What's the hardest shot in golf?

[k-troop]

Of course it carries. It carries however far you hit it and then lands with a lot of spin. It won't get more than 10 or 15 feet in the air most likely, so you're not using this shot to flop over a tree. Obviously you're not going to stop it dead on us open greens, but then you're talking about an entirely different shot. A 40 yard pitch from hardpan over a bunker to a short pin sloping away with firm greens stimping at 12+ isn't a hard shot, it's an impossible shot. (Well, I guess you could always land it in the hole.) we're talking about hard but executable shots. As far as the shot I'm talking about, to normal greens, it will come out low but with a ton of spin and stop fast. I wouldn't attack a short pin over a bunker, but you can land it 15 feet past and leave a reasonable putt for par.

[k-troop]

Nobody, maybe not even Phil, could hit a true flop from hardpan.  You have to be able to get the leading edge under the ball with an open face and the clubhead has to be ahead of the hands, which adds to whatever bounce the club has built into it. With a 60 or 64 LW you could get a high pitch with perfect contact, but I can't see anyone having much success with trying to flop from a hardpan lie.  You would almost have to have a wedge with a special grind just for that shot.

Didn't mvmac post a video hitting a flop shot off of a putting green with his magic Edel wedge?

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Beachcomber

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Nobody, maybe not even Phil, could hit a true flop from hardpan.  You have to be able to get the leading edge under the ball with an open face and the clubhead has to be ahead of the hands, which adds to whatever bounce the club has built into it. With a 60 or 64 LW you could get a high pitch with perfect contact, but I can't see anyone having much success with trying to flop from a hardpan lie.  You would almost have to have a wedge with a special grind just for that shot.

But I can't even do this type 'float loading' of motion off of hardpan.

http://thesandtrap.com/t/39411/quickie-pitching-video#post_516421

The hardest shot in golf for me is hardpan, when you need to carry the ball any particular distance.  Say 30 yards over a bunker and land it on a short sided pin.  Very difficult shot.  I'm not talking about the trap shot where you just hit down on the ball and it comes out low and hits then stops.  That shot doesn't carry any length... And if you're required to carry the ball any distance through the air, it doesn't work.

You aren't supposed to leave yourself those shots.

But seriously, when I do leave that sort of a problem, I play the best shot I can.  You just can't expect to get up and down from that situation except by accident, so it's better to just take your medicine and do whatever you can to minimize the damage.

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by k-troop

Of course it carries. It carries however far you hit it and then lands with a lot of spin. It won't get more than 10 or 15 feet in the air most likely, so you're not using this shot to flop over a tree. Obviously you're not going to stop it dead on us open greens, but then you're talking about an entirely different shot. A 40 yard pitch from hardpan over a bunker to a short pin sloping away with firm greens stimping at 12+ isn't a hard shot, it's an impossible shot. (Well, I guess you could always land it in the hole.) we're talking about hard but executable shots.

As far as the shot I'm talking about, to normal greens, it will come out low but with a ton of spin and stop fast. I wouldn't attack a short pin over a bunker, but you can land it 15 feet past and leave a reasonable putt for par.

I guess the thread title confused you?

[mdl]

Yeah I assumed we were talking about hard but not literally impossible shots.  40 yards, concrete hard-pan, short sided over a bunker is a literally impossible shot with any wedge real players actually game, unless you hit the flag or bounce it off the back lip of the bunker just right or something.

But I agree the mid length hard pan shot can be tricky.  If it's far enough to be able to attack it (even if not a full swing), then I don't find that too hard, and if it's like just of the fringe distance, no problem.  But 30-50 yards off hard pan is really tough for exactly what Beachcomber said, if you hit 1/4" too far behind the ball it'll bounce and you'll blade it.

I vote for thick rough pitches and chips as harder though.  Maybe just cause I hit shots off hard pan way more often than I play courses where the penalization is deep rough?  At 25 yards buried in some grass I basically never feel like I have any idea how hard I have to swing even just to ensure the ball gets onto the green somewhere.  I'm just chopping and hoping.

[Beachcomber]

Originally Posted by mdl

Yeah I assumed we were talking about hard but not literally impossible shots.  40 yards, concrete hard-pan, short sided over a bunker is a literally impossible shot with any wedge real players actually game, unless you hit the flag or bounce it off the back lip of the bunker just right or something.

But I agree the mid length hard pan shot can be tricky.  If it's far enough to be able to attack it (even if not a full swing), then I don't find that too hard, and if it's like just of the fringe distance, no problem.  But 30-50 yards off hard pan is really tough for exactly what Beachcomber said, if you hit 1/4" too far behind the ball it'll bounce and you'll blade it.

I vote for thick rough pitches and chips as harder though.  Maybe just cause I hit shots off hard pan way more often than I play courses where the penalization is deep rough?  At 25 yards buried in some grass I basically never feel like I have any idea how hard I have to swing even just to ensure the ball gets onto the green somewhere.  I'm just chopping and hoping.

