Adrian Peterson Indicted On Child Negligence

[Lihu]

Good stuff here: [URL=http://grantland.com/the-triangle/week-3-picks-adrian-peterson-roger-goodell/]http://grantland.com/the-triangle/week-3-picks-adrian-peterson-roger-goodell/[/URL] The on topic part:

Apparently, I didn't have the same experience as the writer of that article. Wow, talk about cultural differences.

[Vinsk]

http://preview.msn.com/en-us/sports/nhl/flames-president-violent-athletes-dont-deserve-paychecks/ar-BB4KHOD MMoan....there u have it.

[Golfingdad]

Sorry, I tend to disagree. The rage/anger aspect and crime is exactly the same. Why should she be punished less by her work because she's weaker than Ray Rice? I guarantee you that Hope Solo, a professional athlete who lives in the gym, is at least twice as strong as her sister.

I'd say it's absurd (and frankly, insulting) to imply that women shouldn't be held as responsible for their actions as men just because they aren't as strong.

Sorry, if there's gonna be "equality", it has to be everywhere. Can't pick and choose where you want to be equal and where you want special treatment.

"Solo reportedly followed him and the two got into an argument that allegedly escalated as Solo "charged" at him and took a swing at him. They then tussled on the ground and she "repeatedly punched him in the face and tackled him," reports say. The nephew grabbed her by the hair and held her to the ground until she appeared to calm down, at which point she reportedly grabbed his hair and pulled him back down, punching him some more, according to the incident report.

Solo's half-sister arrived and tried to break up the fight, but Solo reportedly turned her aggression to her and punched her in the face "several times."

The nephew got a wooden broom that he "broke over (Solo's) head," but Solo reportedly did not relent, so he pointed a BB gun at her.

Solo eventually stopped and her half-sister ultimately pushed her out the door, but she re-entered through an unlocked sliding door and, after some argument, assaulted her sister some more, the affidavit says."

Right...just some poor small misunderstood woman...difference here is that she kept coming.

Your description doesn't really help your case here.  She's fighting with two people who CLEARLY can hold their own with her because they fought back enough to be able to eventually end the fight.

How is that even close to the same thing as the other two cases?

Another way to look at it is, like I mentioned in my previous post ... take away the "domestic violence" tag.  Imagine that the victims weren't relatives of the perps and then you tell me that these are the same thing.

A)  Man brutally punching woman and knocking her out cold.

B)  Man brutally beating 4 year old boy.

C)  Woman fighting with woman her age and full grown teenage boy.

Seriously??

[Slice of Life]

Your description doesn't really help your case here.  She's fighting with two people who CLEARLY can hold their own with her because they fought back enough to be able to eventually end the fight.

How is that even close to the same thing as the other two cases?

Another way to look at it is, like I mentioned in my previous post ... take away the "domestic violence" tag.  Imagine that the victims weren't relatives of the perps and then you tell me that these are the same thing.

A)  Man brutally punching woman and knocking her out cold.

B)  Man brutally beating 4 year old boy.

C)  Woman fighting with woman her age and full grown teenage boy.

Seriously??

First, take the Peterson case out, since it's completely different.

So we'll just compare Hope and Rice...

Now don't get me wrong...I'm 100% in the don't put your hands on a woman camp. Ray Rice is a complete scumbag who doesn't deserve to play another snap in the NFL...let's get that out of the way real quick.

Comparing the other two, a woman attacking a man or another woman should be no less a crime than a man attacking a man or a woman. Period. Just because she can't do as much damage, doesn't mean she isn't trying. At the end of the day, the result was the same...Ray Rice's wife got her ass beat, and so did Hope's nephew/sister. Neither died or suffered any serious injuries, so the charges should be identical. It is assault, no more, no less.

If Hope had succeeded in knocking her nephew out, how would you feel about it? Is it different just because she wasn't able to finish the job? Does she get leniency because her punching power isn't enough to knock someone out? That logic is seriously flawed in my opinion.

