Lofts

[Alohaed]

I see the lofts vary between GI irons, GI/Player irons, SGI, etc. They vary between 1 and 3 degrees. For the delofted, are you really hitting them longer, or because many irons are made to get the ball in the air easier, the distances will not change much?

[dwade247]

Depends on the club and how it is set up. Also depends on the golfer

[lumpuckeroo]

Depends on the club and how it is set up. Also depends on the golfer

I would completely agree, but generally speaking I would bet that you will hit the club with the stronger loft further.

[vangator]

Loft is the biggest determinant of distance. I have single length irons and I have about a 10-15 yard gap with the 5* loft increments. Manufacturers today tout more distance with their irons but much of it is due to stronger lofts. Don't buy into it.

[rdsandy]

Loft is the biggest determinant of distance. I have single length irons and I have about a 10-15 yard gap with the 5* loft increments. Manufacturers today tout more distance with their irons but much of it is due to stronger lofts. Don't buy into it.

+1

[saevel25]

Loft is the biggest determinant of distance. I have single length irons and I have about a 10-15 yard gap with the 5* loft increments. Manufacturers today tout more distance with their irons but much of it is due to stronger lofts. Don't buy into it.

It isn't easy as that. Loft is a big determinant. Also longer clubs are much lighter than shorter as well as overall length. I believe the trackman averages for PGA Tour pros so a 2 mph difference between clubs. You would not see that much gap with single length clubs due to the same length and closer weighting. The difference would be the shorter irons would be less accurate because they are longer and the longer would be more accurate because they are shorter.

There is more to stronger lofts as well. Irons have become more forgiving and have lower CG. Remember, CG can greatly increase the launch angle even with stronger lofts. Also this has helped many amateurs who struggle with longer irons. Before many amateurs would max out their longest irons with their 5 or 6 iron. Now with lower CG, higher forgiveness they area able to hit that 4 iron much longer and get proper gaping. Even still they are also hitting that iron higher even though it is a lower lofted club.

Should people be comparing distances, no. People should just be finding clubs that instill confidence in their game and have proper gaping. Really it doesn't matter about length with irons. In the end they are designed to have correct gaps, if they are all strong then a gap wedge will probably be needed.

[Alohaed]

Thanks. And I do not want delofted/strong irons to add distance. I can do that on my own and/or with the proper shaft. I like the looks of the Ping G30 irons, yet their 4 iron is 21*, most 3 irons. My MX200 is 23, and most other 4s are 24*. When will it stop? Who knows, there might even be 4 irons out there with 20*, 19*.

BTW, speaking of Ping, anyone know if they will come out with I30 irons?

[dwade247]

Thanks. And I do not want delofted/strong irons to add distance. I can do that on my own and/or with the proper shaft. I like the looks of the Ping G30 irons, yet their 4 iron is 21*, most 3 irons. My MX200 is 23, and most other 4s are 24*. When will it stop? Who knows, there might even be 4 irons out there with 20*, 19*.

BTW, speaking of Ping, anyone know if they will come out with I30 irons?

Just don't worry about the numbers on the bottom of the clubs. Get the irons you hit well. If that means you have 4-GW or 5-GW or 6-GW it doesn't matter. Just get the clubs you can "consistently" hit well at reasonable distance gaps.

Lower CGs are supposed to launch the ball higher but with the cranked lofts this does not always happen. Basically making GI irons just big headed irons that may give you a little more forgiveness on mishits, however I don't personally really buy into that either.

[vangator]

It isn't easy as that. Loft is a big determinant. Also longer clubs are much lighter than shorter as well as overall length. I believe the trackman averages for PGA Tour pros so a 2 mph difference between clubs. You would not see that much gap with single length clubs due to the same length and closer weighting. The difference would be the shorter irons would be less accurate because they are longer and the longer would be more accurate because they are shorter.  There is more to stronger lofts as well. Irons have become more forgiving and have lower CG. Remember, CG can greatly increase the launch angle even with stronger lofts. Also this has helped many amateurs who struggle with longer irons. Before many amateurs would max out their longest irons with their 5 or 6 iron. Now with lower CG, higher forgiveness they area able to hit that 4 iron much longer and get proper gaping. Even still they are also hitting that iron higher even though it is a lower lofted club.  Should people be comparing distances, no. People should just be finding clubs that instill confidence in their game and have proper gaping. Really it doesn't matter about length with irons. In the end they are designed to have correct gaps, if they are all strong then a gap wedge will probably be needed.

I agree but manufacturers have still cranked the lofts down. I have an old club building guide (been building clubs for 30+ years). Lofts have been cranked down and shaft lengths have increased 1/2 for the same number iron.

[saevel25]

I agree but manufacturers have still cranked the lofts down. I have an old club building guide (been building clubs for 30+ years). Lofts have been cranked down and shaft lengths have increased 1/2 for the same number iron.

Yet clubs are more forgiving and higher launching. It doesn't matter. In the end it benefits the player because it actually allows them to hit long irons correct distances. In the end you still end up with 7 or 8 irons that range from PW or Gap Wedge to 3 or 4 iron. Each clubs has about a 10-12 yards of gap.

I don't see why big uproar about it.

[trickyputt]

I cant hit any longer than that R1 driver, so gapping the rest is the first thing. Ball flight so they stop or fly predictably is second. Fooling people into thinking I am a player is probably in there but last.

[Jakester23]

Yet clubs are more forgiving and higher launching. It doesn't matter. In the end it benefits the player because it actually allows them to hit long irons correct distances. In the end you still end up with 7 or 8 irons that range from PW or Gap Wedge to 3 or 4 iron. Each clubs has about a 10-12 yards of gap.  I don't see why big uproar about it.

