What would Tiger Woods need to do to become #1 Greatest Golfer?

[skydog]

LOLOLOLOL.  You can't even take a shot at it?  I promise, if after the fact you do not like the result and you want to shuffle them around, I will allow it.  What I want to see is a) # of events entered, b ) # of wins, and c) number of majors won.  So you choose.  It will not matter.

And do not make assumptions and claims about what I might or might not do.   Certainly if I use the info in  a way you feel is unfair you will have ample opportunity to rebut it and I suspect you will have assistance in that area as well,m from other posters.

As to the part of your post I didn't quote, it is just blah blah blah of what you have said 1000 (hyperbole alert)  times.  This is something different.  I have no doubt that the challenge will be dodged again, as it always has by every Jack supporter to whom it has been issued.  Prove me wrong.

Dude, chill the F down. I was sincerely asking a question in my post and you repsond with nothing but attitude. I would genuinely try your game if I knew what the criteria was for 'ranking' a season. I thought maybe you had explained your thought process better in another thread (ergo I  asked if I was missing something which it appears I'm not). You could try answering my question and explaning your ranking instead of responding with nothing but sarcasm and attitude.

So I'll try again as an example- is a one major win season better than a 5 tour win season?

[Golfingdad]

Dude, chill the F down. I was sincerely asking a question in my post and you repsond with nothing but attitude. I would genuinely try your game if I knew what the criteria was for 'ranking' a season. I thought maybe you had explained your thought process better in another thread (ergo I  asked if I was missing something which it appears I'm not). You could try answering my question and explaning your ranking instead of responding with nothing but sarcasm and attitude.

So I'll try again as an example- is a one major win season better than a 5 tour win season?

You read waaaaay more into that post than I see.  Sure, he found humor in the fact that you didn't take his challenge, but nothing else he wrote comes across as not "chilled down" to me.  Just all matter-of-fact-ish.

[Aflighter]

To be considered the greatest to me would be difficult because one , Ive never cared for his attitude not unlike alot of pros and probably cause the media has always kissed his butt.As someone who fell in love with golf way before Tiger was ever heard of I feel alot of Tiger fans are more a fan of him than the game and probably younger people.Personally to me he would have to make a comeback and be atleast top 5 in the world again and win but that will never happen because its a young mans game now and hes washed up.

[GreatestGolfers]

Your method does not remove any subjectivity, it simply hides it a little deeper.  Any such method has no intrinsic credibility and resides just as much in the realm of pure opinion, as a non-numerical opinion.

LOLOLOLOL.  You can't even take a shot at it?  I promise, if after the fact you do not like the result and you want to shuffle them around, I will allow it.  What I want to see is a) # of events entered, b ) # of wins, and c) number of majors won.  So you choose.  It will not matter.

And do not make assumptions and claims about what I might or might not do.   Certainly if I use the info in  a way you feel is unfair you will have ample opportunity to rebut it and I suspect you will have assistance in that area as well,m from other posters.

As to the part of your post I didn't quote, it is just blah blah blah of what you have said 1000 (hyperbole alert)  times.  This is something different.  I have no doubt that the challenge will be dodged again, as it always has by every Jack supporter to whom it has been issued.  Prove me wrong.

You are quite sarcastic to new members.

For someone who knocks hard on other's views (most posts are just that) - you come forward with few facts and a strong opinion if your own - It does little to encourage debate or add value.

[GreatestGolfers]

You read waaaaay more into that post than I see.  Sure, he found humor in the fact that you didn't take his challenge, but nothing else he wrote comes across as not "chilled down" to me.  Just all matter-of-fact-ish.

Maybe he has in previous threads, if so, please repost, if not - why not provide some "matter-of-fact-ish" himself.

I look forward to seeing him take himself up on his own challenge - prove himself right.

[Golfingdad]

Maybe he has in previous threads, if so, please repost, if not - why not provide some "matter-of-fact-ish" himself.

I look forward to seeing him take himself up on his own challenge - prove himself right.

Not maybe ... definitely.  He's made those points countless times in the Tiger vs. Jack thread.  Not to mention the various other slightly different threads (just like this one) where he's repeated himself as well.  You can hardly blame him when he occasionally wants to take a rest.

