2012 PGA Championship at Kiawah Island Ocean Course Thread

[utztech]

Originally Posted by iacas

It was briefly, but I had to send it to the guys there for the once-over (factual review - not a lot of facts, so even though it's long, it shouldn't TAKE too long).

Here are some pictures. The "k" ones are all of the images, and the "ki" ones are duplicates but the better ones I used in the article. The "k" ones are pretty much in order, though, so you can "walk around" the Ocean Course and some of Turtle Point.

I heard that all the bunkers are played as wasted areas this week.  But looking at, for example, picture k_25 there are waste looking areas, but in the middle of the fairway there is a pot bunker.  I noticed in other pictures clearly defined greenside bunkers as well.  Are they all really being played as waste areas?

And thanks for the pictures, it is cool to see the course close up.

[Chris Shades]

Keegan seem's to be really optimistic about the championship even with the weather conditions. As much as I would hate to admit it, Rory and Gmac might be the ones to watch out for on this course.

[Chris Shades]

" I heard that all the bunkers are played as wasted areas this week.  But looking at, for example, picture k_25 there are waste looking areas, but in the middle of the fairway there is a pot bunker.  I noticed in other pictures clearly defined greenside bunkers as well.  Are they all really being played as waste areas?"

The guys on golf channel won't stop talking saying "there are no bunkers on this course, all area's with sand are called sandy area's and will be played from as a waste area". Dustin Johnson must feel like crap...

[iacas]

Originally Posted by utztech

I heard that all the bunkers are played as wasted areas this week.  But looking at, for example, picture k_25 there are waste looking areas, but in the middle of the fairway there is a pot bunker.  I noticed in other pictures clearly defined greenside bunkers as well.  Are they all really being played as waste areas?

http://thesandtrap.com/t/60814/dustin-johnson-will-fear-no-bunker-at-this-years-pga/

Originally Posted by Chris Shades

The guys on golf channel won't stop talking saying "there are no bunkers on this course, all area's with sand are called sandy area's and will be played from as a waste area". Dustin Johnson must feel like crap...

Dustin Johnson shouldn't feel like anything. The PGA goes back to Whistling Straits in a few years and I imagine those bunkers will again be played as bunkers. There are NO waste areas at Whistling Straits. They have a thousand bunkers there but many of them are so far out of play that they are counted just to increase the bunker count.

The Ocean Course has always been played as through the green, even though there are some clearly defined areas that you could call bunkers. The problem is that there are plenty of areas that are in between - they're grassy on one side but kind of leak out into a waste "sandy area" on the back side or something. At what point would that be a bunker or a sandy area?

In other words, there's ambiguity, and if they made a rule like "all areas enclosed by grass will play as bunkers (which is NOT how they play in even day-to-day play) then you'd have guys asking for rulings every time they were in the sand.

At Whistling Straits there's no ambiguity because there are no "waste" or "sandy areas." They're all prepared areas with sand, and thus, all bunkers. Dustin (and his caddie) should have known that "if we're on sand, we're in a bunker." I mean, the only other possibility would have been that he was on a cart path (obviously he was not).

So that's it.

I'm looking forward to this tournament more than I've looked forward to any major in the past several years. Maybe since the last one at Oakmont, honestly.

[bamagrad03]

Quote:

I'm looking forward to this tournament more than I've looked forward to any major in the past several years. Maybe since the last one at Oakmont, honestly.

Why is that? Is it because, if I remember correctly, you played Kiawah not too long ago?

[iacas]

Originally Posted by bamagrad03

Why is that? Is it because, if I remember correctly, you played Kiawah not too long ago?

Yes, and I think the course hasn't really been seen on a large scale, and certainly no modern players have played it, and so it's a unique and new course that presents some interesting challenges.

http://thesandtrap.com/b/pga/a_vacation_on_kiawah_island

[Jimdangles]

Originally Posted by MSchott

Erik, what part of the game does Kiawah test the most? I've heard that it will be the sort game as a lot of greens will be missed. What are your thoughts on what kind of player will do well on this course?

Originally Posted by iacas

Driving and hitting greens if the winds are up.

You dont say? haha jk

[Chilli Dipper]

Originally Posted by iacas

Yes, and I think the course hasn't really been seen on a large scale, and certainly no modern players have played it, and so it's a unique and new course that presents some interesting challenges.

http://thesandtrap.com/b/pga/a_vacation_on_kiawah_island

That's not entirely true. The Ocean Course held the World Cup of Golf in 1997 and 2003; there are 13 players in the field who played in that 2003 event, meaning at least those players have seen the Ocean Course in competition. Also, the 2005 PGA Club Professional Championship was held here, so many of the club pros who qualified have also played in a tournament at Kiawah before.

That said, I don't think past experience will play a factor at all in this championship.

