Question on Shoulders and Stance Alignment Effect on Ball Flight

[Mike Boatright]

Just like to share what seems like basic knowledge known as the stance. I can't believe Iv'e been doing this wrong off and on for who knows how many years. Basically your stance needs to be in direct unison with your imaginary shoulder line or slightly open to the left of your target. This effects hip turn,swing plane,balance impact ball flight it's insane. I have my left foot and sometimes my stance to open and my shoulders dead square. It's the outside of your left foot foot  ''for right hand players'' That's where the weight will drift to on the down swing. For me it was to open my shoulders were square this openness restricted my hip turn and also caused all of my bad shots. I got it right yesterday and boom 275 yards drives with no effort and 190 yard 5 irons on plane in the slot it's so easy when you do this You can figure that you have a 10% chance of hitting a shot as intended if your not in unison vs a 95% chance. No matter what you do in your swing you will be screwed from the start without even knowing it. Having your stance and shoulder level in alignment will allow your downswing and backswing to maintain it's plane and will make the club feel very light and in the slot.

[mvmac]

Just like to share what seems like basic knowledge known as the stance. I can't believe Iv'e been doing this wrong off and on for who knows how many years. Basically your stance needs to be in direct unison with your imaginary shoulder line or slightly open to the left of your target. This effects hip turn,swing plane,balance impact ball flight it's insane. I have my left foot and sometimes my stance to open and my shoulders dead square. It's the outside of your left foot foot  ''for right hand players'' That's where the weight will drift to on the down swing. For me it was to open my shoulders were square this openness restricted my hip turn and also caused all of my bad shots. 

Glad it worked for you but it doesn't mean it's a fundamental. Couples, Trevino, Ryan Moore all aim well left with their body and hit push fades.

And I don't think that guy in the pic has a very good address position. His knees are pinched inward, if anything that will restrict the hip turn. Also his left arm is bent and he doesn't have much axis tilt. 

 

[Mike Boatright]

I agree Ryan moore,Couples a few exceptions to the rule so? You can aim left and hit push fades i'm talking about a baby draw which is kinda the holy grail of golf. The guy is just an illustration showing the line of the shoulders to a square feet line just an example it's hard to find pics online to show what you mean.

[Patch]

I always practice my alignment when at the range.  I have two metal yard sticks I use for that purpose. I use yard sticks because the numbers help with my feet, and ball positions.  No matter what full swing club I am using during practice, I check my alignment. It's just too easy to get away from what's right for whatever swing/ball flight a person has. A person's alignment should match whatever their swing path, and clubface position is into impact. Those who do match up well,are the ones who hit controlled fades, draws, and somewhat straighter shots. I read that in de la Torre's book I think.  

In my case when on the course, If I think I am aimed wrong, that usually means I am actually correctly aimed. If I look up over my lead shoulder, and it's pointed at the target, I know I am actually not aimed well. I suspect it's one of those optical illusions due standing along side of the ball. That's why I never use the pin as a target on full shots. I pick something off to the left of the pin as a target most of the time. Sometimes to the right, if I need a different ball flight.   

[SavvySwede]

I agree Ryan moore,Couples a few exceptions to the rule so? You can aim left and hit push fades i'm talking about a baby draw which is kinda the holy grail of golf. The guy is just an illustration showing the line of the shoulders to a square feet line just an example it's hard to find pics online to show what you mean.

Your title suggested it was a fundamental. There are no exceptions to fundamentals. That's why they are called fundamental.

[Mike Boatright]

Cool good point I have been trying the same for years but still hit awful shots every once in a while and it's because of my stance. You can't really see your stance unless you set up then stand up and look left to see where they are aimed. Your hips are connected to your stance like a swivel if your square or closed a bit at address your already pre set to start a full and level hip turn. The main thing this does is allow you to make a swing that's wide open and in the slot vs stuck to the inside or over the top and across the ball.

 

Your title suggested it was a fundamental. There are no exceptions to fundamentals. That's why they are called fundamental.

I would say it's a fundamental for 100% of all golfers anything else is just an adaptation to the norm.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Mike Boatright

[saevel25]

I would say it's a fundamental for 100% of all golfers anything else is just an adaptation to the norm.

if a good number of golfers are able to play at the highest level with the opposite of a so called fundamental then is not a fundamental.

 

[Mike Boatright]

 

if a good number of golfers are able to play at the highest level with the opposite of a so called fundamental then is not a fundamental.

 

 

I hear what your saying John Daly,lee Trevino,Ryan Moore, Bubba Watson probably hundreds of em. Out of a large sample size though there a little insignificant. The stance is kinda like the grip it's a little bit personal but it's a fundamental the more neutral you have it the more likely you are to hit it straight. My whole point of this topic is how easy it is to mis align yourself on the track and is probably the cause of most decent players misses. 

