Iron set bundling, and why it can be bad.

[onthehunt526]

Iron lofts in the longer irons of most OEMs has decreased so much, that the 3-iron in SGI models is basically a 1-iron...

The way iron sets are bundled, SGI irons and GI irons are 4-GW typically... And Player's irons are 3-PW typically... 

Most OEM's have gotten better about the individual iron price being the set price divided by 8...

Tour Edge this year (for example), pioneering something that should have been done many years ago. Their policy is now you can buy as few as four irons in your iron set, and you'd pay the prorated amount for a four-club set, meaning that an eight-iron set that retails for $600, a four-club set would be $300...

I honestly think this is the way to go, let golfers choose their longest iron and buy down to the pitching wedge, gap wedge or whatever... 

So if I wanted to buy set X, 7-PW, GW, SW for three-quarters of a 4-PW, GW set I could... If I wanted to buy all ten irons in set X, I'd pay the set price, plus 2 individual irons at the set price divided by 8... 

My point is if more average golfer's were to buy only the irons they knew they would use, they would save money, and not have 2 or 3 clubs that never get used.

Fitting is important, Everyone who is an avid golfer should be properly fit, but that is not the topic here...

My point is more OEM's should allow golfers to choose what the longest iron that they purchase should be.. Golfers will be more likely to come back to the same company... The point is would they rather make all their money at once, or just continuously making profit...

@mvmac doesn't PING kind of let you do this when you purchase a full set?

[Mr. Desmond]

Everyone else, I think, does it, too. It's called a special order where you purchase per iron.

Look at www.callawaygolf.com, go to Apex irons, and you can configure a set and get custom shafts, lengths, grips, etc. They have a 3-, 4- 5-, 6-PW set but you can also order single irons at a per iron charge. The single per iron charge is a higher charge. For example, the 6-PW might be $125/iron, whereas a 4i single iron may be $150.

[Patch]

Qualified club fitters can build and sell you any number of  irons you want using components. Same with hybrids, and metal woods. They may not have a big time OEM name stamped on them, but they will play just as well, while being less expensive than the big name stuff. 

[onthehunt526]

7 hours ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Everyone else, I think, does it, too. It's called a special order where you purchase per iron.

Look at www.callawaygolf.com, go to Apex irons, and you can configure a set and get custom shafts, lengths, grips, etc. They have a 3-, 4- 5-, 6-PW set but you can also order single irons at a per iron charge. The single per iron charge is a higher charge. For example, the 6-PW might be $125/iron, whereas a 4i single iron may be $150.

I know Callaway does it... But they gouge the price of individual irons instead of taking set divided by eight... TMaG gouges individual iron prices as well. Where an iron is an iron. TMaG and Cally are all about bundling, they've ALWAYS been that way. 

Tour Edge's new EXI or EXd irons for example, if you buy a set of eight stock from a retailer... You can get 3-PW, 4-PW, AW, or 5-PW, AW, SW and the price is still $600, most online retailers have TE drop ship clubs, but you can special order a 4 iron set for $300, or a ten-iron set for $750, or just a 3-iron for $75... With the CB Pro Tungsten, you can buy a set of eight for $799.99 or buy them individually for $100 a piece... The four-club iron set was started by Tour Edge (their base set is 7-PW).

[caniac6]

My last two sets from Ping started at the 5 iron, and were priced per club.

[Mr. Desmond]

6 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

I know Callaway does it... But they gouge the price of individual irons instead of taking set divided by eight... TMaG gouges individual iron prices as well. Where an iron is an iron. TMaG and Cally are all about bundling, they've ALWAYS been that way. 

Tour Edge's new EXI or EXd irons for example, if you buy a set of eight stock from a retailer... You can get 3-PW, 4-PW, AW, or 5-PW, AW, SW and the price is still $600, most online retailers have TE drop ship clubs, but you can special order a 4 iron set for $300, or a ten-iron set for $750, or just a 3-iron for $75... With the CB Pro Tungsten, you can buy a set of eight for $799.99 or buy them individually for $100 a piece... The four-club iron set was started by Tour Edge (their base set is 7-PW).

Bundling, and Why It Is Good.