[Wansteadimp]

Originally Posted by iacas

Yes, and I think the course hasn't really been seen on a large scale, and certainly no modern players have played it, and so it's a unique and new course that presents some interesting challenges.

http://thesandtrap.com/b/pga/a_vacation_on_kiawah_island

No modern players except those that played the 2003 World Cup there, not sure what revisions to the course have been made but there are few players on the list of competitors at the World Cup who would be amongst the favourites this week. I guess Justin Rose would be the most likely along with Furyk, the event was pretty week in its field though

http://newsday.sportsdirectinc.com/golf/epga-results.aspx?page=/data/epga/recap/recap461_score.html

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Chilli Dipper

That's not entirely true. The Ocean Course held the World Cup of Golf in 1997 and 2003; there are 13 players in the field who played in that 2003 event, meaning at least those players have seen the Ocean Course in competition. Also, the 2005 PGA Club Professional Championship was held here, so many of the club pros who qualified have also played in a tournament at Kiawah before.

The club pros don't count. They're not contending or winning this thing.

And yes, I forgot about the world cups, but the course has undergone changes since then, including new tees, revised water and "sandy area" lines, etc.

With the weather they've gotten this week, people are going to be having more trouble if they didn't get in several rounds prior to this week, and those who came last week or earlier should have an advantage. For some of the field, tomorrow's first round will be their first time playing some of the holes!

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by iacas

The club pros don't count. They're not contending or winning this thing.

Just out of curiousity, what has been the best finish by a club pro at a PGA Championship?

Should I have picked one just for kicks with my third choice in the contest?

[bamagrad03]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Just out of curiousity, what has been the best finish by a club pro at a PGA Championship?

Should I have picked one just for kicks with my third choice in the contest?

I'd be interested in this as well. Always interesting to see how the mere mortals do on the big stages.

[brocks]

Just out of curiousity, what has been the best finish by a club pro at a PGA Championship?

"Since the PGA Championship and the PGA professional championship became two separate events more than four decades ago, the best a PGA professional has ever finished in this major is third. That happened twice: Tommy Bolt in 1971 at PGA National and Snead in 1974 at Tanglewood GC in North Carolina. Neither was considered "touring pros" by that stage in their careers. Since 2000, the best finish by a PGA club pro was a tie for 31st, in 2004. Chip Sullivan achieved that feat. In 2003 and 2008, no PGA club pro made the cut, and since 2006 no one has finished better than 68th... ...In 1969, Don Bies dropped a 64 in the second round at NCR Country Club in Ohio. That same year, Jimmy Wright shot 279 over four rounds and finished fourth, still the lowest four-round total ever shot by a PGA pro. Jay Overton fired a 66 in Round 2 back in 1988 at Oak Tree Golf Club in Oklahoma." http://espn.go.com/golf/pgachampionship12/story/_/id/8244768/make-worth-their-club-pros-pga-championship

[ThominOH]

Originally Posted by iacas

The majority of people in golf. You can hate Tiger all you want but to say things like that you're just exposing yourself as a guy that's completely unaware of the world around him. Just because you don't like or care about the guy doesn't change the reality - he's the only needle-mover in the game.

WOW.. so your thinking is that anyone that doesn't praise Tiger is a hater?  Really?  Is that how your world revolves around absolutes of "lover and hater" and no grey in between.. Tiger is NOT golf and Golf is NOT Tiger..  Your last part is the most reveling part "he's the only needle-mover in the game".... Charlie Sheen is a needle mover too, and that doesn't make him the best actor in the industry or a reason to LOVE him..   Think about it..

My stance has always been to promote the game of golf and no ONE man is more important then the game..

[iacas]

Originally Posted by ThominOH

WOW.. so your thinking is that anyone that doesn't praise Tiger is a hater?  Really?

No. My thinking is that YOU, ThominOH, clearly hate Tiger. It was not a general "you." It was a specific "you."

You said " Who the hell cares about Tiger?" I answered.

Originally Posted by ThominOH

Tiger is NOT golf and Golf is NOT Tiger..  Your last part is the most reveling part "he's the only needle-mover in the game".... Charlie Sheen is a needle mover too, and that doesn't make him the best actor in the industry or a reason to LOVE him..   Think about it..

More poor logic. I didn't say "like" or "love" I said he moves the needle, which is a simple statement of fact.

I didn't say he was the best golfer, I didn't say it was a reason to LOVE him, and I didn't even say it was good. You asked who cared ABOUT Tiger, and if you think few people do, then you don't exist in reality.

[bamagrad03]

Hey iacas,

Not sure if you were watching the Golf Channel last night, but they were bragging on the "wonderful" caddy program they had there at Kiawah.

[brocks]

In case anyone is at work and unable to use the video stream, a marquee group update through four holes Bright sunshine and no wind, but the sweat is dripping off the guys. Keegan got off to a dream start, birdie-eagle, but then started missing shots. Currently -2. Kaymer has been off from the beginning, bogeyed the first two holes, +2. Tiger has been the opposite of what we expected, with a pretty good short game and a bad long game. His tee shots have not been terrible, just a yard or two off the fairway, but they manage to trickle into the bunkers (and I don't care what anybody says, they are bunkers) too close to the bank to give him a shot. Even through four.

[bamagrad03]

Tiger did start on 10, however. And that is assumed to be tougher than the front 9 if I'm not mistaken. But he's not looking to sharp thus far.