Blades or Game Improvement Irons??

[14ledo81]

I was asking because I think he might have meant us, but we are in NW PA.

Dang it...I. did mean the guys from NW Penn. I would like to make a visit there myself someday. I have relatives on the east coast. Erie is not really on the route we take, but maybe I could talk the wife into going to Niagara Falls on the way. "Oh look honey, we are not far from Erie, you know that forum I spend so much time on?, we really should swing in."

[cooke119]

I'm a 15 handcap and I play Ping G15's which are considered GI irons and I work the ball. GI clubs have nothing to do with being able to work the ball, period. You are still hitting a round ball with a flat surface, blade, GI or SGI, it doesn't matter. Working the ball has to do with your setup, swing etc., not the club you are playing. As a beginner I would recommend you buy yourself a nice set of clubs in your price range that come with a free fitting, get lessons to learn the basic then play, a lot.

[stevenlsmith]

To bad I live 7 hours away from Erie

[clearwaterms]

Originally Posted by stevenlsmith

To bad I live 7 hours away from Erie

day trip.

[stevenlsmith]

what a long day that would be lol

[tristanhilton85]

Originally Posted by stevenlsmith

what a long day that would be lol

One that would be worth it though...

[amac]

In choosing which person to get lesson's from, do try both.  Then commit to a series of lesson's and enjoy.

As for clubs, don't be lured into blades being the only players club.  Watching the Masters last week, I noticed plenty of pro's playing GI looking irons.  They don't all play blades.  What's more, some GI lines have "pro" models like Mizuno, Callaway and Ping, to name few.

Personally, I'm a gear junkie and if new clubs will give you renewed excitement about the upcoming golf season, I say go for it!

[iacas]

Originally Posted by tristanhilton85

One that would be worth it though...

Thanks.

We get a good rate at the hotel literally across the street from our indoor Academy… ;-)

[clearwaterms]

Iacas, Do you run clinics? If so what is the going rate for a multi day group clinic. Do you have any intention of offering special TST pricing? I'm thinking, 3-4 days in Erie. Play 18 holes on the first day, take a 1-2 day clinic, play the same 18 the final day, compare your score. I would be interested...

[rehmwa]

Originally Posted by cooke119

I'm a 15 handcap and I play Ping G15's which are considered GI irons and I work the ball. GI clubs have nothing to do with being able to work the ball, period. You are still hitting a round ball with a flat surface, blade, GI or SGI, it doesn't matter. Working the ball has to do with your setup, swing etc., not the club you are playing. As a beginner I would recommend you buy yourself a nice set of clubs in your price range that come with a free fitting, get lessons to learn the basic then play, a lot.

Not just to cooke119, but his post leads into this:

I suspect the pros will correct me, but my impression on a couple terms "controllability" and "workability":  (people seem to use the first term for both.....so it gets confusing)

1 - left and right bending, hitting a straight ball.  If you can't keep that working right, you just need to hit it better, take lessons, learn repeatability and a good swing.  A game improvement design isn't really made to help with that (as cooke119 notes above, flat surface, round ball) - though I suspect they do to some extent as a side effect.  If one does have the ability to, on purpose, to bend it left and right to various degrees - that's called "Workability".

2 - the takeoff angle of the ball - up and down, a lot, a little, etc etc etc.  If you can't control that, then that's what the game improvement designs are there to help on to make your ball flight a bit insensitive to those inputs that affect the take off angle.  However, since they are designed to dampen out the inputs that affect the angle of launch, you don't want those clubs if you do it on purpose and want the clubs sensitive to your inputs (nice to fine tune distance and choose to take advantage of winds, etc etc). - called "Controlability"

I suspect pros want a lot more sensitivity in their club designs so they can take advantage of "Working" and "Controlling" the ball flight.  Regular guys want to someday be able to do all that, but most of the time just want consistent yardage for each club and straight flight.

My set - Mizuno MP53's.  The 4-7 irons have a pretty decent cavity (GI feature), and I have to put in a lot more input with these to up-angle and down-angle the ball flight.  But can still do it.  The 8-PW are shallow cavity only and it's a bit easier to hit higher and lower vs just my normal setup and swing.....FWIW -

IMHO - you can learn to work and control your shots with any club and the GI clubs are fine to learn on - the techniques work, but for learning, you don't have to be as subtle - I suspect the OP would learn faster than if he just skipped straight to blades.

(and, I might have this all wrong.  Or, most likely, I have most of it right but someone won't like the way I described it.....  but I'm here to learn)

[iacas]

Originally Posted by clearwaterms

Iacas,

Do you run clinics? If so what is the going rate for a multi day group clinic. Do you have any intention of offering special TST pricing?

I'm thinking, 3-4 days in Erie. Play 18 holes on the first day, take a 1-2 day clinic, play the same 18 the final day, compare your score.

I would be interested...

If you're interested in putting together a foursome of golfers to come do something like that, the golf will be relatively inexpensive and we can work something nice out to include the works (5SK full swing stuff, short game, putting, maybe a little AimPoint) and do it for a great rate.

A hotel right across the street has great rates if we book the room for you (or tell you to say that you're with us).

Bit OT for this thread so PM me if you want.

[nevets88]

Originally Posted by stevenlsmith

To bad I live 7 hours away from Erie

8 for me. I've driven there a couple of times. It's like Dunkin' Dounts. It's worth the trip.

[mancgolfer]

Just to add to this, blades essentially have a small COG directly behind the ball. Because the COG only has to be moved slightly to have a large effect on flight path low, high, fade draw etc, this can be good for someone who can control it, but enough rope to hang yourself with if you can't. To start with, you have to hit the sweet spot which again is smaller even to make a mess of the shot by positioning the COG incorrectly. :-) For this you need to have practiced a lot and have repeatability in your swing.

A GI iron will have a much larger sweet spot and the COG will generally be below the ball so as to help getting the ball in the air, with the COG being larger it takes more effort to work the ball for a low handicapper player, but again reduces the amount of curve a higher handicapper will put on the ball.

But, ultimately to become a good ball striker you need to move to blades as some point, we respond to the stimulus of bad shots, which you just don't get with GI irons. So plenty of practice with blades will make you a better ball striker. When you get to 12  or below with a repeatable swing, that would be when to change as long as you're prepared to put the hours in (range at least 3 times a week)

Working the ball is something that even the top players try and avoid if they can, they all have a "go to" shot that they like hitting under pressure and they all have a favoured shape. Distance control and hitting it where you aim will get you to single figures without ever having to work the ball, but distance control comes from hitting the sweet spot consistently.

For me, when I picked up golf again I went from:

2000 - Cobra King 2 forged: 20 - 15 handicap (forgiving players cavity back)

2004 - Mizuno MP-30: 15 - 11 handicap (players cavity back)

2005 - Mizuno MP-37: 11 - 10 handicap (got ahead of myself, very unforgiving blade and wasn't ready for them)

2006 - Mizuno Mp-32: 10 - 7  handicap (very forgiving blade easy to hit)

2009 - Vega Raf-cm: 7 - 5 handicap (reasonably forgiving blade but feel I could hit anything now).

Think the dates are right but my mind maybe failing me. :-) That's just me though but hopefully it's useful to see the kind of clubs I had at different handicaps.

[tomvk77]

Well full blades are hardly made nowadays, GI irons are also far better and workable now.

I think you can get a good GI iron. And you will be fine for the first 10 years.

If you would like some blade look and feel, maybe the Mizuno JPX 825 Pro are a good match for you.

[Justforgolf]

muscle back irons sounds good if your still learning and not at the point where you can strike the ball good almost everytime than game improvement would work well