[jamo]

One question for you guys... [URL=http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2014/09/19/hope-solo-and-the-domestic-violence-case-no-one-is-talking-about/?tid=trending_strip_1]http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2014/09/19/hope-solo-and-the-domestic-violence-case-no-one-is-talking-about/?tid=trending_strip_1[/URL] Where's the outrage? Where's the media and sponsor pressure? Nike drops AP and sponsors her...double standard much?

I'm not sure what your point is. Hope is standing trial. How has her treatment been lenient? If there's one thing that ESPN investigative article made very clear, it's that the NFL's handling of the situation is 100% driven by PR. There's no "doing the right thing" here. There's just a business scrambling to prevent people from hating them. If the people in charge of women's soccer thought Hope Solo was hurting their brand, they'd suspend her too. You think if a man in the organization that runs upper-level men's pro ultimate frisbee in the US committed domestic violence a year ago he would have faced a Rice-like suspension? Of course not, because no one gives a shit about their organization. There would have been no PR hit.

[newtogolf]

Your description doesn't really help your case here.  She's fighting with two people who CLEARLY can hold their own with her because they fought back enough to be able to eventually end the fight.

How is that even close to the same thing as the other two cases?

Another way to look at it is, like I mentioned in my previous post ... take away the "domestic violence" tag.  Imagine that the victims weren't relatives of the perps and then you tell me that these are the same thing.

A)  Man brutally punching woman and knocking her out cold.

B)  Man brutally beating 4 year old boy.

C)  Woman fighting with woman her age and full grown teenage boy.

Seriously??

So would you be more outraged if the woman was a trained professional MMA fighter, and the teenage boy was gay?

[newtogolf]

I'm not sure what your point is. Hope is standing trial. How has her treatment been lenient?

If there's one thing that ESPN investigative article made very clear, it's that the NFL's handling of the situation is 100% driven by PR. There's no "doing the right thing" here. There's just a business scrambling to prevent people from hating them. If the people in charge of women's soccer thought Hope Solo was hurting their brand, they'd suspend her too.

You think if a man in the organization that runs upper-level men's pro ultimate frisbee in the US committed domestic violence a year ago he would have faced a Rice-like suspension? Of course not, because no one gives a shit about their organization. There would have been no PR hit.

That exactly, if any of us punched our wives in the face it's unlikely our jobs would even know about it unless our wives called them.  Thus. we wouldn't get suspended for 1 day from our jobs if we didn't end up in jail for any extended period of time.  Most of have personal conduct and ethics clauses in our offer letters / employment agreements but that doesn't mean your company will ever find out about what you did unless your famous.

The NFL is making a big deal out of it because they got caught in a cover up and they are trying to use mis-direction to get people to focus on other things to avoid having to answer for the Outside the Lines report.

[Slice of Life]

I'm not sure what your point is. Hope is standing trial. How has her treatment been lenient?

http://www.kicksonfire.com/2014/09/19/double-standard-nike-remains-silent-reagrding-hope-solos-domestic-violence-charges/

There ya go.

Still getting paid by Nike.

[Lihu]

I'm not understanding where this argument is heading. Spousal abuse and child abuse is just that, abuse. When a person can fight back, it seems like it is not an abusive situation. It's more like a mutual combatant one. If a large 260 pound man attacks a 120 pound one, and that 120 pound one can't protect himself that fits my definition of abuse. If two people of approximate skill level and size fight each other that's not abuse. If one of them refuses to fight while the other one pummels him, that is abuse again. The situation dictates whether it is mutual combat or abuse. There does not seems to be an easy answer, and that's why you need to look at each case individually.

[Golfingdad]

So would you be more outraged if the woman was a trained professional MMA fighter, and the teenage boy was gay?

On the list of most ridiculous random hypotheticals, this one is pretty high up there.  ;)

However, it does bring up a good point about what exactly we mean when we say "outrage."  Does it mean how bad we think the act is, or does it mean how much we tend to care about it?

In the case of Hope Solo, I am considerably less outraged using either definition.  It's way less egregious of an act and I really don't care that much about her or women's soccer.

