Wrist cocking as a backswing trigger? Good or bad?

[hack2scratch]

I have this tendency to cock my wrist to start my takeaway/backswing. Is this something i should probably get rid of?

I would address the ball, waggle a few times, by turning my left hand inward ( club point to the back, and the butt of the club will point to the target) on my third waggle, i would just leave it there instead of returning to address and then turn my shoulders until my hips start turning and and my left knee will flex. (like a baseball swing)

When i do this, i hit the ball straight and square. But the club head goes behind my body fairly quickly.

When i forget to do this, i noticed i dont have a wrist hinge when my left arm is parallel and i will fade or slice the ball. And i will try to make a wrist hinge somewhere on the way up and the whole swing falls apart and i'll thin or fat it.

 

Does anyone else do this wrist cock thing? It's like a trigger for me... My tempo and swing speed is smooth and rhythimic but when i'm watching everyone's review and videos, no one does this. Maybe i am compensating for something?

[iacas]

Some people do it, but if you're re-routing the club and continuing to swing it well behind you, you're probably compensating. Your good shots are probably pulls, so the path is still probably well left, and you're probably just leaving the face open to the path (still possibly even left of the target, or square to it) on the swings where you fade and "don't do it" (that waggle).

You should start a Member Swing thread or at least film yourself to see what you're actually doing.

[hack2scratch]

2 hours ago, iacas said:

Some people do it, but if you're re-routing the club and continuing to swing it well behind you, you're probably compensating. Your good shots are probably pulls, so the path is still probably well left, and you're probably just leaving the face open to the path (still possibly even left of the target, or square to it) on the swings where you fade and "don't do it" (that waggle).

You should start a Member Swing thread or at least film yourself to see what you're actually doing.

hmm... my good shots where i the club feels like butter and everything feels right, the ball does pull left of target. I was always wondering why it felt so good but went left of target.

i will set up a filming area and start a thread. thanks!

 

[70sSanO]

Nick Faldo promoted a drill that sets wrist initially.  I've used the drill even on the course for a while.  I believe the purpose was to get the correct path on the backswing.

I believe Nick Price incorporated an early wrist set.

Not sure how you are rolling the left wrist, but the Faldo video shows his method.

John

[hack2scratch]

9 minutes ago, 70sSanO said:

Nick Faldo promoted a drill that sets wrist initially.  I've used the drill even on the course for a while.  I believe the purpose was to get the correct path on the backswing.

I believe Nick Price incorporated an early wrist set.

Not sure how you are rolling the left wrist, but the Faldo video shows his method.

John

I just watched Nick faldo's video. That is exactly how I do it...  If its only a drill are you suppose to do it on the course?

 

I never see anyone else do it but me and people have asked why I do it. 

 

Not even sure how I developed it. I think it must be from my waggle. I pre set it twice and on the third time I hold in preset and  I start the back swing.

[Ernest Jones]

I played around with this a few years back. Helped keep things on line, but I found I was losing speed and hence, distance. 

YMMV

[70sSanO]

15 hours ago, hack2scratch said:

I just watched Nick faldo's video. That is exactly how I do it...  If its only a drill are you suppose to do it on the course?

 

I never see anyone else do it but me and people have asked why I do it. 

 

Not even sure how I developed it. I think it must be from my waggle. I pre set it twice and on the third time I hold in preset and  I start the back swing.

I believe the idea is to incorporating the drill into the normal backswing, but not from a deliberate already cocked position.

In practice I think you would set the wrist early as you bring the club away from the ball.

I did use the drill on the course for a few rounds, but with an already short backswing, it was tough to develop a good rhythm.  It did help to keep the club from going too inside on my backswing.  Without the deliberate move I found it difficult to set the wrist that early, but it did make me more aware to not pulling the club inside even without the early wrist set.

John

[Groucho Valentine]

I do it too. I slightly push my wrists forward and push of my right instep before i take everything back. I didn't even know i did it until a friend took a phone video of me swinging a couple of years ago. So its not necessarily a bad thing. But routing the club behind you with your hands can lead to some issues. Its hard to say without posting a video, as iaccas said.

[Ernest Jones]

20 hours ago, Ernest Jones said:

I played around with this a few years back. Helped keep things on line, but I found I was losing speed and hence, distance. 

YMMV

 

Just to add to this, make sure you don't fall into any attempt to "hold" anything: lag, angles etc... 

[Hacker James]

then there is "Lefty"......Hinge n Hold...

[Ernest Jones]

13 minutes ago, Hacker James said:

then there is "Lefty"......Hinge n Hold...

Which he doesn't do...feel ain't real.

[Hacker James]

On 11/6/2016 at 6:48 AM, hack2scratch said:

I have this tendency to cock my wrist to start my takeaway/backswing. Is this something i should probably get rid of?