Let's be fair about the argument and look at all sides of it. For example, Callaway does offer sets starting from 3i all the way to 6i, and then through PW. Granted, if you want to start at 7-PW, you're probably off buying the 6-PW IF ONLY for trade in value. Tough to trade a 7-PW set. I had a tough time selling a 6-PW set. Even though I rarely use a 5i, I now alway purchase 5-PW so even in a private sale, I can get someone interested. In my experience, big stores and OEMs typically are not interested in a set starting at 6i and above for trade-in.

 

Edited January 5, 2016 by Mr. Desmond

[caniac6]

I never buy golf gear with trade in value in mind. It seems that companies come out with new clubs so often, used clubs don't hold much value.

[Mr. Desmond]

2 hours ago, caniac6 said:

I never buy golf gear with trade in value in mind. It seems that companies come out with new clubs so often, used clubs don't hold much value.

They do not hold much value. But a handful of times during the year, some sites give you a trade in bonus; and in private sales, you can obtain more $$ than a trade-in.

And I do think about the worst that can happen, not being able to sell a 4 iron set if I want. It's called planning. Some people, apparently, don't care, or do not plan or cannot improve their game efficiently to carry a 5 or 6i. That's fine. It's their dollar. Buy what they want. But I think types like the OP are an outlier.

The point I was attempting to make is OEMs give 99% of golfers sufficient bundling options, and if you only want to purchase two or three irons, go to that maker. Apparently, OEM's want to discourage the purchase of single irons by increasing the per iron price for single irons. I think the OP is making a thread about an issue that is not a big deal to most, but apparently a big deal to him. That's fine. Good luck.

Edited January 5, 2016 by Mr. Desmond

[Grumpter]

If I buy a partial set I wouldn't expect the same pricing as buying a full set. It would be nice to get the same price for individual irons but I can see why they would charge more for a smaller sub set.

[onthehunt526]

On 1/5/2016 at 9:27 AM, Mr. Desmond said:

Bundling, and Why It Is Good.

Let's be fair about the argument and look at all sides of it. For example, Callaway does offer sets starting from 3i all the way to 6i, and then through PW. Granted, if you want to start at 7-PW, you're probably off buying the 6-PW IF ONLY for trade in value. Tough to trade a 7-PW set. I had a tough time selling a 6-PW set. Even though I rarely use a 5i, I now alway purchase 5-PW so even in a private sale, I can get someone interested. In my experience, big stores and OEMs typically are not interested in a set starting at 6i and above for trade-in.

 

I'll agree on the trade-in value aspect, @Mr. Desmond. It's not really an issue for me. As I said, it CAN be bad. The trade-in value is one of the cons of buying a partial set.

PING and Titleist (don't quote me on Titleist) charge per club. I'm more of a supporter of that approach. 

My main issue with bundling, that does effect the 99% of golfers that you mentioned, is retailers and some OEMs have most golfers purchasing at least 1 club they will seldom use. (I'm not talking about 2/6 sets which are brilliant)... I'm talking more traditional iron sets, with 4-GW. 

I thought it was better when most GI and SGI iron sets switched from a 3-PW base set to 4-GW... But that was when the 4i was still 23-24° and still vaguely hittable, now you have some 5i with 23-24°... IMHO, Educated consumers like those of us on TST, aren't effected as much... It's the uneducated consumers that get effected. I believe in non-hybrid sets 5-PW, GW, SW would make more sense in the GI/SGI department, 3 and 4 irons have been rendered almost useless to higher handicap.

[mvmac]

On 1/5/2016 at 4:06 PM, onthehunt526 said:

My point is more OEM's should allow golfers to choose what the longest iron that they purchase should be.. Golfers will be more likely to come back to the same company... The point is would they rather make all their money at once, or just continuously making profit...

@mvmac doesn't PING kind of let you do this when you purchase a full set?

I think most OEMs do and have for several years now. Off the top of my head, Mizuno, Titleist, PING, Callaway and TaylorMade. For example with Callaway you could get a BB 4-iron, Apex 5-6 and Apex Pro 7-W if you wanted to.

With PING you don't even need to purchase a full set, you can order/buy one club if you wanted. Same thing with the other companies I mentioned.

http://www.titleist.com/teamtitleist/team-titleist/f/6/t/23524.aspx

[Pretzel]

I purchase the full set (3-PW) of irons because I use the full set of irons. PING gave me the option of any set combination I wanted (I could've left out the 3, 5, 7, and 9 irons from the set if I felt like it) when I ordered the clubs from them.