I feel like some golfers get to hung up on the number on the iron. Like Matt is saying you will have 6-8 irons in your bag what's the difference how long they are or what the loft is. My old set didn't have a gw but came with a 3i. My current set had a gw but stops at 4i. It makes no difference to me what the clubs says I just want to make sure I have the right one for my 150 shot, 165 shot ect...

[WUTiger]

The average golfer can hit the stronger-lofted SGI irons longer AND higher than GI or Player's irons. Higher launch angle leads to more carry and more distance for persons with low to average swing speed. The reason lays partially with the clubhead design of the SGI irons, which have a lower Vertical Center of Gravity then the other two.

Club designers talk to Golf Digest about head design in a 2013 article:

http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-equipment/2013-11/new-looks-game-improvement-irons

[onthehunt526]

WUTiger is right... the SGI irons CG is very low compared to the other two... The loft creep has effected all categories of irons, but I used to think it was that simple... but it's not... Players irons for the most part have been effected by the "decreasing loft disease" the least, but then again the center of gravity in players irons hasn't gotten much lower... GI and SGI have been effected so much because of the lower CG... I honestly don't see iron lofts getting much stronger though... Just my $1.98

[TimS65]

I noticed the specs for the new Callaway XR irons - I believe the 4 iron is 20.5 °. Is there any chance that a high handicapper can hit that? If with the CoG and hot face it IS use able, then fair enough. But the though of hitting an iron of that low loft scares me...

[onthehunt526]

I noticed the specs for the new Callaway XR irons - I believe the 4 iron is 20.5 °. Is there any chance that a high handicapper can hit that? If with the CoG and hot face it IS use able, then fair enough. But the though of hitting an iron of that low loft scares me...

Yes I would say it's you can hit it... The TM Speedblade 4-iron is 20°, its heritable because of how low the CG is... its not like hitting a forged blade 2-iron from 1975... Just so you know... like I stated in my previous post... I think that lofts can't get much lower... because I don't know how much lower the CG can get... Wilson tried with their DI9 irons and DI11 to release a PW with 42.5° loft... it works to an extent... but creates a problem where you are forced to play 2 gap wedges... At least Titleist with the AP1 got smart and has 2 gap wedges with the 714 model anyway... I believe that the loft creep is basically done in irons, you can't really go much lower with the lofts because you can't get much lower with the CG, Players irons CG probably won't change much, might go fractionally lower... but the lofts won't change much, you'll probably see a 30-32° 6-iron and 46-48° PW as std lofts in players irons for a while... 26-29° 6-iron in SGI, 43-46° PW 27-30° 6-iron in GI, 44-46° PW I'm just spitballing but I might not know what the hell I'm talking about

[dkolo]

I noticed the specs for the new Callaway XR irons - I believe the 4 iron is 20.5 °. Is there any chance that a high handicapper can hit that? If with the CoG and hot face it IS use able, then fair enough. But the though of hitting an iron of that low loft scares me...

I hit the 4 iron of its predecessor, the X2 Hot, and I had no trouble with it. I assume they're fairly comparable. I would have still gone with a hybrid if I were buying a set to replace the 4 iron because I get a hybrid higher and don't play anywhere where wind is a huge factor, so I don't need that low flight of an iron. I also felt like I had to focus on making a better strike with the 4i. But, that said, I was amazed by how easy hitting the 4i was compared to my expectations going in and standing over the ball (it looks scary with so little loft). Long way of saying the stated loft doesn't reflect how easy or hard it is to hit these clubs because they've done such a good job of moving weight around for forgiveness and launch. Same loft in a blade or a 10 year old club would be another story.

[WUTiger]

I noticed the specs for the new Callaway XR irons - I believe the 4 iron is 20.5 °. Is there any chance that a high handicapper can hit that? If with the CoG and hot face it IS use able, then fair enough. But the though of hitting an iron of that low loft scares me...

Two big factors would be clubhead speed and shaft flex.

You already have the very low VCOG in the XR clubhead, and cup-face technology borrowed from the fairway woods. According to the XR promo, this increases both MOI and ball speed. You're getting help from the clubhead, so the next thing would be do you have the right shaft, and sufficient clubhead speed.

All things equal, the more clubhead speed you generate, the higher you'll launch the ball. And, for mid- to hi-HDCP players, the higher launch leads to more carry and more distance.

On the other hand, players with 100 MPH driver swingspeed would likely balloon their iron shots with a low VCOG clubhead.

What you probably need to do is a gap analysis for your irons, to find out where hybrids or high-loft FWs might best join your set. Let's say  you get these results (as many do):

• 6i = 155 yds.
• 5i = 165 yds.
• 4i = 158 yds. !!! You would need to drop the 4i and go with a hybrid, which would give you better hits than a 4i.

With my SLDR irons, I am undecided on how "low to go" in my iron mix. Recent TaylorMade irons, including the SLDR, have the Thru-Slot technology in 3i-7i. This polymer insert travels from the sole up through the back of the clubhead. It really helps on the launch of the longer clubs.

Here's my "happy" problem: The set goes 4-AW, and from off the tee I can hit laser-straight shots with the 4i. Off a tee they actually go a bit longer than my 4H. The 4i is superb as a driving iron, BUT the 4H is more reliable off the fairway or out of light rough. So, what should I do?

My pro suggested I carry the 4i for our home course, which has three devilish short par 4s that can wreck your round. A ball in the fairway on these is a lifesaver. For more open courses, he suggested I swap to the 4H, to get more versatility.

I guess it depends how much value I get on a given day from a dedicated "driving iron."