[Mr. Desmond]

Cool good point I have been trying the same for years but still hit awful shots every once in a while and it's because of my stance. You can't really see your stance unless you set up then stand up and look left to see where they are aimed. Your hips are connected to your stance like a swivel if your square or closed a bit at address your already pre set to start a full and level hip turn. The main thing this does is allow you to make a swing that's wide open and in the slot vs stuck to the inside or over the top and across the ball.

I would say it's a fundamental for 100% of all golfers anything else is just an adaptation to the norm.

What's this about a full and level hip turn? Who keeps their hips level throughout the swing?

 

It's all interesting, but check those hips starting at 4:55

Edited October 11, 2015 by Mr. Desmond

[saevel25]

I hear what your saying John Daly,lee Trevino,Ryan Moore, Bubba Watson probably hundreds of em. Out of a large sample size though there a little insignificant. The stance is kinda like the grip it's a little bit personal but it's a fundamental the more neutral you have it the more likely you are to hit it straight. 

Tell that to the number of people who aim straight and slice and hook the ball off the course. It is not a fundamental. A fundamental is something that all good golfers do to hit a good shot. Alignment is not one of them. 

[phillyk]

I try to maintain a slightly closed stance, but the way I know if I'm aligned to where I want is in my pre-shot routine. I'll take that little back-swing to see if the takeaway is on my target line.  If it is, I'm good to go.  I've tried aligning myself, but I know it's off right now. I'll work on it once winter hits. I don't want to change too much with tournaments still coming up.

[Mike Boatright]

What's this about a full and level hip turn? Who keeps their hips level throughout the swing?

 

It's all interesting, but check those hips starting at 4:55

 

 

That's just what I feel he is hitting it on the upswing good swing. On his backswing his hips are in unison with his shoulder alignment. This swivel is kinda the depiction i'm talking about two separate parts working as one. The more you have them together from the get go the more likely they will work together better.

Tell that to the number of people who aim straight and slice and hook the ball off the course. It is not a fundamental. A fundamental is something that all good golfers do to hit a good shot. Alignment is not one of them. 

Just like a proper grip it doesn't guarantee success give someone a perfect grip and a perfect set up and they might slice it because they suck and just are a terrible athlete and aren't likely to succeed at golf 

Edited October 11, 2015 by Mike Boatright

[SavvySwede]

 

 

That's just what I feel he is hitting it on the upswing good swing. On his backswing his hips are in unison with his shoulder alignment.

Why even bother quoting him if you didn't even watch the video. The dude in the video clearly says " His hips LIFT!! in the late part of the downswing". How could you possibly believe that supports your idea of level hips? (BTW that is a rhetorical question, I already know you have no intention of finding factual information or learning anything.)

[saevel25]

 

ust like a proper grip it doesn't guarantee success give someone a perfect grip and a perfect set up and they might slice it because they suck and just are a terrible athlete and aren't likely to succeed at golf 

The grip is not a fundamental either ;)

 

Why even bother quoting him if you didn't even watch the video. The dude in the video clearly says " His hips LIFT!! in the late part of the downswing". How could you possibly believe that supports your idea of level hips? (BTW that is a rhetorical question, I already know you have no intention of finding factual information or learning anything.)

Pretty much. 

 

[Mike Boatright]

Yes he lifts on the downswing this has nothing to do with the back swing and the direct unison of the hips and shoulders from the start. He lifts because he snaps his left leg a bit at impact and hits on the upswing. This is now off topic and is only one example from a young player and yes I watched the video. Look at lee here great player not a skinny young kid and about as simple as it can get.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYjLjwt8aqI

Edited October 11, 2015 by Mike Boatright

[saevel25]

Look at lee here great player not a skinny young kid and about as simple as it can get.

What is Lee doing you want us to look at?

His hips and shoulders turn on an incline. There is no level about it. 

[Mike Boatright]

 

What is Lee doing you want us to look at?

His hips and shoulders turn on an incline. There is no level about it. 

 

Agree disagree it's about as level and in unison as it can get. Compared to Justin Thomas Lee has a more traditional swing for consistency. It's great you have an opinion but show some facts or rebuttal instead of just disagreeing for the sake of it.

[Mr. Desmond]

Ugh! 

You mentioned a full and level hip turn.

It is ... NOT.

If you look, during the backswing, the back hip raises up relative to the front hip, and on the downswing, the front hip raises up relative to the back hip as the pelvis is thrust upwards.

As to the original topic of the thread, your shoulder/hip alignment is not a fundamental -- but I do like my hips and shoulders square at the beginning of the swing as I feel like my swing will start towards the inside, instead of out and then in. So it helps me. But it's not for everyone.

 

 

Agree disagree it's about as level and in unison as it can get. Compared to Justin Thomas Lee has a more traditional swing for consistency. It's great you have an opinion but show some facts or rebuttal instead of just disagreeing for the sake of it.

The facts are in the video.

You may have good results with your swing, but I don't think you understand the swing, although many here have tried to assist you. Instead of resisting, maybe you should try being receptive.

 

Edited October 11, 2015 by Mr. Desmond