I think you're confusing the OEM's and the big box stores. Most big box stores will not let you purchase partial sets because they don't want to be left with individual clubs in inventory. Most OEM's will let you customize the set you purchase to a high degree.

[onthehunt526]

13 hours ago, Pretzel said:

I purchase the full set (3-PW) of irons because I use the full set of irons. PING gave me the option of any set combination I wanted (I could've left out the 3, 5, 7, and 9 irons from the set if I felt like it) when I ordered the clubs from them.

I think you're confusing the OEM's and the big box stores. Most big box stores will not let you purchase partial sets because they don't want to be left with individual clubs in inventory. Most OEM's will let you customize the set you purchase to a high degree.

You're right, it is the retailers fault for bundling iron sets... I think the issue is 100% the retailer's fault. 

Retailers, need to allow more drop-shipped custom orders, not less... It's the bigger chains that are at fault...

[Pretzel]

13 minutes ago, onthehunt526 said:

You're right, it is the retailers fault for bundling iron sets... I think the issue is 100% the retailer's fault. 

Retailers, need to allow more drop-shipped custom orders, not less... It's the bigger chains that are at fault...

Usually you can custom order them through the retailer, but you have to specifically ask for it or else they'd rather just send you home with a set of clubs that day (to generate immediate profits). I know I ordered my clubs while I was at the Golfsmith I tested them at, because I would've felt bad for denying a commission to the sales rep who had helped me for a bit over an hour as I tested different clubs and setups.

[dkolo]

On January 5, 2016 at 1:57 PM, Grumpter said:

If I buy a partial set I wouldn't expect the same pricing as buying a full set. It would be nice to get the same price for individual irons but I can see why they would charge more for a smaller sub set.

I went to a pizzeria yesterday. I only wanted one slice but, would you believe it, these pricks charged me more for one slice than just taking the price of a pie and dividing by eight. Gouging bastards. 

[mvmac]

10 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

You're right, it is the retailers fault for bundling iron sets... I think the issue is 100% the retailer's fault. 

I disagree, retailers allow you to mix and match models and you can get individual irons. If you want to order a PING i 7-iron from Golfsmith and have it shipped to your house, you can do that. 

[Lihu]

10 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

You're right, it is the retailers fault for bundling iron sets... I think the issue is 100% the retailer's fault. 

Retailers, need to allow more drop-shipped custom orders, not less... It's the bigger chains that are at fault...

Not so sure that bundling irons is only for profits. It seems like club distance gaps and the feel when swinging is more consistent with a set?

For instance, I tried to use a hybrid set of MP-52 PW to 6i then Ping i20 5i and 4i then a hybrid. The transition from 7i to 6i was funky, and the flights were totally different. I also tried various MP-32 and MP-52 combinations with similar transition issues.

Using a full set of Ping i20, MP-52 or MP-32 the transition problems were eliminated and most of my approaches seem pretty straightforward.

At this point, I use the same type of wedges, the same type of irons from 50 degree to 4i, then a hybrid which has a 20-30 yard gap from the 4i, 3W with another 20-30 yards longer than the hybrid then driver. The irons seems to comfortably cover most normal approaches from 105 to 185 yards assuming very little roll. Unfortunately, this isn't the case with the current dry green and approach conditions.

However, the set of clubs concept seems to work for me regardless of the type of irons I use.

[saevel25]

10 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

Retailers, need to allow more drop-shipped custom orders, not less... It's the bigger chains that are at fault...

I can go to Golfsmith, the largest golf retailer in the USA, and try out as many clubs as I want. I can get fit for the clubs. . Have them fill out a form with what I want to buy. If I need to change the length. If I need to change the shaft on the club and they will send it out and I will have the clubs delivered to the Golfsmith with in a month. That is all can be done at NO extra cost to me as long as the shaft options I need doesn't require an up charge. 

I think things are fine as they are. I think retailers offer a good selection of clubs to those who want to buy what is in stock and to those who want to get something more custom. 

33 minutes ago, mvmac said:

I disagree, retailers allow you to mix and match models and you can get individual irons. If you want to order a PING i 7-iron from Golfsmith and have it shipped to your house, you can do that. 

Agreed. I ordered a Mizuno JPX 850 Pro 4 irons because I didn't like my MP-59 4 iron. I went down to Golfsmith, told them what I wanted and they ordered it for me. They even messed up the golfshaft flex I wanted and re-ordered for me at no extra cost.