The Dan Plan - 10,000 Hours to Become a Pro Golfer (Dan McLaughlin)

[brttaylor]

Well said.  The 10K hour was a retrospective study of successful people.

It can't be concluded that dedicating 10K hours will get you that result.

The Talent Code by Dan Coyle is a great book that uses real life talent hotbeds and real people and places and experiences to clarify "talent".  It is not born but it is created, developed, and learned.  Awesome book by the way!

[RetroJFrancisco]

Originally Posted by brttaylor

Well said.  The 10K hour was a retrospective study of successful people.

It can't be concluded that dedicating 10K hours will get you that result.

The Talent Code by Dan Coyle is a great book that uses real life talent hotbeds and real people and places and experiences to clarify "talent".  It is not born but it is created, developed, and learned.  Awesome book by the way!

I sort of get what you are saying about that talent is learned and as such, but some people practice much more than others to no avail.. And still will not progress as quickly.

[soon_tourpro]

Originally Posted by RetroJFrancisco

I sort of get what you are saying about that talent is learned and as such, but some people practice much more than others to no avail.. And still will not progress as quickly.

Depends how you practice.
Deep practice dosnt guarantee result.

You also need to know what to attend to that makes you better.

(plan/strategy/recipe)

I love to practice for example, I can stand hours and days and hit balls.
However my practice is short, with high intensity and focus due to I make sure I improve in that practice measureable.

The Talent code book dont explain why of 10 people in the tennis class only 1 or 2 or maybe none makes it to the tennis tours....
or why one class has 3 that succeed, and Daniel coyle have no answer to that.

So your point is right, some do practice and have no result even as they follow the deep practice routine.
Unless you have measureable tangible result becoming slightly better when you do so.

As I work with a tour pro its evident when I assist in a change to do it so it works, last time he wanted slightly more consistency so I adjusted his back swing he had for 20 or so years, 1 hour instruction, 2 range sessions and its working as the old one.

I also altered his set up after that and again slightly better. If your making a change, it should work directly and also would be measureable.

The Dan Plan dont do that enough.
That is why he is platueing out.

[clutchshot]

I think practice creates talent and anyone can do whatever they want to do if they put in the hours... With this said, the hrs to become Tiger is starting at 2 and playing for 35 years. Also, you almost need a swing coach to make sure your practice is always correct, that's what the pros have... Best of luck Mr. Dan, at very least, you should get pretty good and have a past time to enjoy for the rest of your life.

[onesome]

Well he just passed 4000 hours and his index is now 7.3, I'll say the weather in the pacific northwest is certainly not the greatest yet and I do expect him to trend back down as the year progresses, it also shows his game is very susceptable to less than perfect conditions and to be fair whose isn't that doesn't have a + index anyways.He needs to break through a consistency barrier in wich hes not going to shoot any worse than a particular score 98% of the time, it's really the only way hes going to start to get comfortable with his game and begin making the improvements to get down to a 2 or 3 by the end of summer and pretty much stay there.

[Unkynd]

I think for him to reach "pro" level, he's going to need a lot more than 10,000 hours.  Getting to a 7.3 after 4,000 hours, I'd say he'll be lucky to be a scratch golfer by 10,000.  Still awesome to watch his progress, and I'm more than a little jealous of his ability to quit his job to just play golf.

[clearwaterms]

Is he getting coaches to make sure that the 10,000 hours he spends are spent doing the most productive things for his game? The original author of the 10,000 hours, Dan Coyle wrote this to describe his latest book [quote] The real lesson of 10K is not about quantity; it’s about quality. It’s about getting the maximum possible gain in the shortest amount of time — and to get that, you don’t focus on the time, but on the gain. You put your focus on improving the practice, which happens two ways: through better methods or increased intensity. [/quote] So does he have any experts telling him what those better methods are?

[soon_tourpro]

Originally Posted by clearwaterms

Is he getting coaches to make sure that the 10,000 hours he spends are spent doing the most productive things for his game?

The original author of the 10,000 hours, Dan Coyle wrote this to describe his latest book

So does he have any experts telling him what those better methods are?

His swing is modern mechanics obviously wont be optimal.

He should be able to hit it 300+ and still is way shorter than that.

he is inconsistent as his trackman numbers show his swing changes in variation to much for each one.

His ability to save himself is good.

but 240 from tee and wild just shows how hard he makes the game.

Intensity isnt the only variable in deep practice or a better method even though a better method allows you more consistency.

he still is technique oriented.

[divot dave]

Originally Posted by Unkynd

I think for him to reach "pro" level, he's going to need a lot more than 10,000 hours.  Getting to a 7.3 after 4,000 hours, I'd say he'll be lucky to be a scratch golfer by 10,000.  Still awesome to watch his progress, and I'm more than a little jealous of his ability to quit his job to just play golf.

I agree... I wonder if he's counting time played on courses as "practice"... I wouldn't do that unless it was an actual "practice" round,  no more than I would count a tournament game of basketball as practice time.

