2015 Arnold Palmer Invitational Discussion Thread

[iacas]

Could you tell by LOOKING by Patrick Reed that he is a much better golfer than Harris English? Wouldn't you guess the opposite?

No, but that's a pointless question. Made wasn't intimidating physically. Nor are many hockey players. Lydia Ko doesn't look like a dominant golfer (nor Stacy Lewis) but they're currently kicking the snot out of, say, Michelle Wie and Lexi Thompson.

Your arguments are getting weird now.

And if the "athleticism" we are talking about is mainly hand-eye coordination

It's not. The ability to generate speed is an athletic talent too.

And if the "athleticism" we are talking about is mainly hand-eye coordination, then we get back to my point about Morgan Hoffmann not being able to become Phil Mickelson by going to the gym - but in a slightly different way.

No we don't. They have different skill levels (or from what we've seen so far - for all you know Morgan Hoffman goes on to win 10 major championships).

Let's say that the intelligence of which I speak is the ability to DEPLOY superb hand-eye coordination situationally.

It's not. That's just redefining athleticism as "intelligence."

I still think the "mental game" is phenomenally important as a separating factor among professional sports players

I don't, and "some guy who doesn't play golf thinks it is" is not a very convincing argument.

If I am COMPLETELY wrong about the importance of intelligence, then maybe in certain sports (and in certain positions in other sports), it does pretty much all boil down to hand-eye coordination, which is very largely a genetic factor assisted by repetitive practice. The gym is not going to help there, either.

It's not just hand-eye coordination.

My guess is that the jury is still out on whether physical conditioning can make a good professional golfer a much better one. Tiger didn't improve after all the weightlifting, but who knows what the causes and effects are there. Whether Rory has benefited in the long run by so assiduously hitting the weights himself will play out over time.

Uhm…? Tiger won 14 majors and Rory has four. You can't say what they'd have done at all. For all you know Tiger would have gotten three. Or 22.

I don't think the level of visible fitness or lack of it in a golfer tells us very much at all.

The appearance of someone is not a great way to show off their athleticism. John Daly was incredibly athletic. Phil Mickelson too. Tiger was when he was a stick and how he looked two years ago, too.

If that's all you were trying to say, this discussion is silly, and I'm tapping out now.

[dkolo]

Could you tell by LOOKING by Patrick Reed that he is a much better golfer than Harris English? Wouldn't you guess the opposite?

And if the "athleticism" we are talking about is mainly hand-eye coordination, then we get back to my point about Morgan Hoffmann not being able to become Phil Mickelson by going to the gym - but in a slightly different way. Let's say that the intelligence of which I speak is the ability to DEPLOY superb hand-eye coordination situationally. We'll take Phil's, and Tiger's, and Greg Maddux's, and Randy Johnson's phenomenal hand-eye coordination as givens. I agree, they are all in the 99.99th percentile that way. I still think the "mental game" is phenomenally important as a separating factor among professional sports players, virtually all of whom have hand-eye coordination that would beggar yours or mine. We are comparing apples to apples, right?

If I am COMPLETELY wrong about the importance of intelligence, then maybe in certain sports (and in certain positions in other sports), it does pretty much all boil down to hand-eye coordination, which is very largely a genetic factor assisted by repetitive practice. The gym is not going to help there, either.

My guess is that the jury is still out on whether physical conditioning can make a good professional golfer a much better one. Tiger didn't improve after all the weightlifting, but who knows what the causes and effects are there. Whether Rory has benefited in the long run by so assiduously hitting the weights himself will play out over time.

Remember, the original post I was responding to was comparing visuals of "fit golfer" with "unfit golfer," and that is what I have been responding to. I don't think the level of visible fitness or lack of it in a golfer tells us very much at all. I don't think I need to be a golfer myself to know that. I just have to look at Patrick Reed's belly!

If you wanted to become a better golfer and couldn't hit golf balls (let's say it's winter), would you do things to improve your mental game, like reading, studying strategy, mental psychology, whatever; or would you go to the gym and work on rotational strength, explosiveness, and glute activation (wokka wokka)? In this hypo, it's one or the other. If you'd choose the former, I very much disagree with you.