But I do know of one case that happened recently that is not too different than your goofy example.  Here: http://espn.go.com/mma/story/_/id/11460495/war-machine-appears-court-faces-life-jail

A trained MMA star nearly beat to death his (porn star - be careful using google ;)) ex girlfriend.  How many people even know about this?  It's MMA and porn, not the NFL.

So in the first definition of "outraged" I am appalled.  However, in the second definition, the one I think we're talking about, it barely registers, because nobody really cares about either like they do the NFL.  It's not worth much more of our time than Bubba down the street who beat his wife.

[newtogolf]

I'm not understanding where this argument is heading.

Spousal abuse and child abuse is just that, abuse. When a person can fight back, it seems like it is not an abusive situation. It's more like a mutual combatant one.

If a large 260 pound man attacks a 120 pound one, and that 120 pound one can't protect himself that fits my definition of abuse. If two people of approximate skill level and size fight each other that's not abuse. If one of them refuses to fight while the other one pummels him, that is abuse again.

The situation dictates whether it is mutual combat or abuse. There does not seems to be an easy answer, and that's why you need to look at each case individually.

Domestic violence (closely related to domestic abuse , spousal abuse , battering , family violence and intimate partner violence ) is a pattern of behavior which involves violence or other abuse by one person against another in a domestic context, such as in marriage or cohabitation . Intimate partner violence is domestic violence against a spouse or other intimate partner. Domestic violence can take place in heterosexual or same-sex relationships. Domestic violence can take a number of forms including physical , emotional , verbal , economic and sexual abuse , which can range from subtle, coercive forms to marital rape and to violent physical abuse that results in disfigurement or death. Globally, a wife or female partner is most commonly the victim of domestic violence, though the victim can also be the male partner, or both partners may engage in abusive or violent behavior, or the victim may act in self-defense or retaliation.

[RJH999]

On the list of most ridiculous random hypotheticals, this one is pretty high up there.  ;) However, it does bring up a good point about what exactly we mean when we say "outrage."  Does it mean how bad we think the act is, or does it mean how much we tend to care about it? In the case of Hope Solo, I am considerably less outraged using either definition.  It's way less egregious of an act and I really don't care that much about her or women's soccer. But I do know of one case that happened recently that is not too different than your goofy example.  Here: [URL=http://espn.go.com/mma/story/_/id/11460495/war-machine-appears-court-faces-life-jail]http://espn.go.com/mma/story/_/id/11460495/war-machine-appears-court-faces-life-jail[/URL] A trained MMA star nearly beat to death his (porn star - be careful using google ;)) ex girlfriend.  How many people even know about this?  It's MMA and porn, not the NFL. So in the first definition of "outraged" I am appalled.  However, in the second definition, the one I think we're talking about, it barely registers, because nobody really cares about either like they do the NFL.  It's not worth much more of our time than Bubba down the street who beat his wife.

I thought this was a fairly big story. I saw it float up on several sites. War Machine brutally beat the shit out of Christy Mack.

[newtogolf]

On the list of most ridiculous random hypotheticals, this one is pretty high up there.  ;)

However, it does bring up a good point about what exactly we mean when we say "outrage."  Does it mean how bad we think the act is, or does it mean how much we tend to care about it?

In the case of Hope Solo, I am considerably less outraged using either definition.  It's way less egregious of an act and I really don't care that much about her or women's soccer.

But I do know of one case that happened recently that is not too different than your goofy example.  Here: http://espn.go.com/mma/story/_/id/11460495/war-machine-appears-court-faces-life-jail

A trained MMA star nearly beat to death his (porn star - be careful using google ;)) ex girlfriend.  How many people even know about this?  It's MMA and porn, not the NFL.

So in the first definition of "outraged" I am appalled.  However, in the second definition, the one I think we're talking about, it barely registers, because nobody really cares about either like they do the NFL.  It's not worth much more of our time than Bubba down the street who beat his wife.

I follow MMA so I knew about War Machine (his legal name btw).  Not only did he beat his girlfriend to near death he did a number on the guy she slept with.