Also, he's a teacher, so it makes sense when he asks people to do some of their own research.

[GreatestGolfers]

Not maybe ... definitely.  He's made those points countless times in the Tiger vs. Jack thread.  Not to mention the various other slightly different threads (just like this one) where he's repeated himself as well.  You can hardly blame him when he occasionally wants to take a rest.

Also, he's a teacher, so it makes sense when he asks people to do some of their own research.

By all means let him take a rest. If he's a teacher, he'll encourage learning by new students point them in the right direction - let him give the sarcasm a rest too.

[iacas]

If I wanted to do this excercise I wouldn't know where to start, because unless I'm missing something, I don't know how we would objectively or formulaically rank one season 'better' or 'worse' than another. Which do you characterize as better- a Jack sesason where he won nothing besides the Masters or a Tiger season where he won no majors but won 5 tour events? By your math with this 15 year claim I'm guessing you are calling the latter the 'better' season but this seems highly subjective unless I'm missing something, which I very well may be.

How about you just try it? If you start to get better Jack seasons at #10 with a major in a year when Tiger didn't, so be it.

It's not a trick. Just rank them how you want to rank them. Starts, wins, majors. If Rick disagrees, he'll tell you, but you get to do the ranking he'll discuss yourself. You don't even have to debate HIS ranking - you get to make it.

Comparing golf to other sports, tour events are the regular season and the majors are the playoffs. What you do in the regular season matters but it's what you do in the playoffs that defines your legacy.

Baseball has 162 regular season games. Hockey and basketball have 82 or so. They're not regular season games. Not even close.

If forced to endure this multi-sport-comparison stuff, it'd be more like regular PGA Tour events are playoff wins. Majors are Super Bowl, Stanley Cup, World Series, etc. victories. But really it's virtually pointless to compare the PGA Tour to other sports. Especially when done like this. Last time I checked NFL teams couldn't opt to play a game or not, didn't compete against every other team at the same time after being reset to 0-0 each week, didn't play for four HUGE events per year, etc. Just pointless.

[jbishop15]

To be considered the greatest to me would be difficult because one , Ive never cared for his attitude not unlike alot of pros and probably cause the media has always kissed his butt.As someone who fell in love with golf way before Tiger was ever heard of I feel alot of Tiger fans are more a fan of him than the game and probably younger people.Personally to me he would have to make a comeback and be atleast top 5 in the world again and win but that will never happen because its a young mans game now and hes washed up.

A lot pros like Tiger. And I personally think Sergio Garcia is a crybaby douchebag but that doesn't stop me from recognizing his enormous skill and strong career. I also don't much like Greg Norman, but I'm not going to deny his place in golf history.

[mtsalmela80]

Is it me or does 50% of the Tour Talk forum merely consist of childish bickering about Tiger this or Tiger that. Why doesn't Tiger have his own forum in the clubhouse yet? Admins?

[jbishop15]

Is it me or does 50% of the Tour Talk forum merely consist of childish bickering about Tiger this or Tiger that. Why doesn't Tiger have his own forum in the clubhouse yet? Admins?

It's just you. The vast majority of the Tour Talk section isn't about TW.

[iacas]

Is it me or does 50% of the Tour Talk forum merely consist of childish bickering about Tiger this or Tiger that. Why doesn't Tiger have his own forum in the clubhouse yet? Admins?

Because it's just you.

Now, please contribute something to the thread, or go back to your TW voodoo doll.

[skydog]

Dude, chill the F down. I was sincerely asking a question in my post and you repsond with nothing but attitude. I would genuinely try your game if I knew what the criteria was for 'ranking' a season. I thought maybe you had explained your thought process better in another thread (ergo I  asked if I was missing something which it appears I'm not). You could try answering my question and explaning your ranking instead of responding with nothing but sarcasm and attitude.

So I'll try again as an example- is a one major win season better than a 5 tour win season?