I would address the ball, waggle a few times, by turning my left hand inward ( club point to the back, and the butt of the club will point to the target) on my third waggle, i would just leave it there instead of returning to address and then turn my shoulders until my hips start turning and and my left knee will flex. (like a baseball swing)

When i do this, i hit the ball straight and square. But the club head goes behind my body fairly quickly.

When i forget to do this, i noticed i dont have a wrist hinge when my left arm is parallel and i will fade or slice the ball. And i will try to make a wrist hinge somewhere on the way up and the whole swing falls apart and i'll thin or fat it.

 

Does anyone else do this wrist cock thing? It's like a trigger for me... My tempo and swing speed is smooth and rhythimic but when i'm watching everyone's review and videos, no one does this. Maybe i am compensating for something?

Regarding a preliminary wrist cock... If you google "hinge and hold" there are several videos by Phil as well as from Clay Ballard explaining just what Phil does and what he "thinks" he does. In Phil's case, he is talking about "chipping" rather than full swings. He does "hinge", he does "Hold" (up to a point) as can be verified by pausing the video.. The "feel" is real (to him). HOWEVER, and as Clay and Phil both point out, that although it is held up to impact, that as body rotation continues ,the hinge part is returned to a flat wrist, and the club is an extension of his arm after impact.  He, (Phil) further explains that he is accelerating through impact.  Now how that applies to what you are speaking, it may or may not be of benefit, a lot would have to do with whatever else is going on as others have already pointed out and suggest you post a video.  One thing you do "not" want to do, is to introduce "tension" in your arms, and if trying to "hold" does this, then it is not beneficial. 

For me, the Hinge and Hold is something that works in green approaches i.e. chips, but depends on the situation. Other times, I might use a "paint brush" (feel), or simply rotate back and through. My short game is decent. Putting is improving.

Getting back to your original ascertion, you said yourself that it produces good results, but you are left of target which indicates something else is going on. Therefore, it does not appear to be hurting you (as a trigger). I don't know if you are one that follows or adheres to Hogan's fundamentals, but his routine and waggle are much of the same thing (not exactly) but as a rehearsal for the shot. Other prominent instructors say similar things. Touch 1, Touch 2, swing through. 

[hack2scratch]

I do follow hogan's principals and also incorporate some jack Nicklaus techniques. I found them to be very similar.

I also do the hinge and hold for chip shots. I was taught this by the club pro on a course lesson, to use it when i need to get over an obstacle and just go 3 inches back 3 inches forward with the hinge and hold. He also showed me the bump and run, but i like making the ball pop up on to the green. I have tons of fun doing it and do pretty well on short game and putting. My long game is terrible.

Driver - woods - hybrids - 5 iron all does a slice. I can not hit anything longer than 150 yards. But within 150 yards, i'm very relaxed and confident. (Must be all the pitch and putt, I've practiced on)

I've looking up some taking video 101s, so that i can set up my iphone on the range to take a video of my swing. I will post some soon.

 

 

[Buckeyebowman]

Many, many moons ago I used to do this with the Driver. I'd "preset" my wrist cock with the clubhead a foot and a half to two feet behind the ball. Then I'd just take it back to the top and explode through impact. I used to smash the crap out of the ball!

I honestly don't know why I stopped doing that. Maybe it just quit working for me, or it could have been peer pressure. "Hey! Look at the guy with the goofy swing!" But I did.

Lately I've been working trying to restore my backswing, which had shrunk to next to nothing. When I'm successful at it, I can't help but notice the "bent back" position of my right wrist, and feeling the weight of the clubhead in my right hand at the top of backswing.

I don't know if this mimics the old preset routine, but it kinda, sorta "feels" like it!

Edited November 8, 2016 by Buckeyebowman

[70sSanO]

This thread has piqued my interest again and there is a thread on another site that goes into more depth on rotating the left arm.

I have yet to even hit a ball but rotating the left arm when setting the wrist seems to make it easier to incorporate the drill into a more fluid backswing and not the rotate-stop-start backswing in the drill.  For all I know it may produce nothing but shanks, but in the mirror the club head direction appears to be in the correct position at the top of the swing.

John

[Hacker James]

@Buckeyebowman  Not all that goofy. Fred Couples used to set up about 8 inches behind the ball and hovered. He did not preset the wrist or anything however. I do not remember what his rationale was or if he still does it. 

[RussUK]

@hack2scratch check out a slow mo of Danny Willett's swing. He starts by cocking the wrists. He does say he takes the club back by cocking, not rolling, the wrists.

It's done ok for him so far (we'll ignore his brother for now )

[hack2scratch]

just made a member swing thread... see below. hope the videos are good. first time recording and i think V1 distorted the quality.