My point in a follow up post is that what Rice and AP did happens every day in America, we get outraged by Rice and AP because the media forced us into their private lives and we witnessed the abuse.

[Lihu]

Domestic violence (closely related to domestic abuse , spousal abuse , battering , family violence and intimate partner violence ) is a pattern of behavior which involves [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence][U][COLOR=0066CC]violence[/COLOR][/U][/URL] or other [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abuse][U][COLOR=0066CC]abuse[/COLOR][/U][/URL] by one person against another in a domestic context, such as in [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage][U][COLOR=0066CC]marriage[/COLOR][/U][/URL] or [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cohabitation][U][COLOR=0066CC]cohabitation[/COLOR][/U][/URL]. [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intimate_partner_violence][U][COLOR=0066CC]Intimate partner violence[/COLOR][/U][/URL] is domestic violence against a spouse or other intimate partner. Domestic violence can take place in [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosexuality][U][COLOR=0066CC]heterosexual[/COLOR][/U][/URL] or [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_relationship][U][COLOR=0066CC]same-sex[/COLOR][/U][/URL] relationships. Domestic violence can take a number of forms including [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_abuse][U][COLOR=0066CC]physical[/COLOR][/U][/URL], [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional_abuse][U][COLOR=0066CC]emotional[/COLOR][/U][/URL], [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verbal_abuse][U][COLOR=0066CC]verbal[/COLOR][/U][/URL], [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_abuse][U][COLOR=0066CC]economic[/COLOR][/U][/URL] and [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_abuse][U][COLOR=0066CC]sexual abuse[/COLOR][/U][/URL], which can range from subtle, coercive forms to [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marital_rape][U][COLOR=0066CC]marital rape[/COLOR][/U][/URL] and to violent physical abuse that results in disfigurement or death. Globally, a wife or female partner is most commonly the victim of domestic violence, though the victim can also be the male partner, or both partners may engage in abusive or violent behavior, or the victim may act in self-defense or retaliation.

It's also possible that there is emotional and mental abuse which is retaliated with physical abuse. The are just so many cases like the ones you outlined, It doesn't look like there is one clear and simple answer.

[newtogolf]

It's also possible that there is emotional and mental abuse which is retaliated with physical abuse.

The are just so many cases like the ones you outlined, It doesn't look like there is one clear and simple answer.

Exactly, it's a very complicated situation and the NFL attempts to make every occurrence fit into a neat and defined policy just isn't realistic.

[jamo]

[URL=http://www.kicksonfire.com/2014/09/19/double-standard-nike-remains-silent-reagrding-hope-solos-domestic-violence-charges/]http://www.kicksonfire.com/2014/09/19/double-standard-nike-remains-silent-reagrding-hope-solos-domestic-violence-charges/[/URL] There ya go. Still getting paid by Nike.

That doesn't refute what I said at all. Nike is no different than the NFL or whatever soccer team employs Hope Solo. If people keep making the Solo/Rice comparison, and the media catches onto it, and Nike starts taking a PR hit, maybe they'll drop her. But it won't be because they have a conscience, it'll be because they were taking a PR hit.

[Slice of Life]

That doesn't refute what I said at all. Nike is no different than the NFL or whatever soccer team employs Hope Solo. If people keep making the Solo/Rice comparison, and the media catches onto it, and Nike starts taking a PR hit, maybe they'll drop her. But it won't be because they have a conscience, it'll be because they were taking a PR hit.

Fair enough.

[mmoan2]

http://preview.msn.com/en-us/sports/nhl/flames-president-violent-athletes-dont-deserve-paychecks/ar-BB4KHOD

MMoan....there u have it.

Thanks for the link, but I'm not going to change my mind because the Calgary Flames president disagrees with me. If the NHL decides that's what they want to do, they're entitled to their opinion.

As an aside, I never had respect for hockey because it allows fighting as a legitimate part of its sport. You played college football. How many times did you want to stop after a play when you got a cheap shot and just start a fistfight with the guy? I always believed that team contact sports should require you to channel your anger into constructive ways to win the game. Hockey fighting is just stupid to me. But again, just my opinion.