimes I can hit a glorious pitch that lifts the ball way up in the air, but it just makes me so nervous because of the risk involved. Either way, this is a very helpful video, thanks for it.

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Originally Posted by Leftygolfer

Is it possible to hit low chip shots using bounce w/o opening the face?  I've found that when I'm trying to chip the ball at times I can have bad results if I hit it just a touch fat when the leading edge digs in.  Something that I do on chips is going down in loft and opening the face so I can use the bounce but still have it come out flat.

Bounce != leading edge. Which are you asking? You can hit low pitches too (typically with lots of spin) but those are specialty shots that I didn't get into here because they do require a bit more... "stuff." Face pretty flat, shallow AoA, lots of spin, actual throwing of the right wrist, etc.

Chips don't use the bounce in my vernacular, so I don't know how to answer the question.


Originally Posted by Leftygolfer

Also, I've been for years playing all my pitches with a slightly to severely open stance/open face to use the bounce as much as possible.  Would playing a wedge with more bounce allow me to use the same swing more square? I'm an avid bouncer (for lack of better word).

Yes. See this thread: http://thesandtrap.com/t/57874/my-edel-wedges-or-super-bounce-and-why-its-good-for-you-or-the-sweet-spot-is-finally-in-the-right-place .

Originally Posted by Leftygolfer

Final question.  How do you decide what shot you want to hit in real situations.  I've heard (which I think is bad advice) get the ball on the ground quickly as possible.  I try to paint a picture of what I want to happen and just feel the swing that will produce that shot.  Sometimes pitching it to the hole looks right, others a driving pitch seems to look good.  My biggest determinant of exactly how I want to play the shot is what do I think will give me the best percentage of hitting well.  Just curious to your thoughts.

How? Everything's a blend. I rarely hit a "pure pitch" or a "pure chip" (though 95% of my shots around the green tend towards the pitch end of the spectrum). I do similarly to you. I feel the conditions, set up in the way that will produce them given the lie, firmness of the green, contours, where it's safer to miss, etc.

If there's a tier that I can fly over or run up, I'll tend to bounce it up the tier, because if I fly it a bit too far it'll kill it more, and if I land it short it'll bounce up it better, and the flop tends to be a bit more of a difficult shot than a lower ball that checks on the third hop... but it depends on the lie, and how far the pin is past the tier, too.

Originally Posted by Sykology

Oh, so you're telling me on these pitch shots I'm not supposed to hit it with the blade and send it 30-40 yards beyond the green? Interesting, I never realized this fact. No, actually, sometimes I can hit a glorious pitch that lifts the ball way up in the air, but it just makes me so nervous because of the risk involved. Either way, this is a very helpful video, thanks for it.

Check out the "quickie pitching video" thread as well.

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That answered my question Erik.  That is the way I see it too.  If you are chipping the ball you are using the leading edge and the margin for error is so much less.  That is the reason I open the face up and use less loft so i can use bounce and still get the desired running shot.  I seem to get away with the careless one more often.

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Excellent video.  What worked for me was being able to see the different follow through and use of the wrists for each technique.   Thanks Erik.

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Probably my favorite video you've done. I think seeing it it slow motion just made something click in my brain.
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Check out the "quickie pitching video" thread as well.

I did, and it has helped me quite a bit. I at least feel that I now know what to do, it is just a matter of actually executing. Thanks again.

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ok..one situation that still gets me is how to attack a chip shot that has a clumpy piece of grass right behind the ball.  I would say that my ratio of good to bad is 1:3 from this kind of lie simply because I don't know quite how to play it consistently.  Steeper angle of attack?  What usually causes bad shots is me either getting slowed down too much by the clumpy lie or I blade the shot because I'm trying to be too precise.  Help me out?  It drives me crazy!
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Originally Posted by Paradox

ok..one situation that still gets me is how to attack a chip shot that has a clumpy piece of grass right behind the ball.  I would say that my ratio of good to bad is 1:3 from this kind of lie simply because I don't know quite how to play it consistently.  Steeper angle of attack?  What usually causes bad shots is me either getting slowed down too much by the clumpy lie or I blade the shot because I'm trying to be too precise.  Help me out?  It drives me crazy!

Pitch it. Lots more speed because you're using more loft. You'll hear them say "he's going to play this like a bunker shot" on TV. Pitch it.

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Originally Posted by Paradox

ok..one situation that still gets me is how to attack a chip shot that has a clumpy piece of grass right behind the ball.  I would say that my ratio of good to bad is 1:3 from this kind of lie simply because I don't know quite how to play it consistently.  Steeper angle of attack?  What usually causes bad shots is me either getting slowed down too much by the clumpy lie or I blade the shot because I'm trying to be too precise.  Help me out?  It drives me crazy!

Yeah like Erik said, pitch it.  Utilize that bounce and speed.  You'll be surprised how easy some of these shots can become with the right technique.

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Originally Posted by iacas

Thanks. Any specifics? It would interest me to know what was new to you or made you think.

Well, some of the things I have just never thought about like lower hands adding more loft and bounce.  The butt of the club being farther away from the stomach and flying wedge on the chips.  My range of motion just overall seems much shorter than yours.

Then I notice from your video that I do not turn or pivot my hips nearly as much as you on the pitch shots.  I guess, realistically, I knew that was the correct way, but realize that I haven't been getting close to where you are.

It was just little key things like that.

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The one thing I worked on was the gravity feeling of letting the arm drop and sliding the club head underneath the ball using the bounce.  Also, I was trying to be less mechanical & more feeling/imagining the distance & trajectory.  I had three 10 minute sessions every hour (during swim breaks for the kids) at the local swimming pool/par 3 golf course, and pitched one in from 35 yards - I can't recall ever doing this before!  Also, the 4 balls pitched at the end of the session were all consistently on the green & within a 15-20 foot diameter circle.  I feel more like a golfer now!

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Thanks Erik, very nice.  I was struck by 1) how similar your chipping arm action is to a putt - no wrist break at all on the follow-through. This seems simple enough in principle but I find it hard to achieve consistently; 2)  how you keep your hands ahead of the ball on contact, even with the most wristy of pitch shots.  I enjoy attempting this type of soft, high pitch but still have a tendency to flip, probably because my weight isn't forward enough through contact.  Any thoughts on how to avoid flipping?

Later: I just watched Erik's other video.  I'm pretty sure that I don't pivot enough when I flip - I'll work on that next time out.

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Would have been better if your bag and bag tag had been in the background!

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