OK fair enough...just wanted to make sure there wasn't some formula here that I was missing. I still don't really understand what point you all are trying to make with this exercise nor do I have the time to do an in-depth analysis of a combined ~45 years or so of tour golf at the moment. That said, I'm guessing I would come to conclusion that Tiger would have 9 better years than Jack (where he was winning majors and had a significantly higher overall winning %) and then Jack would surpass him with his 4 additional years of winning majors to Tiger's major-less years. Either way, whether that number is 9 years or 15 years as some of you claim, I'm not sure how this is supposed to tell us much. We all know Tiger dominated the game in every way shape and form more than Jack and Tiger in his prime was better than Jack in his prime. This has been acknowledged constantly by the 'pro-Jack' crowd so move on.

I'm not the OP or a Mod but this conversation is getting old and going nowhere. I would kindly ask that the discussion shift back to the OP's topic and not be another Jack vs. Tiger thread.

[iacas]

I'm not the OP or a Mod but this conversation is getting old and going nowhere. I would kindly ask that the discussion shift back to the OP's topic and not be another Jack vs. Tiger thread.

Jack is the only person reasonably ahead of Tiger (to some people). It's on topic.

[Rogin]

I agree that, in twenty years' time, people will still hold that 18 majors thing over Tiger, if he doesn't match it. At the end of the day, it's about holding the records, and that's the big one. Woods could win 100 PGA tour events, and people will still say "but he only won 14 majors".

One thing to spice up the debate, though, in the 60s and 70s was the PGA really a "major" in the way it is now? It was always a big event, sure, but it never started inviting a truly international field until the 90s (indeed, nowadays it's the only event that strives to ensure all the top 100 are there) and arguably, in those days, was no more a 'major' than the TPC is now. It became part of the accepted "grand slam" really as a throwaway remark Arnold Palmer made when, after winning the Masters and the US Open (and on his way to the Open) he was asked what it would take to win one (a grand slam). In 1971, one of the ones Jack won, it was played in February. And Sandy Lyle, Masters champion, couldn't even be bothered to travel to it in 1988 (the one Jeff Sluman won).

One could - for amusement - argue that maybe Jack's PGAs from the 60s and 70s be downgraded from "majors" (sorry Dave Stockton) which would put him back onto 14 as well ...

[mtsalmela80]

One could - for amusement - argue that maybe Jack's PGAs from the 60s and 70s be downgraded from "majors" (sorry Dave Stockton) which would put him back onto 14 as well ...

That's pretty much the type of logic people use to elevate Tiger to "GOAT". Field comparisons, scoring averages, etc....

But the fact is he still doesn't hold either the most majors of most pga victories.

He is without a doubt one of the greatest of all time, but not THE greatest of all time.

[inthehole]

As an older dude and new golfer, I missed the whole Tiger in his prime thing ... its just hard for me to believe he'll ever be the GOAT after seeing him play the past few years - seems like it would have to tarnish his record.    I just wish they'd show more of his great golf from his early days on TV - hardly ever see any of it.

[boogielicious]

To be considered the greatest to me would be difficult because one , Ive never cared for his attitude not unlike alot of pros and probably cause the media has always kissed his butt.As someone who fell in love with golf way before Tiger was ever heard of I feel alot of Tiger fans are more a fan of him than the game and probably younger people.Personally to me he would have to make a comeback and be atleast top 5 in the world again and win but that will never happen because its a young mans game now and hes washed up.

Having seen both Jack and Tiger play, I appreciated both of them for their golfing abilities. For me, the media had nothing to do with it.

Remember when Nicklaus first came on the seen, their were legions of fans who hated him and saw him as a brash arrogant person who dared to challenge Arnie.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogin

One could - for amusement - argue that maybe Jack's PGAs from the 60s and 70s be downgraded from "majors" (sorry Dave Stockton) which would put him back onto 14 as well ...

That's pretty much the type of logic people use to elevate Tiger to "GOAT". Field comparisons, scoring averages, etc....

But the fact is he still doesn't hold either the most majors of most pga victories.

He is without a doubt one of the greatest of all time, but not THE greatest of all time.

Woods has more total wins than Snead because he played overseas too. His win % is also unrivaled. The debate will rage on. As I have said before, Woods career is not over, so we cannot make this determination yet.