[Rick Martin]

1. 2015 Arnold Palmer

   Mar 19-22 - Bay Hill Course - Orlando, Florida, United States - Purse: $6,300,000

   Leaderboard - Ongoing		R1	R2	R3	R4	Total	Thru
   1	Henrik Stenson	-4	-6	-6	–	-16	18
   2	Morgan Hoffmann	-6	-7	-1	–	-14	18
   T3	Matt Jones	-1	-7	-5	–	-13	18
   T3	Matt Every	-4	-6	-3	–	-13	18
   T3	Jason Kokrak	-5	-1	-7	–	-13	18
   T3	Ben Martin	-4	-5	-4	–	-13	18
   7	Sean O'Hair	-3	-4	-4	–	-11	18
   T8	Kevin Na	-5	-2	-3	–	-10	18
   T8	Brendan Steele	-1	-5	-4	–	-10	18
   T8	Kiradech Aphibarnrat	-2	-1	-7	–	-10	18

what was I thinking when I posted World's Number One making a charge? For what ? 3rd place?  Don't think Stenson will pull and Adam Scott like last year and lose it - should be an interesting Sunday......

[Crim]

Henrik Stenson is probably the coolest golfer on tour IMO. I know this has been referenced before, but the dude looks like a terminator when he crushes the ball and then stares it down in the air. Add to that...the most clever humor on tour. Not every interview...but almost every interview he says something that makes me legit laugh out loud.

Just last week he was asked about John Daly's performance enhancing drugs comment...his response to PED's allowing you to hit "Long & Straight"...

"It depends on what you're looking for and I mean there's rules for everything that's on those lists but, again, I've said that before. Long and straight. Viagra might be the only one that's going to get you anywhere. I don't know. What else? I don't know what else you take for performance enhancement in golf. I don't know."

[Crim]

Featured group this morning is Rickie Fowler and Hideki Matsuyama.

http://pgatour.cbssports.com/live/?media=492137

[Rick Martin]

Agree on Stenson. Reminds me of those top strong minded Swedes over the years (Annika,Bjorn, Edberg)

Almost headed over to Orlando this a.m. to see the early groups but decided to watch online and the HDTV. Headed down to Miami tomorrow for another sport viewing.....Miami Open early rounds......

[Gunther]

Wow, very interesting factoid on Morgan Hoffman by our boy BC: he's 100th on tour in swing speed yet 18th in driving distance. I've always equated distance with speed. Obviously I recognize launch angle and spin play a role but had no idea a gap like that could be possible.

[newtogolf]

I just saw on GC that Brooks Koepka  injured himself swinging (dislocated rib) and he won't withdraw.  Pretty gutsy move from the kid.

[newtogolf]

I just saw on GC that Brooks Koepka  injured himself swinging (dislocated rib) and he won't withdraw.  Pretty gutsy move from the kid.

That didn't take long, he withdrew on 12.  I don't blame him, I learned last year how much it hurts to play golf with a rib injury.

[Crim]

That didn't take long, he withdrew on 12.  I don't blame him, I learned last year how much it hurts to play golf with a rib injury.

There definitely goes my money bet at DK.

Hoping for a fast recovery so he can play pain free at Augusta.

[nevets88]

Boy, that McIlroy, he always had a big head.

[Crim]

hahahahahahahahahah....W...T....F

[nevets88]

I made a little highlights package from yesterday, no copyright notice yet. NBC doesn't do as many slow motion replays as CBS. And not as many shots. Most interesting slow motion is the driver against the scoreboard.

[KeithWOODS]

I just started watching the match today. What's wrong with the greens? They look horrible? Is that damage to the turf?

[Rick Martin]

I just started watching the match today. What's wrong with the greens? They look horrible? Is that damage to the turf?

They're going to completely re-do them in May.....I think they're rye overseed over the bermuda....we've had a very warm winter here in FLA and I think rye takes better in colder temps....maybe that had something to do with it........see earlier conversation in the thread about greens. I was there Tuesday and overheard Jason Day during his pract round complaining to his caddy how bad the greens were -

[KeithWOODS]

They're going to completely re-do them in May.....I think they're rye overseed over the bermuda....we've had a very warm winter here in FLA and I think rye takes better in colder temps....maybe that had something to do with it........see earlier conversation in the thread about greens. I was there Tuesday and overheard Jason Day during his pract round complaining to his caddy how bad the greens were -

Thank you. I was figuring that it wasn't repaired due to an upcoming rehab but some of them are really bad perhaps a little work could have been done. Thanks again.

[Crim]

Did Stenson seriously put that fairway bunker shot to 4 feet? Wow.

Both players in the final group make birdie on hole #1

[David in FL]

That didn't take long, he withdrew on 12.  I don't blame him, I learned last year how much it hurts to play golf with a rib injury.

QFT. I've played for over 20 years with a chronic bad back, but I took 1 tentative swing after breaking 2 ribs a couple of years ago and promptly packed the clubs away for 6 weeks!