But regardless of that, I'm concerned that his practice time is diluted. I'm pulling for the guy, hoping he'll get as close as he can to his goal, but seems like every week he's running around the country doing interviews, attending conferences, meeting one person or another, then playing a causal round of golf with them and calling that "practice". IMO, I would want to be bunkered down as much as possible, developing consistency, focusing on nothing else other than improving in the game, then doing the PR work after something's been proven. This is merely conjecture, but seems like his devotion may be divided between practice and establishing his network/public profile.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by soon_tourpro

He should be able to hit it 300+ and still is way shorter than that.

You do realize many PGA Tour pros don't hit the ball 300 yards, right?

Originally Posted by soon_tourpro

he still is technique oriented.

And you still speak a lot without saying anything.

[soon_tourpro]

Originally Posted by iacas

You do realize many PGA Tour pros don't hit the ball 300 yards, right?

And you still speak a lot without saying anything.

Of course they dont hit it 300+ with bad mechanics and limited modern swing ideals like S&T; and other such you know x-factor ideas.
Trained by me they would be.
You can hire me if you want but until then I didnt know I needed someones approval to do what I do.
if you want, set up a test, take any tour pro, spend 2 hours with them and tape it, send them to me I do 2 hours with them and tape it and they hit it longer and better with me.
Cant hit it long with such limited mechanics popular out there or accurate for that matter.

Just beacuse they play the tour dont actually mean they know what they are doing.

I met a few and you know confused gets a whole new meaning then.
I just note people dont like the truth out there in golf instruction.

Modern mechanics with his old swing vs new improved mechanics the BMS system from me.
Difference? oh around 80 yards and this guy is trained by me.
350 yard and its that easy. Dan could listen to me actually and learn a thing or two.

[David in FL]

Wow.  Look at that head movement!

I take it you've given up trying to become a tour pro yourself?  Probably a good thing.  Maybe time to change your user name though.  I think that "soon" ship sailed a couple of years ago......

[iacas]

Originally Posted by soon_tourpro

Of course they dont hit it 300+ with bad mechanics and limited modern swing ideals like S&T; and other such you know x-factor ideas.

Yeah, gosh darn their bad mechanics.

And I'm not sure where the S&T; comment comes from, but you clearly haven't been paying attention.

Originally Posted by soon_tourpro

Trained by me they would be.

Uh huh. Good luck with that.

[chriskzoo]

Good luck to this guy - he clearly has no chance to make it as a Tour pro - even with another 6,000 hours.  PGA pro at a local muni?  maybe.

[joshray]

I'm completely jealous of this guy.  I get to go to the range 3-4 days after work, and I thought I had it pretty good.

[14ledo81]

Originally Posted by joshray

I'm completely jealous of this guy.  I get to go to the range 3-4 days after work, and I thought I had it pretty good.

You do have it good...

[clutchshot]

No one has any faith huh? I guess my thought is this could work if you started when you were 5...

[onephenom]

Originally Posted by soon_tourpro

Of course they dont hit it 300+ with bad mechanics and limited modern swing ideals like S&T; and other such you know x-factor ideas.

Trained by me they would be.

You can hire me if you want but until then I didnt know I needed someones approval to do what I do.

if you want, set up a test, take any tour pro, spend 2 hours with them and tape it, send them to me I do 2 hours with them and tape it and they hit it longer and better with me.

Cant hit it long with such limited mechanics popular out there or accurate for that matter.

Just beacuse they play the tour dont actually mean they know what they are doing.

I met a few and you know confused gets a whole new meaning then.

Modern mechanics with his old swing vs new improved mechanics the BMS system from me.

Difference? oh around 80 yards and this guy is trained by me.

350 yard and its that easy. Dan could listen to me actually and learn a thing or two.

Well, that is a pretty convincing video. Pretty huge gain in distance, hitting it in 100 degree weather 50 yards downhill slope and 20 mph downwind.

Some very interesting comments here... "just because they are on tour doesn't mean they know what they are doing"... it's ike saying just because lebron is a pro bball player doesn't mean he knows how to play ball... just because warren buffett is wildly rich doesn't mean he knows how to make money.... huh?

And I would love to see you completely revamp a professionals swing in two hours and add 80 yards. That would be incredible!!!

Back on topic... I still think it can be done. But I don't think he is training correctly.... hours of short game practice every day should have better results. I think he needs to, regardless of what soontourpro says, he needs to adjust the technique. Phil mickelsons short game video is super helpful. The pitching videos here are really helpful... using those techniques (which are extremely similar) with the amount of time he practices should leave to professional quality short game. I'm not sure what thread it was, but erik's thread about practice amount says the same thing... the putting stroke is pretty simple. Pitching motion is pretty similar, just need to learn how to set up differently and how far back to take the swing to hit the right distance and what club to use. So I don't see why his putting and pitching isn't better.

The swing... that's the fu&&&&&&&&&ing; hard part.