I'm busting k-troop's chops a little, but saying a middle length hard pan shot is easy I think is unfair.  Like highlighted, it is inbetween a pitch and a chip.  You can't flip or float load without the risk of the club bouncing up and scalding the ball.  You can't flop it for the same reason.  So you have to trap it and that is more of a low flying punch - with forward shaft lean.  This can emit spin - but you run the risk of:

a.) carrying the ball far enough to even get on the green - hitting short and the ball coming up short of the green/pin

b.) carrying the ball too far - not emitting enough spin and the ball rolling past the pin (aka long ass putt back) or worse having to chip back as the ball ran through the green

It is all about the lie - hardpan... Forces you to hit a low trap... Combined with distance control - how hard you hit the shot to ensure it flies the proper distance, and then has enough room to hit - then check and stop.  Not an easy shot as some of the guys on here are saying.

If it is easy... Then I want to see you post the shot/result to Youtube.  I'd be happy to film why I believe it is one of the harder shots in golf.

[Chas]

Originally Posted by zipazoid

The 40-50 yard bunker shot. It's that 'tweener' shot between blasting it & picking it clean. I screw it up every time.

Oh yes, I'd forgotten about this one.  I've never had an up-and-down from one of these, or even close.

[cooke119]

Driver on the 1st tee with 10 to 20 guys watching, puckers you-know-what everytime.

[tuffluck]

for the bunker shots further away than a normal bunker shot, i frequently go down a club depending on the distance.  a UW will go a little further than a SW, a PW a little further than a UW, a 9i a little further than a PW, so on and so forth.  just use all of them the same as a SW and you'll get the same result, just a bit further and with a little less spin.  for 40-50 yards, use the PW and swing like it's a SW.

[inthehole]

the super hard bunker sand shot.    Have no idea how to successfully make this shot ... I've tried to pick it - NEVER works; I hit the snot out of it behind the ball - exploding through the hardpan sand & it usually just trickles out of the bunker.     Have to swing so hard to power through the hard sand, its uncontrollable.    Would appreciate some tips on how is best to play this shot ... thx

[boogielicious]

Lots of good examples.  I would say any shot that you can't practice regularly.  There are plenty of places to practice the downhill chip from deep rough around here, so I do practice it a lot.  Sand practice is a bit harder with not a lot of traps in practice areas, especially ones for the 30 - 50 yard sand shot.

There is a course in southern NH, Scottish Highlands, that has a great practice area with a pitching green with two traps next to it in addition to a putting green and grass range.  You can practice short and long sand shots, chip and pitches up to 90 yards.  There is hard pan on one side to try to pitch over a trap and onto the green.  There is a grass filled bunker. I try to sneak up there whenever possible.  It is fun to grab a large bucket and just do these shots and set the ball up for weird lies.  Sadly it closes late Oct and opens early April.

Mud and really wet turf is tough too.  Very hard to practice that.

[JasonK88S]

For me its anytime i use my driver off the tee. I know that if i can settle down with my driver and correct my swing to hit more FIR then i could tremendously lower my score. my short and long irons as well as wedges are decent. putting is also another "not so good" shot for me. Some would say that those are the two most crucial shots.... Driving... Putting...

[RAZR]

Originally Posted by GaijinGolfer

3-wood off the deck.

Agree.  I took my 3 wood completely out of my bag.  I can hit all day long on the range and then I get out there and top it every time.  I guess it's just a mental thing but I don't have any problems getting distance out of my 3 iron so I'm pretty content.

-Scott

[misty_mountainhop]

30-40 yard bunker shot. Nasty.

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by misty_mountainhop

30-40 yard bunker shot. Nasty.

I posted earlier in the thread that's my toughest shot too, and I got some good advice on how to play it - use anywhere from an 8i to a PW, open the blade, and hit behind it, a blast shot. I'm definitely going to try that.

So here's my question, and I apologize if this is a bit of a thread hijack -

At what distance does a bunker shot stop being a 'blast shot' where you hit behind it & become one of picking it cleanly? 50 yards? 75? 100?

[David in FL]

So here's my question, and I apologize if this is a bit of a thread hijack - At what distance does a bunker shot stop being a 'blast shot' where you hit behind it & become one of picking it cleanly? 50 yards? 75? 100?

Somewhere around 40 or 50 yds I hit a little half-swing punch shot with my gap wedge. Ball way back in the stance....kind of like a hard pan shot where I just HAVE to make solid contact with the ball well before the ground. Spins like crazy. Pretty cool shot for me and not terribly difficult with a decent lie, especially if the sand is just a little firm.....

[boogielicious]

For me, about 80 to 100.   I treat it like a fairway bunker shot and use my 54 or 50 gap wedge.

[Chas]

the super hard bunker sand shot.    Have no idea how to successfully make this shot ... I've tried to pick it - NEVER works; I hit the snot out of it behind the ball - exploding through the hardpan sand & it usually just trickles out of the bunker.     Have to swing so hard to power through the hard sand, its uncontrollable.    Would appreciate some tips on how is best to play this shot ... thx

Agreed, but fortunately you don't see these often here in San Diego. But this shot just killed me at Poppy Hills (near Carmel) earlier this year (see other thread). They hadn't maintained the bunkers for a while due to a scheduled major remodel; an ultra-thin sand layer covered really hard dirt (felt like concrete). I was clueless and lost a bunch of strokes. Normally I like bunker shots, incl. fairway bunkers. Have to play it like off of hard pan of course.